Logging into Gmail with old mail clients

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Re: Logging into Gmail with old mail clients

Postby bfcastello » 2019-1-22 @ 18:20

yawetaG wrote:
bfcastello wrote:I gave up on NT 3.51 since it can’t run on DosBox and iDOS 2. Almost thought about going to W95, but I was never a fan of this GUI. I guess that I will really have to set up my rPI3 to run some scripts in the middle.


IIRC, you can switch Windows 95 to use the old Win3.x GUI...


WHAAAAT??? Please share with us!!! Hehehehe
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Re: Logging into Gmail with old mail clients

Postby DosFreak » 2019-1-22 @ 18:22

It's been awhile since I've bothered to use it on 95 and NT4 but the executable is progman.exe
HKLM\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows NT\CurrentVersion\Winlogon (per machine) or HKCU\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows NT\CurrentVersion\Winlogon (per user).

Would be nice if they open source that like they did winfile.
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Re: Logging into Gmail with old mail clients

Postby bfcastello » 2019-1-22 @ 18:25

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Re: Logging into Gmail with old mail clients

Postby bfcastello » 2019-1-23 @ 04:53

keenmaster486 wrote:
bfcastello wrote:To my surprise, it did connect, but google (I tried gmail first) blocked it, it keeps asking me for my authentication.

Did you turn on the "allow legacy apps" thing on your Google account?


You guys wont believe, the script I posted earlier (“legacyweb.net”) WORKS!!

I managed to connect to gmail, it’s downloading my emails right now.... unbelievable

I spent some hours this night trying to figure out what was wrong. I checked each file of this script, re-checked tbe global vars of this script, and then reconfigured. After some painful attempts, it finally connected to Gmail.

F*** YEAH!! Tomorrow I will try to get the web rendering proxy working for the browser. My WFWG 3.11 is back to life hahaha
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Re: Logging into Gmail with old mail clients

Postby keenmaster486 » 2019-1-23 @ 04:54

I'm very interested to know how that web rendering proxy works out.

I wonder whether it actually does anything to web pages that it doesn't have a special script written for.
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Re: Logging into Gmail with old mail clients

Postby bfcastello » 2019-1-23 @ 05:04

I want to open a separate topic about my attempts and my setup. Where should I start?

I also plan to resurrect an old killed notebook, it might still work but the screen is shot down. If I manage to get a VGA display connected, I might install WFWG311 or W95/98 or W2000. It might deserve a topic too.
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Re: Logging into Gmail with old mail clients

Postby roytam1 » 2019-1-23 @ 08:01

DosFreak wrote:It looks like Retrozilla TLS 1.2 is crashes on start for some reason so will need to ask roytam1 about that. Retrozilla 2.1 works fine
viewtopic.php?f=24&t=12102&p=728682#p728682


can't reproduce on both CHT and ENG versions of NT 3.51 here. you need to post Dr.Watson crash log to see whats happening here.
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Re: Logging into Gmail with old mail clients

Postby DosFreak » 2019-1-23 @ 09:24

Thanks roytam1! Will do.

bfcastello that's great!

I'd like to add mail clients to this thread as well if you want to post your results:
viewtopic.php?f=24&t=12102
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Re: Logging into Gmail with old mail clients

Postby keenmaster486 » 2019-1-23 @ 16:21

bfcastello wrote:I want to open a separate topic about my attempts and my setup. Where should I start?

I'd post a topic in the Software section, same as this one.
DosFreak wrote:I'd like to add mail clients to this thread as well if you want to post your results:
viewtopic.php?f=24&t=12102

For reference, my experience shows Outlook Express 5.5 and 6.0 work on Windows 98, while OE 5.0 works on Windows 3.1 if you can get it to connect. Mozilla Thunderbird (can't remember which version) also works on Windows 98 with modern gmail.
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Re: Logging into Gmail with old mail clients

Postby bfcastello » 2019-1-24 @ 01:54

I went to give a quick look on Outlook again.

I noticed that it redownloads any email I delete after reading it. I am on 17/84 emails... *rolleyes*

I think Outlook is unable to see which messages I have read on Gmail... because I have read them all before
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Re: Logging into Gmail with old mail clients

Postby keenmaster486 » 2019-1-24 @ 02:48

Try right-clicking on the folder, going to properties, and telling it to only download the headers, not the bodies of the emails.
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Re: Logging into Gmail with old mail clients

Postby bfcastello » 2019-1-24 @ 03:29

keenmaster486 wrote:Try right-clicking on the folder, going to properties, and telling it to only download the headers, not the bodies of the emails.


