VOGONS


First post, by alsgeeklab

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Hi,
I HAVE:
IBM 5162 286 @6MHz
640K onboard RAM
8192MB via AST Rampage/286 16-bit card

I WANT:
The ability to run DesqView so that it will task-swap appropriately, and use as much memory as it needs to achieve this task.

THE PROBLEM & DIAGNOSIS SO FAR:
1) I can't seem to get DesqView to recognize the RAM. In an ideal world, I'd have 4096 MB of RAM on my Rampage to XMS and 4096 to EMS, but configuring it that way went into the too hard basket, and from what I've read, DV doesn't understand XMS at all, so I've gone with all EMS for now. This adds a further complication that I now can't have DOS & device drivers loaded high as I can't load HIMEM.SYS (I must use the LIM4.0 EMS driver from AST - REMM.SYS), meaning less conventional RAM. Generally, the lack of ability to task-swap at this stage, I'd say, is due to the lack of RAM.
2) MEM /C shows 8192 of EMS, so I know the EMS is there.
3) I've re-setup DV umpteen times to see if that's the issue. No dice.
4) I've read a forum post that says you have to remove as much of your system's on-board RAM as possible (i.e. take it down to 256K, so that DV can re-page the area between 256K-640K into EMS), which I though seemed a bit extreme. But I tried changing the CMOS settings to go down to 256K, but the machine is cleverer than me, and saw 640K anyways, so I'd physically have to de-solder some of the RAM if I wanted to test this theory. Not something I'm going to do unless I know that's the right thing to do. Anyone had to resort to this measure?
5) is there a better solution to task-swap on my 286 machine? Ideally I want to be able to run Word/First Choice (both require approx 500K RAM) and 1 other application concurrently. They don't need to be multi-tasking, just task-swapping, so I can cleanly go from task to task. I didn't think it was such a big deal, but it seems to be super hard on a 286 or less class machine. DOSSHELL has task-swapping, but it's incredibly slow and doesn't support XMS/EMS, so it's pretty-much useless, TopView seems like garbage, so I couldn't even get as far as figuring out how the damned thing worked, MS-Windows (including 3.0) is a crash-inducing hell and is overkill really for what I need.. I'd reckon the apps I want should be fairly well behaved DOS apps, but who knows.

Anyways, if one person out there ever task-swapped on 286 class PC's and reads this, I'd be eternally grateful to you if you could answer my question! I know people did this stuff for BBSes back in the day on 286s!

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Reply 1 of 4, by weedeewee

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alsgeeklab wrote on 2023-11-05, 08:58:
... 8192MB via AST Rampage/286 16-bit card ... 1) I can't seem to get DesqView to recognize the RAM. In an ideal world, I'd have […]
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...
8192MB via AST Rampage/286 16-bit card
...
1) I can't seem to get DesqView to recognize the RAM. In an ideal world, I'd have 4096 MB of RAM on my Rampage to XMS and 4096 to EMS, but configuring it that way went into the too hard basket, and from what I've read, DV doesn't
...

Just an FYI, it's KiloByte. Not MegaByte.

No idea about the taskswitching/desqview/memory problem though.

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Reply 2 of 4, by Jo22

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I don't lnow for sure what to recommend, either.

However, I would check both the user manuals for DESQView and the AST Rampage.

Period-correct documents often still describe things in the correct way.

Edit: I'm sorry that I can't help in a better way here.
I do have all the necessary hardware in principle, but no free space at home to set things up. 😔

Best I could currently do is to try things in emulation.
There's one 286 machine setup in PCem that has chipset EMS, but it's not the right type.
The driver is LIM4, but the hardware is EMS 3.2 (64KB page frame, no backfilling)..

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In what to one race is no time at all, another race can rise and fall..." - The Minstrel

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Reply 3 of 4, by doshea

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Sorry, I've never tried the following program, but I think I remember reading about it previously - the name rings a bell. Hopefully the system requirements are accurate, because it sounds like you'd probably meet them - it doesn't say it needs a 386 or anything.


