VOGONS


First post, by keenmaster486

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I have two Thinkpads that I am trying to figure out what to do with:

560X
Specs: Pentium MMX/233, 96 MB RAM, 128 GB compact flash

600E
Specs: Pentium III 500 MHz (yes, I upgraded it), 544 MB RAM, 64 GB SSD

I have been using them with Windows 98 - 98Lite with the shell swap on the 560X, to be precise. However, Win98 has some issues; namely, stability. It seems to slowly "gum up" over time as you use it, for one thing, which seems to be par for the course with the 9x family, but regardless, it just behaves slightly inconsistently over time which leads to a general feeling of instability even when it isn't crashing, which it also does from time to time.

I'm looking into NT-based OS's, then. Here's what I need the OS to be able to do:

  • Word processing with a minimum of MS Office 97
  • Some games but not necessarily very demanding ones since these laptops have crappy video chips with low memory; even the 600E only has 2.5 MB of video RAM with no 3D support.
  • Run software that can play MPEG videos and stream them, VLC is a possibility in addition to Windows Media Player or Media Player Classic
  • Basic web browsing with a maximum of RetroZilla
  • Drivers for PCMCIA WiFi cards (could be any card)
  • Be stable enough that I can run it for hours with no noticeable slowdowns, crashes, or sloppy memory management
  • Be able to run development software such as Open Watcom or Visual Basic
  • Be a snappy and fast OS overall on the particular machine, including having a low RAM footprint (50MB is about my benchmark as that's as low as I can get Win98SE to go at idle after a clean reboot. Less is better if possible, especially on the 560X as it only has 96MB)

The OS's I'm looking at are:

  • NT 3.51 w/all SP's
  • NT 4.0 w/all SP's
  • 2000 SP4
  • XP SP3

I have tried XP SP3 on the 600E already, and it works fine, but is not really snappy. Nothing particularly wrong with it; it just feels pretty slow to respond compared with Windows 98 and especially compared with Windows 95.

Any thoughts or advice?

World's foremost 486 enjoyer.

Reply 1 of 7, by Tricia McMillan

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If you want to go online with Wifi you'll need XPSP3 or XPSP2 plus the patch kb????? for WPA2. Afaik (not sure) the older OSs are limited to WPA1 = do'nt work. XP is 100% stable and runs (more or less) fast on systems with +256MB RAM (i've had one before) but it is HD-swaping a lot. This should'nt be a problem for your SSD, but your CPU is really slow. You probably know this, i type it anyway: Do'nt update IE6 to 8, re. videos forget MediaPlayer: If VLC is too heavy, try SPlayer, for mp3 old WinAmp (i use v 5.08) is best, if you switch off the XP-themes, "active-desktop" and 10 (or so) *services* nobody needs, XP becomes a lot more *snappy*.

edit, i forgot: Try OpenOffice 3.2 (2009 or 2010), works fine.

I'm lking fr sme sftware that extracts the ""-buttn f my keybard frm the dustbag f my vacuum-cleaner...

Reply 2 of 7, by Jo22

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Tricia McMillan wrote:

runs (more or less) fast on systems with +256MB RAM (i've had one before) but it is HD-swaping a lot.

I'd recommend having at least 128MiB more (= 384MiB) if running XP SP1. Back in the day when our family had got a Pentium III (~733MHz ?) there was a noticable improvement in speed in comparison to 256MiB.
Another improvement occured at 768MiB, btw. And 2GiB+ on our later Athlon PCs (running XP SP2). 😀

Speaking of memory limits, XP SP2 x86 can handle about up to 3,5 GiB just fine depending on
video card memory and things like the actual configuration of the PCI address space (just below 4GiB). 😀

"Time, it seems, doesn't flow. For some it's fast, for some it's slow.
In what to one race is no time at all, another race can rise and fall..." - The Minstrel

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Reply 3 of 7, by Tricia McMillan

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OK, the 560 is too weak, but the 600E has enaugh RAM = 544 MB. I'm currently on 512MB, when XP has started and is idle, i still got 320 MB left = sufficient for everything i'm doing here. If you really got 64 GB SSD, swapping is no issue (SSD = rocket), but i'd like to mention my experience for *normal* hds: The old recommendation by MS (and virtually everybody) to use 100% to 150% of RAM as swapfile is wrong. When low on memory, XP shifts itself to hd - what is good. But as soon as there is more free RAM, it should swap it's memory back - which it does the less, the bigger the swapfile is. With a really big one, it does'nt swap back at all = your hd keeps hding all the time = swapswapswapswapswap... I'm using 256 MB = 50% which has proofed to be fastest.

P.S.: If the little red rubber cap of the mouse-stick (i've forgotten the IBM-term for it) is loose, it can be fixed with a very little drop of super-glue.

Last edited by Tricia McMillan on 2019-07-16, 13:37. Edited 1 time in total.

I'm lking fr sme sftware that extracts the ""-buttn f my keybard frm the dustbag f my vacuum-cleaner...

Reply 4 of 7, by dr_st

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The 600E would be fine with XP, but probably better with 2K. 560X is so old that I have no idea. The versions of Windows that tend to run best on laptops are the versions that were mainstream when the laptops were released, as there would be more/better drivers available for the hardware.

Some WiFi vendors (e.g., RaLink) have working WPA2 support pre-XP, if you use their utility.

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Reply 6 of 7, by keenmaster486

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Honestly at this point I am leaning towards 2000 on the 600E, and NT 3.51 / NT 4.0 partitions on the 560X in addition to the current lineup of DOS, Win95, and Win98SE. I'm only going ham on the boot options with the 560X because I have this gigantic 128 GB drive in it.

I will make some follow up posts on my progress.

World's foremost 486 enjoyer.

Reply 7 of 7, by keenmaster486

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A preliminary report:

I have installed Windows 2000 Pro SP4 on the Thinkpad 600E. So far I am very impressed. It is snappy and responsive, and all of the software I have tried on it seems to run just as fast or faster than it did on 98SE. So far I have installed RetroZilla, VLC, WMP9, 7-Zip, and the PowerLeap CPU Control Panel to re-enable the L2 cache on the CPU... since it is an upgraded Pentium III and the 600E won't boot with one of those unless you disable L2 in the BIOS.

It seems to be faster on the network too. I was getting close to 2000 kbps download speed over the WiFi from my local FTP server, as opposed to a max of about 700-ish on 98SE. RetroZilla loads pages fast and seems to work well.

Everything is nice and stable. I played some videos with VLC, and they were fast and didn't slow to a crawl slowly over time like they did on 98SE. Did have to enable L2 cache to get them to play smoothly, though.

So far, so good with the 600E. But the 560X is another story. Since it doesn't have a CD drive, I am somewhat limited. I thought I'd install NT 3.51 via floppy disks, but there are 22 of those disk images, and most of them are that weird extended capacity format, and not the standard 1.44 MB. I'm going to have to figure out something else. I have a PCMCIA CD drive, but it is missing a power adapter. Maybe I can find one somewhere and get it working, in which case I could install either NT 3.51 or NT 4.0, or maybe both. We will see. Part of me also wonders how Windows 2000 would perform on the 560X.

World's foremost 486 enjoyer.