Logging into Gmail with old mail clients

Getting old software/games running on older hardware.

Re: Logging into Gmail with old mail clients

Postby wiretap » 2019-1-29 @ 10:40

With Win9x and older, the optimal choice for email is using a client software like Outlook Express, Thunderbird, Eudora, etc. It is farrrr faster than trying to use a website. Just plug in the POP3/IMAP settings, and you can download all your messages within a few seconds and be ready to send/receive new email. The setup only takes around 1-2 minutes.
User avatar
wiretap
Member
 
Posts: 347
Joined: 2018-5-17 @ 08:26
Location: Michigan, USA

Re: Logging into Gmail with old mail clients

Postby yawetaG » 2019-1-29 @ 12:36

wiretap wrote:With Win9x and older, the optimal choice for email is using a client software like Outlook Express, Thunderbird, Eudora, etc. It is farrrr faster than trying to use a website. Just plug in the POP3/IMAP settings, and you can download all your messages within a few seconds and be ready to send/receive new email. The setup only takes around 1-2 minutes.


Did you actually read the thread? Because we know that, except that Google doesn't play nice with older clients, even though they should theoretically work... :confused:
yawetaG
Oldbie
 
Posts: 1349
Joined: 2016-6-14 @ 14:36
Location: Netherlands

Re: Logging into Gmail with old mail clients

Postby bfcastello » 2019-1-29 @ 13:26

I am not trying to use the webmail either. I just tested a few things for curiosity (including the webmail) when I set up sslstrip. Besides, Outlook Express 5.0 works fine on WFWG3.11 if I set up a stunnel on my rPI3 to connect to the gmail server. Perfectly fine for me.

What I am thinking now is how I can access modern sites in todays world with a 30 year old operating system and browser. Actually, since I work as a front-end web designer, I have been thinking that we (designers) should bring back the trend of low-bandwidth websites that existed way before the iPhone. For me, they are the real mobile sites. They use less data, are faster to access. Modern mobile sites use too much resources (bootstrap, jquery, ...) for a start. CNN's low bandwidth version is a prime example of a great low bandwidth site. I am not saying that we should support older technologies, just that the information should come before a beautifully crafted mobile design.

The only thing that is a bit annoying for me (because limitations) is the need to connect through Trumpet Winsock because NE2000 is not included in DOSPad/iDOS2 (a port of DOSBox for iOS, project is on github, from litchie and was abandoned, I think). I had to set up a "fake ISP" on my rPI3 so Winsock could connect to the internet. This is why I can't try the Lynx browser on DOS, unless I do a VM of WFGW on Virtualbox or VMWare, then I would have an emulated network card to play with. I wish someone could try to patch the iOS version for NE2000 emulation then I'd have a bit more of freedom to play with this on my iPad Pro.
"Design isn't just what it looks like and feels like. Design is how it works."
JOBS, Steve.
User avatar
bfcastello
Member
 
Posts: 112
Joined: 2017-9-07 @ 02:39
Location: Catalonia, Spain

Re: Logging into Gmail with old mail clients

Postby root42 » 2019-1-29 @ 13:28

Honestly, the modern browser experience is so powerful that it is basically impossible to correctly render any modern site on a vintage machine with only a handful of megabytes of RAM. What would be more useful would be to do it Opera style: render on some server, then send the image. Or simply use VNC...
Soldering, retro game reviews and more on YouTube and Bonus videos
Me playing games on my 286 and on my Sega MD2 on Twitch
80386DX@25 MHz, 8 MiB RAM, Tseng ET4000 1 MiB, schlae AdLib, PC MIDI Card + SC55MkII, XT CF Lite, OSSC 1.6
User avatar
root42
Oldbie
 
Posts: 984
Joined: 2018-1-27 @ 13:23

Re: Logging into Gmail with old mail clients

Postby bfcastello » 2019-1-29 @ 13:46

root42 wrote:Honestly, the modern browser experience is so powerful that it is basically impossible to correctly render any modern site on a vintage machine with only a handful of megabytes of RAM. What would be more useful would be to do it Opera style: render on some server, then send the image. Or simply use VNC...


