This thread seems to be for discussion on creation and sharing of a package for so called "abandonware" which isn't allowed here.
If so this should be discussed somewhere else than vogons.
Thanks

DosFreak wrote on 2024-02-25, 01:38:

This thread seems to be for discussion on creation and sharing of a package for so called "abandonware" which isn't allowed here.
If so this should be discussed somewhere else than vogons.
Thanks

Sorry if that was the idea I passed along with my last post.

The purpose is not to share ANY software, other than a possible customizable "Installer" I might try to create for software that doesn't have one, since I'm unable to find such program.

Mods being mods again.

I don't see any mention of sharing, or intent thereof? Or indication that OP doesn't own the software he intends to repackage?

elszgensa wrote on 2024-02-27, 16:47:

Mods being mods again.

It's always the same mod.

Well, you're not wrong. I've had a run-in with a different mod that I felt was a bit unfair one time - but all cases of the extreme mod megalomania that I've seen where from this one.

Ok, let's focus on the installer. I think the one from BloodyCactus is not bad as idea and release, but since it lacks some important options and it's just freeware, but it's not open source, we can't modify it to add missing features. So, any other suggestions?

P.S. As for the mentioning of some old corporate long time unsupported software it's always the same story. I'm afraid to even write the word "ab..donw..e" anymore in this forum 😁

analog_programmer wrote on 2024-02-27, 18:39:

it's not open source, we can't modify it to add missing features

Even if it were, seems like OP doesn't want to put a lot of time into coding anyways? I.e. not only would it need to be source available but also simple.

I really liked the suggestion of a minimal Win3 and InstallShield (or any other 16 bit installer), and decided to play around a bit with Win98's MINI.CAB (since that's exactly what the Win9x setup is, a small win3 program). Copied over some basic stuff like progman and winfile and changed the shell in system.ini, and once I added the required dependencies too it all worked no problems. I guess this would also enable having a nice menu system in Visual Basic or whatever? What I didn't try yet is having it run straight off the CD, if it needs write access that may be a no go. Not sure whether OP deems an entire Windows extracted to some temporary folder on the HDD acceptable. (edit: it works fine) Or some of the target hardware may be too slow to even do Windows in the first place.

analog_programmer wrote on 2024-02-27, 18:39:

I'm afraid to even write the word "ab..donw..e" anymore in this forum 😁

I too am sick and tired of how things are handled here sometimes. Know of any other decent forums?

elszgensa wrote on 2024-02-27, 19:02:

I too am sick and tired of how things are handled here sometimes. Know of any other decent forums?

No, I don't know any better. The only thing that I don't like here from the first minute of my entrance for the registration is the vague policy what type of aba...nw..e is treated as strictly non-allowed (as it is stated in the rules) and what kind is somehow allowed, 'cause there are tons of links and attachments on the forum of what may be considered as such kind of old (and even modified) software and nobody cares about them, but sometimes when you only mention the "forbidden thing" and... "Achtung, Achtung! Luftalarm!" 😁

So, enough off-topic. Shall we learn to use Turbo Vision (FOSS version! There is also Free Pascal FOSS version) or what? 😀

I slacked off during Pascal classes and never learned a thing. I googled for Turbo Vision and somehow I only see Windows 3.x style dialog for Turbo Vision 3.0 for Pascal, and DOS style dialog boxes for Turbo Vision 2.0 for Borland Turbo C++. Since I did learn something on C++ but nothing on Turbo Vision, I'll try to start by refreshing my memory on C++ but without too much hope of actually getting something done, since free time is a premium nowadays.

EDIT: for those interested in having "fun" with C++, I tried it with MS-DOS but nowadays it's just too painful and counter productive to use. Best way I found to run it on a Windows 10/11 machine is to use VirtualBox + Windows XP + Borland turbo CPP 3.1 for Windows + Intellimouse 4.01 for the mouse wheel to work on the compiler. I've setup the virtual machine for dual monitor (2 Windows) so I can see the code and help window at the same time. SOOOOO much easier than using MS-DOS + Borland Turbo CPP 3.0.

Here are some old tools for creating installers in DOS, some are freeware and some are probably shareware: http://cd.textfiles.com/simtel/simtel0101/sim … ll/00_index.htm I remember I used some shareware or freeware tool back in the early-to-mid '90s but I probably have no way of figuring out which one it was!

johnyept wrote on 2024-02-28, 06:58:

I googled for Turbo Vision and somehow I only see Windows 3.x style dialog for Turbo Vision 3.0 for Pascal, and DOS style dialog boxes for Turbo Vision 2.0 for Borland Turbo C++.

I realise you prefer to use C++ anyway, but for what it's worth, Turbo Vision is definitely for DOS only, and Turbo Pascal and Borland Pascal versions included Turbo Vision for DOS (see e.g. a manual here: http://bitsavers.org/pdf/borland/turbo_pascal … Vision_1990.pdf). Anything you're seeing for Windows is perhaps Borland ObjectWindows, or maybe a third-party package called Graphics Vision if I recall correctly which used the same API as Turbo Vision but was in some DOS graphical mode instead of text mode.

EDIT: for those interested in having "fun" with C++, I tried it with MS-DOS but nowadays it's just too painful and counter productive to use. Best way I found to run it on a Windows 10/11 machine is to use VirtualBox + Windows XP + Borland turbo CPP 3.1 for Windows + Intellimouse 4.01 for the mouse wheel to work on the compiler. I've setup the virtual machine for dual monitor (2 Windows) so I can see the code and help window at the same time. SOOOOO much easier than using MS-DOS + Borland Turbo CPP 3.0.

Does Turbo C++ for Windows let you build for DOS? If not you could take a look at Borland C++ 4.5, it has a 16-bit Windows IDE which I'm pretty sure can build for DOS (and both 16-bit and 32-bit Windows). I think it lacks Turbo Vision unless you get the "Power Pack" but it was for version 4.0 and might be hard to install on 4.5.

doshea wrote on 2024-03-01, 11:09:

Here are some old tools for creating installers in DOS, some are freeware and some are probably shareware: http://cd.textfiles.com/simtel/simtel0101/sim … ll/00_index.htm I remember I used some shareware or freeware tool back in the early-to-mid '90s but I probably have no way of figuring out which one it was!

Thanks for the tip, I'll definitely check it out! I rather use something well built than conjure up some patched together homemade code that might do more harm than good 😀

doshea wrote on 2024-03-01, 11:09:

Does Turbo C++ for Windows let you build for DOS? If not you could take a look at Borland C++ 4.5, it has a 16-bit Windows IDE which I'm pretty sure can build for DOS (and both 16-bit and 32-bit Windows). I think it lacks Turbo Vision unless you get the "Power Pack" but it was for version 4.0 and might be hard to install on 4.5.

I think it does, at least the code is exactly the same, and I could always recompile in 3.0 when I'm done coding in 3.1. Also, I did find Turbo Vision 1.0 for BCPP 3.0, Turbo Vision 1.03 for BCPP 3.1 and Turbo Vision 2.0 (with bugs fixed) for BCPP 4.02+, but although Turbo Vision looks awesome, it requires more re-learning than my brain is willing to take.

doshea wrote on 2024-03-01, 11:09:

Here are some old tools for creating installers in DOS, some are freeware and some are probably shareware: http://cd.textfiles.com/simtel/simtel0101/sim … ll/00_index.htm

Thanks for the link! At first look two of these tools look promising. The one is shareware (cwins110.zip), but the other is freeware and uses its own simple scripting system (Installer! v.1.08). I'll try all these tools from the link.

Glad to hear the link seems useful! You could also have a look in other Simtel CDs on that site (at least the DOS ones) since sometimes they didn't keep around older tools (there's only such much they can fit on a CD) and newer isn't always better. e.g. there seem to be some other tools here: http://cd.textfiles.com/simtel/simtel0595/DISC1/INSTALL/ (see 00_INDEX.TXT for brief descriptions).

Also, I took a look at the PC-SIG Library 13th edition and it had a few programs for creating installers, and here's a quick hint if you want to look elsewhere: PC-SIG considered them to be "programming tools", which I suppose makes sense given the primary audience! To save you the time of figuring out how to use WordCruncher, here's what I found in some contemporary PC-SIG database (maybe not identical to the one on the 13th edition CD-ROM):
Proinstaller
First Impression
Q-Install
Open Install

doshea wrote on 2024-03-02, 00:38:

Glad to hear the link seems useful! You could also have a look in other Simtel CDs on that site (at least the DOS ones) since s […]
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Glad to hear the link seems useful! You could also have a look in other Simtel CDs on that site (at least the DOS ones) since sometimes they didn't keep around older tools (there's only such much they can fit on a CD) and newer isn't always better. e.g. there seem to be some other tools here: http://cd.textfiles.com/simtel/simtel0595/DISC1/INSTALL/ (see 00_INDEX.TXT for brief descriptions).

Also, I took a look at the PC-SIG Library 13th edition and it had a few programs for creating installers, and here's a quick hint if you want to look elsewhere: PC-SIG considered them to be "programming tools", which I suppose makes sense given the primary audience! To save you the time of figuring out how to use WordCruncher, here's what I found in some contemporary PC-SIG database (maybe not identical to the one on the 13th edition CD-ROM):
Proinstaller
First Impression
Q-Install
Open Install

Thanks for all these links. So far I tried the most promising DOS installer tools from the first links you gave - "ClarkWehyr Enterprises Installer 1.10" and "Installer! 1.08". The first one is very similar to BloodyCactus's Simple Installer plus option to alter FILES, BUFFERS, LASTDRIVE and PATH values in CONFIG.SYS and AUTOEXEC.BAT (this limited config function is useless for me), while "Installer!" is script based tool and thus it has much more potential, but it's not so simple to be used. From the text descriptions for the rest of the tools it seem to be that they're with very basic functionality.

I'll check what will show up from the new links.