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Simmconn AWE64 Adapter

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Reply 40 of 549, by SIMMConn

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kithylin wrote:
Xu Wang, […]
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Xu Wang,

Sorry about not linking you directly to the thread. I didn't think you were interested in communicating with us, or I would of linked it to you. But turned out you found it anyway, so it worked out 😀 I'm the one that's been emailing you about it most recently.

I've been wondering if someone could come up with a design similar to creative's original, with the ram modules soldered on to the PCB and save space in a system. I have one of your simmconn's in one of my retro gaming machines, and had put it on a awe64 gold I sold to a friend a few years ago too. So your creations have found their 'forever homes' and will be used by people for a long time.

If anyone else on the forums here ever did a small production run of something similar of these some day, maybe put a poll out and get people to sign something to commit to buy for 25-50 of em, I would be interested.

Also I never knew there was a retail package for your simmconn. Any chance you could come up with a photo of what it looked like and show some of us that are just curious?

I gave it some thought and now I'd like to take it back that in order to fit into the ISA space one would have to go with the Creative approach, instead, one could go with a creative approach. 🤣
One can carve the center of the SIMMConn adapter out and lay down the straight SIMM slot to reduce overall height. The board would need to be enlarged slightly and grow in thickness to about 2mm in order to improve rigidity and to accommodate the SIMM slot when you use it in a straddle mount position. Now that all the signals have to go around the cutout, PCB design would be more challenging than the original. But still, it would be a lot easier and cheaper than to design a Creative memory module clone.

Reply 42 of 549, by Robin4

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firage wrote:

The only difference between the Value and Gold adapters he sells must be the PCB color, right?

No, the memory configurations are different on both boards..

So the green one can only used on the basic AWE and the value one.
The gold one is for the AWE64 gold only.

~ At least it can do black and white~

Reply 43 of 549, by BrAlZy

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SIMMConn wrote:
Hi Guys, Glad to join the discussion! It was the summer break after my first year in grad school when I started the SIMMConn des […]
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Hi Guys,
Glad to join the discussion!
It was the summer break after my first year in grad school when I started the SIMMConn design. At the time the AWE64 was the cream of the crop of sound cards. I couldn't afford the Gold version, let alone the Creative memory modules. Using the 72-pin SIMM seems to be the most economical way to put more memory on the AWE64.

Unlike the Creative memory module which is a straight-forward design, there is some more work to do in order to accommodate a SIMM. The SIMM has 32-bit data bus, whereas the EMU-8000 uses 16-bit. I would need to multiplex the 32-bit memory into the 16-bit bus base on the address range EMU-8000 accesses. At the same time, the memory refresh command needs to be duplicated to the other half of memory that's not being accessed, otherwise the content in the memory will be lost. I managed to squeeze all the logic into a GAL device and made the first prototype.

I convinced my dad that people who are like me would buy these. With the investment from him I had 500 pieces of adapters made (250 of Value and 250 of Gold), with printed manuals and nice looking, colorful retail packaging. It turned out to be the worst investment he has ever made. The AWE64 was soon replaced by the PCI sound cards. After the first 50 or so, the quarterly sales of the adapter dropped to near zero. Interestingly, sales slowly picked up after around 2005, and 2014 was the best year until the stock ran out.

Around the time the prototype was finished, I found the AWE-SIMM website by Jeff Briden and had some good email conversations with him. Apparently his adapter was based on the same principle but in a slightly different implementation. Memory expansion was fixed at 16MB and DIP parts were used which are more DIY-friendly. Inspired by his openness about his design, I decided to open my design as well and posted all the manufacturing files on the website.

The PCB is a simple 2-sided board and all the parts are easy to get except the 2mm pitch dual-row receptacles that mate with the headers on the AWE64. I custom-ordered them from Taiwan. The PCB was designed to accommodate both straight and right-angled SIMM sockets with no modification needed. At the time I was not able to find a right-angled one. It turns out even with a right-angled one the stacked height is still too tall. To tuck all the memory within the allowed space of an ISA card, one would have to go with the Creative memory module approach and have the memory chips soldered on the module.

All the adapters were supposed to be tested in 1998 and I had no idea why I ended up with a box of untested SIMMConn Gold. My apologies go to everyone who asked about it in the past year or so, for the long delay. I was finally able to test all of them and most of them are good. So here they are again on ebay. There should be enough for everyone in this thread. Unfortunately the last shipment of Value boards was inadequately packaged and every board suffered some damage. I picked the ones in fair to good conditions and they are mostly gone now.

Please feel free to use the design files to run another production. One should be able to make it a wash for a group buy in the neighborhood of 25. I’m not planning on doing it myself, as I have other projects in desperate need of my time. Anyone who’s willing to take the plunge and do it, feel free to contact me if you have any technical questions.