Problem with the image is that you cannot use the forms nor view the videos. WRP (Web Rendering Proxy) script does the same thing, but cannot fill the forms or play videos.

I don't mind the videos really but the forms...
"Design isn't just what it looks like and feels like. Design is how it works."
JOBS, Steve.
User avatar
bfcastello
Member
 
Posts: 112
Joined: 2017-9-07 @ 02:39
Location: Catalonia, Spain

Re: Logging into Gmail with old mail clients

Postby yawetaG » 2019-1-29 @ 16:10

bfcastello wrote:
root42 wrote:Honestly, the modern browser experience is so powerful that it is basically impossible to correctly render any modern site on a vintage machine with only a handful of megabytes of RAM. What would be more useful would be to do it Opera style: render on some server, then send the image. Or simply use VNC...


Problem with the image is that you cannot use the forms nor view the videos. WRP (Web Rendering Proxy) script does the same thing, but cannot fill the forms or play videos.

I don't mind the videos really but the forms...


I don't think you could play the videos even if they were to load. Modern web-video requires a fast connection and system because of the high resolutions. On top of that, old systems often lack the codecs and hardware support to decode and play the videos...

For the forms, it really depends which technology was used to implement them. CGI forms will work, but anything newer may either show up very broken, or fail at submission.

FWIW, you will even encounter those issues on fairly recent systems...
yawetaG
Oldbie
 
Posts: 1349
Joined: 2016-6-14 @ 14:36
Location: Netherlands

Re: Logging into Gmail with old mail clients

Postby bfcastello » 2019-1-29 @ 16:59

yawetaG wrote:
bfcastello wrote:
root42 wrote:Honestly, the modern browser experience is so powerful that it is basically impossible to correctly render any modern site on a vintage machine with only a handful of megabytes of RAM. What would be more useful would be to do it Opera style: render on some server, then send the image. Or simply use VNC...


Problem with the image is that you cannot use the forms nor view the videos. WRP (Web Rendering Proxy) script does the same thing, but cannot fill the forms or play videos.

I don't mind the videos really but the forms...


I don't think you could play the videos even if they were to load. Modern web-video requires a fast connection and system because of the high resolutions. On top of that, old systems often lack the codecs and hardware support to decode and play the videos...

For the forms, it really depends which technology was used to implement them. CGI forms will work, but anything newer may either show up very broken, or fail at submission.

FWIW, you will even encounter those issues on fairly recent systems...


Yeah, I know. You're right.

Time to review what exactly I want to do with the browsers here. For emails, I am already set up with Outlook Express (but I recall myself using other client, probably Eudora, when I was a kid.)

Let me think... back in early 90's, what exactly I was doing on the Internet, as a kid?

I only had access to Internet when I had W95 in an Acer Extensa 710T notebook. And it was quite impressive for that time. Apart of using mIRC, I used to visit numerous websites, (a big number of them were for the Grand Prix 2 game downloads) but for now, I think that I would be better using the WRP script to visit only news pages. Back then (early 90's ) we didn't had Youtube (they would come only 15 years later), Facebook (2002?), Google (98'), and many other modern websites. I think Yahoo! was around, as well as Amazon. We could compile a list of websites that existed back then, and check for whether it's worth to visit them on older browsers or not.

Using a sslstrip proxy, Vogons forums renders very slow and quite badly on IE5 if not using WRP. (WRP renders an image of the forum, but I cannot post).

For example, for CNN's low bandwidth version, I need to put an exception for the proxy on IE (if using WRP) to stop it and allow the original page, for a faster loading of this page in particular. But none of the exceptions are working - dunno why, I might be declaring them wrong on IE.

To sum up:
- Internet (using an script I found that simulates an ISP for Trumpet Winsock to connect);
- Emails with Outlook (using stunnel script on rPI3);
- Web browser: Only news pages (using Web Rendering Proxy script on rPI3);
- mIRC (works out of the box);
- develop low-bandwidth and stripped-down websites (using the rPI3's web server, accessing through FTP) and test them on IE5;

This would probably be an experience reasonably close to what I had years ago. I accept suggestions (for other types of websites to visit)!