I dont have this option (OE 5.0) but I went to Gmail, set POP3 to redownload only the messages received since today. Just a quick dirty fix.
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Re: Logging into Gmail with old mail clients

Postby roytam1 » 2019-1-24 @ 12:55

yawetaG wrote:
bfcastello wrote:I gave up on NT 3.51 since it can’t run on DosBox and iDOS 2. Almost thought about going to W95, but I was never a fan of this GUI. I guess that I will really have to set up my rPI3 to run some scripts in the middle.


IIRC, you can switch Windows 95 to use the old Win3.x GUI...

not the same thing, you can use progman.exe (Program Manager) as your startup shell, but minimizing windows don't becoming icon but a minimized title bar thingy in a corner, no arrows as minimize/maximize button, etc.
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Re: Logging into Gmail with old mail clients

Postby bakemono » 2019-1-26 @ 00:06

Stunnel was mentioned here earlier and I looked into it. But it seems that you need to explicitly configure every host you want to connect to. You can't use it to handle the mandatory TLS while you randomly surf the web in naked TLS-free glory. (Also the latest version only has 64-bit win binaries.) It sounds like legacyweb also uses stunnel?

Proxies are also being mentioned, but do they really handle the encrypted connection to the host while passing unencrypted data to a client? I haven't been able to find a straight answer about this. The only experience I have with proxies is running AnalogX years ago to share an internet connection through parallel or serial cables. So if someone could confirm that this is possible and add some details about how to set it up, that would be much appreciated.

There's a bug in Opera 9 which can lead to a crash during HTTPS negotiation. At first I would put offending domain names in my hosts file to avoid problems, but these days there are too many, and I have to disable images just to browse my regular forums, etc. in case someone embeds something from a third party image hosting service that would cause a crash. It would be great to just point Opera 9 at a proxy server running on my LAN and not have to worry about HTTPS. If the proxy is a local one, then it seems that the encryption would also still be intact on the WAN, of course I'm not using Opera 9 to connect to my bank or any website that requires confidentiality anyway.

It sounds like stunnel does work for connecting to an email server though, so I can be ready for the day when my email provider decides to dump an old TLS version :)
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Re: Logging into Gmail with old mail clients

Postby bfcastello » 2019-1-26 @ 00:26

bakemono wrote:Stunnel was mentioned here earlier and I looked into it. But it seems that you need to explicitly configure every host you want to connect to. You can't use it to handle the mandatory TLS while you randomly surf the web in naked TLS-free glory. (Also the latest version only has 64-bit win binaries.) It sounds like legacyweb also uses stunnel?

Proxies are also being mentioned, but do they really handle the encrypted connection to the host while passing unencrypted data to a client? I haven't been able to find a straight answer about this. The only experience I have with proxies is running AnalogX years ago to share an internet connection through parallel or serial cables. So if someone could confirm that this is possible and add some details about how to set it up, that would be much appreciated.

There's a bug in Opera 9 which can lead to a crash during HTTPS negotiation. At first I would put offending domain names in my hosts file to avoid problems, but these days there are too many, and I have to disable images just to browse my regular forums, etc. in case someone embeds something from a third party image hosting service that would cause a crash. It would be great to just point Opera 9 at a proxy server running on my LAN and not have to worry about HTTPS. If the proxy is a local one, then it seems that the encryption would also still be intact on the WAN, of course I'm not using Opera 9 to connect to my bank or any website that requires confidentiality anyway.

It sounds like stunnel does work for connecting to an email server though, so I can be ready for the day when my email provider decides to dump an old TLS version :)


Legacyweb uses stunnel4 for emails. Basically, while running it on my rPI3, if i wanted to use another email service, I have to repeat the install process of this script. I think that for those old email clients that do not support SMTP auth, you have to set up your login details on the script too.

For web browser it has nothing. Except, a few local pages built using APIs to view data from gmaps, Wikipedia, YouTube... they do not work so I removed them. But they configured the apache server for me so I kept this part working since I might want to set up a local web dev env later.

I wanted to try the web proxy rendering script later. Because I do not think that unless someone can reconfigure the stunnel script to work for both web and email, stunnel will not work for web. A proxy seems to be an easier solution, but not very reliable. My advice is, to check for mobile stripped versions of websites if you can get around the HTTPS problem. For example, CNN has a very mobile stripped version of their website which renders great. I believe facebook also has one, very stripped than current mobile iteration, but without being able to log in (HTTPS) I cannot confirm.

I wanted to use Netscape and Eudora instead of IE and OE, because that’s what I remember to be using when I was a kid. But Netscape crashes more than a F1 McLaren Honda (trying to be funny here) and I cannot remember which version of Eudora I was using. I am not even sure if it was Eudora. Opera crashes a lot too (on WFWG3.11).

At least mIRC works.
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Re: Logging into Gmail with old mail clients

Postby DosFreak » 2019-1-26 @ 01:14

For HTTPS I use a custom HTTPSProxyMII build from MSFN. I run it on whichever Windows host I want and then configure the browser in the old operating system to that proxy and then surf TLS 1.2 sites. Of course TLS 1.2 will work but if the browser doesn't support the page then it's not going to render correctly, Opera 12.02 for 98-ME and Qtweb 3.8.4 for NT4 so far seem to work fine but anything older than 98 and sites will look bad even with Retrozilla 2.1 or Opera 10.63. Web Rendering proxy should fix that but haven't tested it yet.

So far tested on NT 3.51,98,2000

See:
viewtopic.php?f=24&t=12102#p728439

Still looking for a Linux proxy that's as easy to use but this works for now.
Possible candidate: https://mitmproxy.org/
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Re: Logging into Gmail with old mail clients

Postby bfcastello » 2019-1-26 @ 03:47

DosFreak wrote:For HTTPS I use a custom HTTPSProxyMII build from MSFN. I run it on whichever Windows host I want and then configure the browser in the old operating system to that proxy and then surf TLS 1.2 sites. Of course TLS 1.2 will work but if the browser doesn't support the page then it's not going to render correctly, Opera 12.02 for 98-ME and Qtweb 3.8.4 for NT4 so far seem to work fine but anything older than 98 and sites will look bad even with Retrozilla 2.1. Web Rendering proxy should fix that but haven't tested it yet.

So far tested on NT 3.51,98,2000

See:
viewtopic.php?f=24&t=12102#p728439

Still looking for a Linux proxy that's as easy to use but this works for now.
Possible candidate: https://mitmproxy.org/


WRP uses SSLSTRIP, I wonder if we can use something similar.
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Re: Logging into Gmail with old mail clients

Postby gdjacobs » 2019-1-26 @ 04:13

I actually wasn't aware that stunnel could be used in this way (I thought it was more intended for use as a VPN). That's actually really, really cool.
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Re: Logging into Gmail with old mail clients

Postby bfcastello » 2019-1-27 @ 19:38

I tried the wrp script. After a lot of struggle to get it working on my rPI3, I managed to get it working.

Set up the ip of my rPI and port 8080 as the proxy on IE. Then all I had to do is surf the web. Works, but its f***ing slow. I set it up to render JPG with 50% quality yet its slow. I personally think that it would be better to set up something like stunnel with sslstrip for both email and web - I dont know how to do it, if someone know, please post. Then all we need to do is surf mobile version of these webpages, I believe they are faster and better experience.

Also, WRP does not allow us to fill in the forms (like, for example, Facebook login).

EDIT: I managed to set up sslstrip to work. All I had to do is run my previous script (fake ISP) which sets up some iptables rules and sets ip forwarding on. And added another iptables rule for sslstrip. Downloaded sslstrip, ran the python script (sslstrip.py) with some options, set up the proxy on IE again, and BANG! Opens (albeit really slow) some https websites downgraded to http. But does not render them. At least is a step into the right direction. Now I gotta find the stripped down mobile versions of some websites. Gmail has one, but does not work as expected - you can login, but renders badly.
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Re: Logging into Gmail with old mail clients

Postby yawetaG » 2019-1-28 @ 10:59

bfcastello wrote:But does not render them. At least is a step into the right direction. Now I gotta find the stripped down mobile versions of some websites. Gmail has one, but does not work as expected - you can login, but renders badly.


That might remain an issue, as the old web browsers won't support modern CSS and other technologies.

One of the advantages of Opera is that you can separately disable various parts of a website's formatting.

Maybe Lynx is the best option, as it is still maintained: https://lynx.browser.org/ Text-only, of course.
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