I’d like to say thanks to everyone who inquired or ordered a SIMMConn at some point of time in the past 17 years. Having satisfied customers around the globe is the best reward I can possibly get for the effort I spent on this project.

Best regards,
Xu Wang

So I'm assuming that means that's the end of SIMMCONN huh? Damn, I was just gonna buy one too... 😢

Reply 45 of 549, by PCBONEZ

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It rather looks like the original source has made a new batch.
http://simmconn.tripod.com/order.htm
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GRUMPY OLD FART - On Hiatus, sort'a
Mann-Made Global Warming. - We should be more concerned about the Intellectual Climate.
You can teach a man to fish and feed him for life, but if he can't handle sushi you must also teach him to cook.

Reply 47 of 549, by PCBONEZ

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Rawrl wrote:

Nah, if you try to check out through PayPal it won't let you complete the transaction. You're stuck paying *seventy-seven* United States dollars for one on eBay, which is absurd.

O.I.C.
I stopped one step too soon because I didn't want to actually buy one.
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GRUMPY OLD FART - On Hiatus, sort'a
Mann-Made Global Warming. - We should be more concerned about the Intellectual Climate.
You can teach a man to fish and feed him for life, but if he can't handle sushi you must also teach him to cook.

Reply 48 of 549, by kithylin

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PCBONEZ wrote:
O.I.C. I stopped one step too soon because I didn't want to actually buy one. . […]
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Rawrl wrote:

Nah, if you try to check out through PayPal it won't let you complete the transaction. You're stuck paying *seventy-seven* United States dollars for one on eBay, which is absurd.

O.I.C.
I stopped one step too soon because I didn't want to actually buy one.
.

FYI this was covered in page 1 and 2 of this thread. The website will not let you check out because he has no more stock. There's a few left and he's testing them one by one, and listing each one on ebay as he can. Once these are gone they will be gone forever. That's why they're going for so much on ebay. That and these Simmconn are the only such adapter ever created for the creative cards that I know of. The only other option is to find an original 28MB creative expansion module, and those normally go for like $100+ if and when they ever do show up on ebay.

Reply 49 of 549, by PCBONEZ

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kithylin wrote:

............... Once these are gone they will be gone forever. .............. The only other option ...............

Beg to differ.
Boards like those are not particularly difficult to make yourself.
A PCB fab kit from Fry's Electronics should be enough.
He even included the PCB layouts on the site so they are clearly 'open source' (as it were) as far as he cares.
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GRUMPY OLD FART - On Hiatus, sort'a
Mann-Made Global Warming. - We should be more concerned about the Intellectual Climate.
You can teach a man to fish and feed him for life, but if he can't handle sushi you must also teach him to cook.

Reply 50 of 549, by kithylin

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PCBONEZ wrote:
Beg to differ. Boards like those are not particularly difficult to make yourself. A PCB fab kit from Fry's Electronics should b […]
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kithylin wrote:

............... Once these are gone they will be gone forever. .............. The only other option ...............

Beg to differ.
Boards like those are not particularly difficult to make yourself.
A PCB fab kit from Fry's Electronics should be enough.
He even included the PCB layouts on the site so they are clearly 'open source' (as it were) as far as he cares.
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I would guess most of us aren't adept at assembling things at the component level like this. So.. if it's so easy.. go ahead and make one and sell it. You see what they're selling for.

Just know there's different models for the AWE64 Gold, and the AWE64 Value, and you'd need to test em on an actual card first.

Reply 51 of 549, by PCBONEZ

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kithylin wrote:
PCBONEZ wrote:
Beg to differ. Boards like those are not particularly difficult to make yourself. A PCB fab kit from Fry's Electronics should b […]
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kithylin wrote:

............... Once these are gone they will be gone forever. .............. The only other option ...............

Beg to differ.
Boards like those are not particularly difficult to make yourself.
A PCB fab kit from Fry's Electronics should be enough.
He even included the PCB layouts on the site so they are clearly 'open source' (as it were) as far as he cares.
.

I would guess most of us aren't adept at assembling things at the component level like this. So.. if it's so easy.. go ahead and make one and sell it. You see what they're selling for.

Just know there's different models for the AWE64 Gold, and the AWE64 Value, and you'd need to test em on an actual card first.