EDIT: I actually managed to fix the proxy exception list. Turns out that an iptables rule I made for SSLStrip was “stopping the show”. I removed it, rebooted everything and everything is working again. Using WRP to visit the pages, with exceptions added for google (search) and CNN (low-bandwidth version).
"Design isn't just what it looks like and feels like. Design is how it works."
JOBS, Steve.
User avatar
bfcastello
Member
 
Posts: 112
Joined: 2017-9-07 @ 02:39
Location: Catalonia, Spain

Re: Logging into Gmail with old mail clients

Postby bfcastello » 2019-2-05 @ 22:45

After a few days exploring, I have only one issue with Outlook Express:

- It is always downloading all mails I had since the day I authorized less secure apps. Unless I go to gmail website in another machine and tick the checkbox “Enable POP only for mail that arrives from now on”, it downloads all mail from now on. I am not sure how to fix this permanently.

- It is also downloading some mails I sent during the same period above. I can set a rule for Outlook to not download them, but I would rather not need it or just be able to set a rule to have them on a folder named “Sent mails” . However I am unable to choose the default outlook Sent mails folder. I think I have to create a custom one. Damn.

Some emails (like the one I receive from an university in Barcelona) can crash Outlook and send you straight to the MS DOS. Funny. But this situation is very rare and only happened me twice with the same email I mentioned above.

Web browsing is also impossible on some modern sites unless I use the Web Rendering Proxy script. But the loading of these images is also bloody slow. I think it can be faster, I just need to set up the script to render GIF or JPG with lower quality. But how much quality is enough for a decent view?

I know the experience with the setup of Win 3.11 is miles better on Virtualbox or VMWare, but I am often using my iPad Pro, not my Hackintosh (a Dell laptop running macOS/Win10). I wish I could have NE2000 patch working in any of my environments, then it would not be so annoying to set up two scripts on my rPI3 just to make it connect to the internet. Someone needs to update the DOSPad/iDOS2 app with this patch (I know that there are some iOS apps for packet capturing out there, so technically its possible to run a version of DosBox-X for iDOS2 with NE2000 patched in. I just don’t know/don’t have the knowledge to do it). Would be pretty awesome to run a complete experience of my old first machine on my iPad Pro, anywhere and when I want. I don’t want to bring my hackintosh with me to everywhere...
"Design isn't just what it looks like and feels like. Design is how it works."
JOBS, Steve.
User avatar
bfcastello
Member
 
Posts: 112
Joined: 2017-9-07 @ 02:39
Location: Catalonia, Spain

Re: Logging into Gmail with old mail clients

Postby keenmaster486 » 2019-2-05 @ 22:48

I use IMAP when logging in to Gmail. When using POP I do run into issues like that. With IMAP it downloads the headers and not the bodies of the emails - but you do have to go into the folder settings and uncheck the box that says to download all the bodies.
I flermmed the plootash just like you asked.

http://classictechnology.herokuapp.com
Vintage desktops: Pentium/MMX 200 (Win95), 286-12 (MS-DOS 5.0)
Vintage laptops: IBM Thinkpad A20m, IBM Thinkpad 560X, IBM Thinkpad 365CD
User avatar
keenmaster486
Oldbie
 
Posts: 1615
Joined: 2016-2-16 @ 02:04
Location: Atroxus

Re: Logging into Gmail with old mail clients

Postby bfcastello » 2019-2-05 @ 23:45

If the script I found (legacyweb) allowed me to use the IMAP instead of POP, I could try it. It’s the script that allows me to connect to Gmail through stunnel using WFWG 3.11 and Outlook 5.0. But thanks for the suggestion - I might do that when I decide to run a W95/W98 machine.
"Design isn't just what it looks like and feels like. Design is how it works."
JOBS, Steve.
User avatar
bfcastello
Member
 
Posts: 112
Joined: 2017-9-07 @ 02:39
Location: Catalonia, Spain

Previous

Return to Software

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest