Can't set up a Gravis Ultrasound PNP

Discussion about old sound cards, MIDI devices and sound related accessories.

Re: Can't set up a Gravis Ultrasound PNP

Postby shock__ » 2018-2-12 @ 21:05

JP8 should be 2x5 posts.
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Re: Can't set up a Gravis Ultrasound PNP

Postby tpowell.ca » 2018-2-12 @ 21:17

shock__ wrote:
tpowell.ca wrote:btw, I don't want to hijack this tread but has anyone used the iwavecfg.exe v1.3 tool to manually force the GUS Pnp ressources to specific values?
I noticed that once I did, I was unable to flash the card back using official Gravis ROM tools as it no longer recognized the card.
You mean PNPMAP? You can force it to rewrite the flash using the /f parameter, even if it has trouble detecting it.


Thanks! I'll definitely try that when I get home.
    Merlin: Shuttle HOT-433v4, Am5x86DX4-133, 64MB EDO, 16GB CF HD, Iomega ZIP100, SBPro2, GUS 1MB, S3 VirgeGX 2MB, HardMPU-401
    Newton: DFI K6XV3+/66, AMD K6-III+ 450, 256MB PC100/CL2, 32GB CF HD, AWE32 8MB, GUS Pnp 16MB, GF3 Ti200 64MB AGP, Voodoo1 4MB
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Re: Can't set up a Gravis Ultrasound PNP

Postby jheronimus » 2018-2-12 @ 21:32

So, I'm guessing that the easiest way will be to get 2x4MB RAM that I wanted to do anyway?

My PnP is rev 1.0, BTW. I can't find a photo of this card with all the pins visible, though.
Socket 7: Pentium 166; 64MB RAM; Matrox Millenium+Voodoo 1; AWE32 PnP w/28MB + GUS PnP Pro w/8MB
Slot 1: Pentium III 500; 384MB RAM; Voodoo 5 5500 AGP; AWE64 Value w/8MB + Diamond Monster Sound MX300 + SoundBlaster Live!
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Re: Can't set up a Gravis Ultrasound PNP

Postby 640K!enough » 2018-2-13 @ 01:17

jheronimus wrote:So, I'm guessing that the easiest way will be to get 2x4MB RAM that I wanted to do anyway?

My PnP is rev 1.0, BTW. I can't find a photo of this card with all the pins visible, though.

I also have a V1.0 board. Mine originally didn't have any pin headers installed for JP8. It was permanently configured with pins 1-2 and 5-6 bridged at the factory. It works fine with 2x1 MiB SIMMs. I was under the impression that those jumpers were only relevant on the Pro, where there is another RAM chip built on.

I think you have another board-level problem, like shock__ suggested. It seems like either the latches have a problem, or there is something preventing the select signals from doing their job; that would be the reason your SIMMs aren't working, and the ROM isn't being found. Can you post a clear close-up shot of both sides of the board? There may not be anything visibly wrong with it, but there is a chance that someone will see something.

If there is an unintended bridge or short somewhere on the card, this behaviour can result.
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Re: Can't set up a Gravis Ultrasound PNP

Postby jheronimus » 2018-2-13 @ 04:11

OK, here are the photos, all clickable

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Image
Image
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Socket 7: Pentium 166; 64MB RAM; Matrox Millenium+Voodoo 1; AWE32 PnP w/28MB + GUS PnP Pro w/8MB
Slot 1: Pentium III 500; 384MB RAM; Voodoo 5 5500 AGP; AWE64 Value w/8MB + Diamond Monster Sound MX300 + SoundBlaster Live!
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Re: Can't set up a Gravis Ultrasound PNP

Postby shock__ » 2018-2-13 @ 05:57

Are there some bridged pins (see attachment)? If yes, that would explain things, as those are used for RAM/ROM selection.
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Re: Can't set up a Gravis Ultrasound PNP

Postby jheronimus » 2018-2-13 @ 06:37

What does "bridged" mean?
Socket 7: Pentium 166; 64MB RAM; Matrox Millenium+Voodoo 1; AWE32 PnP w/28MB + GUS PnP Pro w/8MB
Slot 1: Pentium III 500; 384MB RAM; Voodoo 5 5500 AGP; AWE64 Value w/8MB + Diamond Monster Sound MX300 + SoundBlaster Live!
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Re: Can't set up a Gravis Ultrasound PNP

Postby shock__ » 2018-2-13 @ 06:46

Unintentionally connected.
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Re: Can't set up a Gravis Ultrasound PNP

Postby 640K!enough » 2018-2-13 @ 17:30

From the pictures, it looks like someone attempted to repair or modify the card at some point. So, there are a few things I would suggest that you try:
  1. Under bright light, check the large InterWave chip, looking to make sure each pin sits on the corresponding rectangular spot on the board. Also, make sure there is no solder or other debris connecting any pin to either of its neighbours. If there is, you or someone with appropriate soldering skills will have to fix this before the board has any chance of working long-term.
  2. With item 1 taken care of, try removing all SIMMs, jumpering JP8 to 1-2 and 5-6, then installing and running iwinit -v9. Does it find ROM AMDGM_1_1_? If it does, try using PLAY.EXE to play a MIDI file. Does it sound normal?
  3. If item 2 was successful, try re-installing your SIMMs. Does it find the RAM? If you run setup again and test the RAM, does it pass?

If or when you're in the mood, try that and report back. Someone will likely be able to offer additional suggestions.
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Re: Can't set up a Gravis Ultrasound PNP

Postby jheronimus » 2018-2-15 @ 10:32

I've inspected the chip, and I think that the debris is just small flares that are only visible under certain angle — I can't really make a photo without these flares. I don't think there is anything there, but I've cleaned the contacts anyways.

I've tried setting JP8 to 1-2 and 5-6, but it didn't change anything. There is no mention of AMDGM in iwinit's output.

I've already ordered 2x4MB memory for this card, so I'll test that. Another plan is to try this card in a Windows 9x machine just to check different drivers. As it is it does work in Windows 3.11 as a (I guess) SoundBlaster-compatible device.
Socket 7: Pentium 166; 64MB RAM; Matrox Millenium+Voodoo 1; AWE32 PnP w/28MB + GUS PnP Pro w/8MB
Slot 1: Pentium III 500; 384MB RAM; Voodoo 5 5500 AGP; AWE64 Value w/8MB + Diamond Monster Sound MX300 + SoundBlaster Live!
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Re: Can't set up a Gravis Ultrasound PNP

Postby 640K!enough » 2018-2-15 @ 12:30

If you don't think there is a short between pins on the chip, and it still doesn't find the ROM with no SIMMs installed, you have other problems to worry about. I don't think that trying yet another pair of SIMMs will cause any major new problems, but it isn't likely to solve anything, either.

The back of the board seems to have a few solder joints on the capacitors that aren't as clean as they should be. It also seems that the board was scratched or stabbed in a few places, possibly related to a previous repair attempt. The board appears to be covered in flux (a chemical to aid in soldering) residue, which can be conductive. This can cause all sorts of problems, including symptoms like you're seeing.

If you don't have any electronics experience, it may be worth getting some help with the problem. It may help to first clean off as much of the residue as possible, then inspect those traces and touch up the joints on the back. Lastly, if none of that gets it running, it may be necessary to replace U9, U10 and possibly U11 and U12. These look like the have seen better days, and may have had a problem.

The board can likely be salvaged, it's just a question of the amount of effort you are willing to put in to make it work.

EDIT: Corrected chip numbering.
Last edited by 640K!enough on 2018-2-15 @ 14:04, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Can't set up a Gravis Ultrasound PNP

Postby shock__ » 2018-2-15 @ 13:42

Might also be worth a shot to check if the caps were replaced correctly: https://i.imgur.com/3S00ZtH.jpg
Polarity should be indicated on the board.
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Re: Can't set up a Gravis Ultrasound PNP

Postby jheronimus » 2018-2-16 @ 09:35

Didn't have the time to put it in my Win9x box, but there is one thing I've noticed — there simply doesn't seem to an AMDGM file in the ULTRASND directory where all the Gravis stuff lives.

I mean, it should load the file off disk at each boot, no? If so, where could I find it?
Socket 7: Pentium 166; 64MB RAM; Matrox Millenium+Voodoo 1; AWE32 PnP w/28MB + GUS PnP Pro w/8MB
Slot 1: Pentium III 500; 384MB RAM; Voodoo 5 5500 AGP; AWE64 Value w/8MB + Diamond Monster Sound MX300 + SoundBlaster Live!
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Re: Can't set up a Gravis Ultrasound PNP

Postby shock__ » 2018-2-16 @ 10:22

no.
AMDGM_1_1_ is contained in the large ROM chip on the GUS PnP labeled IW78C21M1
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Re: Can't set up a Gravis Ultrasound PNP

Postby jheronimus » 2018-2-24 @ 16:51

So, I got 2x4MB RAM and now Gravis correctly detects 8MB in setup.exe

However, there is still no sound and no mention of a romset in iwinit's output.
Socket 7: Pentium 166; 64MB RAM; Matrox Millenium+Voodoo 1; AWE32 PnP w/28MB + GUS PnP Pro w/8MB
Slot 1: Pentium III 500; 384MB RAM; Voodoo 5 5500 AGP; AWE64 Value w/8MB + Diamond Monster Sound MX300 + SoundBlaster Live!
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Re: Can't set up a Gravis Ultrasound PNP

Postby 640K!enough » 2018-2-25 @ 20:19

I can't really say much more without someone doing some amount of board-level trouble-shooting. To start with, the capacitors have definitely seen better days. In particular, it looks like the electrolytic (can-style) capacitor just left of the microphone power switch has a serious problem; it looks like it either vented or partially melted. I can't even see its reference number because it appears to be covered in some sort of opaque sludge. The picture isn't clear, but if that is actually the case, the board will need some work before it has any chance of working completely and reliably.
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