#2641 BACK & FORTH PROFESSIONAL 1 OF 5

DISK-NUMBER: 2641
DISK-TITLE: BACK & FORTH PROFESSIONAL 1 OF 5
PC-SIG VERSION: S2.00
PROGRAM TITLE: BACK & FORTH PROFESSIONAL
AUTHOR VERSION: 2.00
PROGRAM CATEGORY: UTILITIES

Suggested Registration:
$69.95

Special Requirements:
512k memory, DOS 3.0+, and EMS, XMS, RAM disk or hard disk.

BACK & FORTH PROFESSIONAL is a versatile program management tool that
gives you the power to load up to 20 programs at once. Now you can
switch between your favorite word processor, database, graphics program,
and TSR utilities at will without having to exit one to open and use
another. Its features include:

~ Delivers a flexible task management environment where up to 20
programs may be open in memory, with each provided as much memory as
needed.

~ Occupies only 23-40k of memory, less than 1k if loaded high.

~ Offers an easy-to-use, colorful, & customizable environment.

~ Supports CGA, EGA, Hercules, VGA, SVGA, and 1024x768 video modes.

~ Enables the use of a Microsoft-compatible mouse.

~ Uses expanded memory (EMS), extended memory, RAM disks, hard disks,
and conventional memory to store swapped programs.

~ Permits you to select the hot keys used to pop up BACK & FORTH, other
B&F commands, and all defined programs.

~ Accepts the definition of 50 programs for use within BACK & FORTH.

~ Provides an alternative menu list for use in defining menus and
programs for use within BACK & FORTH.

~ Runs a selected list of programs automatically when first loaded.

~ Provides a set of desktop accessories that include an address book,
time and event scheduler, graphics screen capture, editor, tape and
RPN calculator.

~ Signals when specific appointments occur. Tasks can also be set to run
at scheduled times using the Overtime! appointment handler.

~ Lets you cut text from a running program and either place it in a
folder for later pasting, print it, or write it to a separate file.

~ Allows you to edit the contents of the cut buffer and save text.

~ Dials a number from the screen if a modem is available.

~ Assigns a sequence of keystrokes to a single macro key for use in
simplifying command execution within a program or DOS.

~ Replaces special abbreviations with commonly-used words, names, and
phrases to save typing time.

~ Permits color customization where you can choose the colors that suits
your tastes rather than someone else's. Supports all video modes
provided by UltraVision.

~ Switches the [Ctrl] and [Caps Lock] keys.

I found this because I have https://archive.org/details/cdrom-pcsig13 and searched its WordCruncher database, or maybe it was the same database but from some floppies I got back in the day.

This is from PC-SIG, so it's reputable. You'd need to get these files to get the 5 disks:

http://cd.textfiles.com/pcsig13/UTI/DISK2641.ZIP
http://cd.textfiles.com/pcsig13/UTI/DISK2642.ZIP
http://cd.textfiles.com/pcsig13/UTI/DISK2937.ZIP
http://cd.textfiles.com/pcsig13/UTI/DISK2938.ZIP
http://cd.textfiles.com/pcsig13/UTI/DISK2939.ZIP

or you could pull them from the CD I linked above.

Given that the disk numbers aren't all consecutive, I guess some older PC-SIG CD-ROMs might have older, smaller versions of the program.

Unfortunately it's possible that it might have registration nags or something.

I also saw mention of a program called "Software Carousel" which sounded like it was similar, but it wasn't on PC-SIG, I gather it was commercial from a quick search.

Reply 4 of 4, by alsgeeklab

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Thanks doshea, I'll give it a try. I downloaded the cd.textfiles.com stuff but when unzipping it said that the archives were broken, so I'm downloading the ISO now, hopefully better luck there.

I recall hearing about Software Carousel the last time I went down this rabbit hole, but I either couldn't find a download to it, or it didn't work. This has not been an easy journey, but it's one I keep going back to in hope that it is possible, because fundamentally, it certainly should be.. even with the somewhat handicapped 80286!

Cheers,
Al

Al's Geeek Lab - The YouTube channel for retro reviews, tech topics, informative infosec and other geeky goodness!
https://www.youtube.com/alsgeeklab
Social Media: https://linktr.ee/alsgeeklab