VOGONS


First post, by SRQ

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I have an AMBITION- Doom on the most overpowered system possible for 1993. I sourced a socket 4 board and a pentium 66, and will probably combined it with a diamond viper PCI.

But what for sound? Soundblaster Pro is the obvious, but my god those are rare. What clones are good- are there better non-creative cards for the timespan? What would have been the hottest shit for audio in 1993?

Reply 1 of 14, by jheronimus

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I think a SoundBlaster is still the "hot shit" option for 1993. But you don't have to look for Pro version. There are probably three main alternatives:

1) SoundBlaster AWE32. Yes, it was released in 1994, but it's natively supported by Doom with patches (also by the Ultimate Doom edition)
2) SoundBlaster 16 + a Roland or a Yamaha device. That includes daughterboards (SCD-10, DB50XG), standalone units (SC-55, SC-88, MU80) and addon cards (SCC1, SW60XG). I guess the period correct option would be Roland SC-55 (released in 1993) and it's the device most of the Doom soundtrack was written on.

Bear in mind that many SoundBlasters suffer from hanging midi bug, particularly in Doom and Doom-based game. So you will have to find something like CT2230 or CT17** revision card. More details here. Or just go with an addon card — they don't have those issues.

3) SoundBlaster 16 + original Gravis Ultrasound. I believe that the GUS version is what you can hear in all official Doom ports on Steam/Xbox/etc.

Last edited by jheronimus on 2018-03-20, 11:34. Edited 1 time in total.

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Reply 2 of 14, by badmojo

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The PAS16 is a nice DOOM card, if you can forgo GM and make do with the PAS16's excellent implementation of the OPL3.

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Reply 4 of 14, by SRQ

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SB16 I want to avoid because of hanging note bug- or are there models that don't have it?
AWE32 is improperly dated and that's an obsession of mine.

PAS16 sounds interesting however, I'll look into that more. I plan on using an SC-55.

Reply 5 of 14, by jheronimus

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SRQ wrote:

SB16 I want to avoid because of hanging note bug- or are there models that don't have it?

I've added a link to an article that lists bug-free models in my previous message. There are models that won't have issues with most games (like CT2230) and there are completely bug-free models that are, however, more rare and tend to be a bit noisy.

Also, you won't get bugs with a two-card solution where a separate card is responsible for MIDI — like GUS, Yamaha SW60XG and the likes.

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Reply 6 of 14, by badmojo

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SRQ wrote:

I plan on using an SC-55.

Ah, better avoid the PAS16 then as they have a poor MPU401 implementation. They do play nicely with a second sound card though so that’s an option.

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Reply 7 of 14, by jesolo

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The system you have would have been the top end system for 1993.
Period correct (for a top end system) would be a Sound Blaster 16 (CT2230), which doesn't have the hanging note bug, coupled with a Roland SC-55 (released in 1991).
You can go for a Sound Blaster Pro (since no DOS titles supported 16-bit sampling in 1993) but, then you would require a dedicated MPU-401 MIDI interface (like the Roland MPU-IPC, which is a smaller version of the original MPU-401). You can also look at the Music Quest MIDI interface or Voyetra OP-4001 (if you can find one).

Reply 9 of 14, by fitzpatr

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Read the whole article on SB16 issues before purchasing. CT1740, CT1750, CT1770, and CT2230 all can have hanging note bugs; it depends on the DSP Version.

MT-32 Old, CM-32L, CM-500, SC-55mkII, SC-88Pro, SC-D70, FB-01, MU2000EX
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Reply 10 of 14, by jheronimus

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fitzpatr wrote:

Read the whole article on SB16 issues before purchasing. CT1740, CT1750, CT1770, and CT2230 all can have hanging note bugs; it depends on the DSP Version.

Then again the list isn't complete, of course. For example, the article mentions the fact that cards with CT1747 chip don't suffer from the bug, but it doesn't list the models with that chip. For example, CT2770 (SB 16 Value) is somewhat common. It doesn't have a Wavetable header, but it uses CT1747 so should be nice for SC-55 or MU80.

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Reply 11 of 14, by fitzpatr

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jheronimus wrote:
fitzpatr wrote:

Read the whole article on SB16 issues before purchasing. CT1740, CT1750, CT1770, and CT2230 all can have hanging note bugs; it depends on the DSP Version.

Then again the list isn't complete, of course. For example, the article mentions the fact that cards with CT1747 chip don't suffer from the bug, but it doesn't list the models with that chip. For example, CT2770 (SB 16 Value) is somewhat common. It doesn't have a Wavetable header, but it uses CT1747 so should be nice for SC-55 or MU80.

That's not entirely correct. There are two types of hanging note bugs. Rather than repeat the information, I refer anyone interested to the Wiki.

http://www.vogonswiki.com/index.php/Hanging_note_bug

MT-32 Old, CM-32L, CM-500, SC-55mkII, SC-88Pro, SC-D70, FB-01, MU2000EX
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Reply 12 of 14, by appiah4

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Yeah, I was under the impression that my CT2290 with a CT1747 was also bulletproof wrt the MIDI bugs, but alas, it still does stuttering in some games. I also have some Vibras with CT1747 such as the CT2920, and it also has the issue. That is why I collect Sound Blaster 16 cards but never use them. I swear by Audiodrives (and ESFM sounds better than true OPL3 to my ears anyway).

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Reply 13 of 14, by Tenorman

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badmojo wrote:

Ah, better avoid the PAS16 then as they have a poor MPU401 implementation. They do play nicely with a second sound card though so that’s an option.

This does work well, but I would add one caveat: Depending on what other hardware you are using, it could be difficult because you need a boat load of IRQs to enable both PAS16 and SB support, as well as a separate MIDI card. I have a PAS16 that I use for FM combined with an Ensoniq Soundscape Opus to get some basic MIDI support and I am using 3 IRQs, 3 DMAs. and two ports to initialize them both.

[Compaq Presario 633 | DOS 6.22 / Win 3.1 | DX4 100 Overdrive | 28M RAM | SB16 CT2770A | SPEA Media FX (Soundscape S2000) ]
[GA-6BXC R2.0 | Win98SE | Via C3 Ezra 866 | 384M RAM | TNT2 32M | Voodoo2 8M | SB32 CT3670 | Ensoniq Soundscape Opus]

Reply 14 of 14, by badmojo

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Tenorman wrote:

This does work well, but I would add one caveat: Depending on what other hardware you are using, it could be difficult because you need a boat load of IRQs to enable both PAS16 and SB support, as well as a separate MIDI card. I have a PAS16 that I use for FM combined with an Ensoniq Soundscape Opus to get some basic MIDI support and I am using 3 IRQs, 3 DMAs. and two ports to initialize them both.

The one and only time I've tried a PAS16 in a multi card setup was here:

Pentium 166MMX tower of power

I had the PAS16's SB emulation disabled and did have a clash b/w the second card's FM and the PAS16, but it was easy enough to get going.

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