There's the "I can't do it" attitude again. More or less the point of my last post.
I was taught that: "If you can read then you can learn to do anything."
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I'm not lacking for things to do. At any given time I have 150 or so motherboards around here to work on. That's what I like do.
I do have several AWE64 tucked away but I've never done anything with them that needs added RAM.
Thus such a project is low interest for me. Some of you though seem to REALLY want one of these.
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I'm "adept" as you say in such things and I'm saying this is not that tough a board to build from scratch.
There are PLENTY of tutorials on-line. The kits have instructions. Electronics forums where you can ask questions.
It's an excellent opportunity for those "not adept" at this kind of thing to learn a new skill.
So: anyone that wants one of these bad enough can have one regardless of some kid in China no longer making them in his daddy's factory.
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--- They aren't "gone forever" (unless you want them to be) and there is more than one "other option" open to you.
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GRUMPY OLD FART - On Hiatus, sort'a
Mann-Made Global Warming. - We should be more concerned about the Intellectual Climate.
You can teach a man to fish and feed him for life, but if he can't handle sushi you must also teach him to cook.

Reply 52 of 549, by alexanrs

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I wonder if someone could, instead of using SIMMs, just use SDRAM ICs and make a 4MB or 8MB expansion board that would not occupy the adjacent slot. Anyway, I don't really want one bad enough to try doing that myself. I have one of those AWE64-based SB32 with 30-pin slots, and loading 8MB soundfonts is already slow, god knows the time it would take to load a 28MB one. If I wanted soundfonts that big I could just use an EMU10K1 card... but even 4MB and 8MB soundfonts I tried ran laps around the stock GM.

Reply 53 of 549, by PCBONEZ

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alexanrs wrote:

I wonder if someone could, instead of using SIMMs, just use SDRAM ICs and make a 4MB or 8MB expansion board that would not occupy the adjacent slot. Anyway, I don't really want one bad enough to try doing that myself. I have one of those AWE64-based SB32 with 30-pin slots, and loading 8MB soundfonts is already slow, god knows the time it would take to load a 28MB one. If I wanted soundfonts that big I could just use an EMU10K1 card... but even 4MB and 8MB soundfonts I tried ran laps around the stock GM.

I have some of those old OEM "Gold Finch" cards that have 30-pin RAM slots on the cards.
They were options for some HP, Dell or Compaq. - With AWE32 I think.
Never did use them for anything. Never even tested them.
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GRUMPY OLD FART - On Hiatus, sort'a
Mann-Made Global Warming. - We should be more concerned about the Intellectual Climate.
You can teach a man to fish and feed him for life, but if he can't handle sushi you must also teach him to cook.

Reply 55 of 549, by kithylin

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Arctic wrote:

Just wondering if there is any development on this matter.
I am still interested in a SIMMconn Gold for AWE64 😀

As far as I'm aware there is no "development". The creator sold the last versions of the creation he had and no more were to ever be made and that's it for history. No more SimmConn adapters.

If you didn't get one then.. I guess you didn't get any and probably never will unless someone that did decides to sell one.

Reply 56 of 549, by mattrock1988

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I missed the boat on this by a bit. But honestly, external MIDI devices seem like a better bet if you want higher fidelity.

That being said, if anyone decides to start up production on a per order basis, I'd be interested.

Retro PC: Intel Pentium III @ 1 GHz, Intel SE440BX-2, 32 GB IDE DOM, 384 MB SDRAM, DVD-ROM, 1.44 MB floppy, Nvidia GeForce 4 Ti 4600 AGP, Creative SoundBlaster AWE64 Gold, Aureal Vortex 2
I only rely on 86box these days. My Pentium 3 PC died. 🙁

Reply 57 of 549, by Arctic

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kithylin wrote:
Arctic wrote:

Just wondering if there is any development on this matter.
I am still interested in a SIMMconn Gold for AWE64 😀

As far as I'm aware there is no "development". The creator sold the last versions of the creation he had and no more were to ever be made and that's it for history. No more SimmConn adapters.

If you didn't get one then.. I guess you didn't get any and probably never will unless someone that did decides to sell one.

I thought exactly the same! But luckily I managed to get one of the last SimmCONN values 😵
It's still sealed 😁

Does anyone want to trade his "gold" for my "value" simmconn gold? 😁
Maybe you have the gold version but you need the value one?

Reply 58 of 549, by GuyTechie

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I emailed Serge from serdashop (he makes the Dreamblaster S1 and X1) to see if he was interested in taking up the project. I know I want one of the Gold and Value version in case I come across a AWE64 Gold (I just have a value for now). Serge is interested but would like to make sure Xu is okay with us going forward with his design.

Xu posted some files in his site that looks like someone with the means and skills like Serge can reproduce.

I'm getting chills at the thought of the SIMMcon being available for reasonable prices again! 😀

Reply 59 of 549, by Robin4

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Maybe you can ask this guy: https://www.lo-tech.co.uk/ . I know he is visiting vintage-computers.com very often.. If you look on his site he also made memory boards.. So i dont think it would to hard for him to make this Simmcon thing as well.

~ At least it can do black and white~