List of motherboards with SB-link (PC/PCI) header

Discussion about old sound cards, MIDI devices and sound related accessories.

Re: List of motherboards with SB-link (PC/PCI) header

Postby stamasd » 2016-10-10 @ 22:08

I'll see if I can do the hack for you so it works with i810. I'll probably post it in the other thread when I do to keep all versions together.

Is your chipset plain 810, 810E or 810E2? They use different southbridge chips and with different IDs.

If it's 810E2 which I suspect it may be, you can try the setupds already edited for ICH2 posted in the other thread.
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Re: List of motherboards with SB-link (PC/PCI) header

Postby boxpressed » 2016-10-10 @ 22:35

stamasd wrote:I'll see if I can do the hack for you so it works with i810. I'll probably post it in the other thread when I do to keep all versions together.

Is your chipset plain 810, 810E or 810E2? They use different southbridge chips and with different IDs.

If it's 810E2 which I suspect it may be, you can try the setupds already edited for ICH2 posted in the other thread.


That's very kind of you, thank you. Here are photos of the three Intel ICs on the mobo. If you need photos of anything else, please let me know.

P1120490.JPG

P1120486.JPG

P1120491.JPG
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Re: List of motherboards with SB-link (PC/PCI) header

Postby Carlos S. M. » 2016-10-10 @ 23:14

boxpressed wrote:
stamasd wrote:I'll see if I can do the hack for you so it works with i810. I'll probably post it in the other thread when I do to keep all versions together.

Is your chipset plain 810, 810E or 810E2? They use different southbridge chips and with different IDs.

If it's 810E2 which I suspect it may be, you can try the setupds already edited for ICH2 posted in the other thread.


That's very kind of you, thank you. Here are photos of the three Intel ICs on the mobo. If you need photos of anything else, please let me know.

P1120490.JPG

P1120486.JPG

P1120491.JPG


By the S-Specs of the ICs

The northbridge with the S-Spec SL3P7 and part number: FW82810, is the plain i810

The Southbridge with the S-Spec SL3MA and part number: 82801AA, is the original ICH1

The other chip is likely the CMOS
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Re: List of motherboards with SB-link (PC/PCI) header

Postby stamasd » 2016-10-11 @ 00:28

Yes, it's the original i810 chipset, with ICH southbridge. Let me check a few things.

(edit) Hm, the original setupds.exe from package 3.16 found here http://www.yamaha.co.jp/english/product/lsi/download/ DOES have the PCI ID of the ICH southbridge. It should work unmodified on your motherboard. Are you sure you're using 3.16? If not download it from the link above (direct link: http://download.yamaha.com/file/46447 ) and give it a go. It should work. But only if all other conditions are met (SB-link cable installed etc)

Also try editing the file ds.ini to reflect the IRQ that your card actually gets assigned by the BIOS.
I/O, I/O,
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And a read and a write,
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Re: List of motherboards with SB-link (PC/PCI) header

Postby boxpressed » 2016-10-11 @ 01:25

I will try to edit ds.ini. Not sure what to plug in for some values such as

INTAIRQ=
IRQMODE=
DMAMODE=
FIRSTTRY=
SLAVEBASE=
SLAVEADDR=

Could you post your settings in ds.ini? Thanks!
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Re: List of motherboards with SB-link (PC/PCI) header

Postby stamasd » 2016-10-11 @ 01:31

Can't do that now because the machine I used to do the tests in my previous thread is currently in pieces, packed in boxes and in storage. But you should leave the file as it is set automatically except for the IRQ.
I/O, I/O,
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And a read and a write,
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Re: List of motherboards with SB-link (PC/PCI) header

Postby Kamerat » 2016-10-11 @ 01:39

boxpressed wrote:I will try to edit ds.ini. Not sure what to plug in for some values such as

INTAIRQ=
IRQMODE=
DMAMODE=
FIRSTTRY=
SLAVEBASE=
SLAVEADDR=

Could you post your settings in ds.ini? Thanks!

Just change the FIRSTTRY= to 1, then SETUPDS will automatically reconfigure.
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Re: List of motherboards with SB-link (PC/PCI) header

Postby feipoa » 2016-12-11 @ 10:02

Interesting thread. None of my Tualatin, i815/i845/i875/i915, VIA MVP3, 440BX, 430TX/VX, ServerWorks, ALi Aladdin V, or VIA 266T boards have anything listed in the manual under SB-LINK, SBLINK, SB LINK, SB/LINK, PC-PCI, PCPCI, PC PCI, or PC/PCI. At least those are the terms I searched for in the pdfs. Does anyone know how to add an SB-LINK to supporting chipsets via some mod for boards which do not have the header.
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Re: List of motherboards with SB-link (PC/PCI) header

Postby stamasd » 2016-12-11 @ 10:46

feipoa wrote:Interesting thread. None of my Tualatin, i815/i845/i875/i915, VIA MVP3, 440BX, 430TX/VX, ServerWorks, ALi Aladdin V, or VIA 266T boards have anything listed in the manual under SB-LINK, SBLINK, SB LINK, SB/LINK, PC-PCI, PCPCI, PC PCI, or PC/PCI. At least those are the terms I searched for in the pdfs. Does anyone know how to add an SB-LINK to supporting chipsets via some mod for boards which do not have the header.


Not doable unless the board manufacturer has already made connections to the relevant contacts under the southbridge chip and brought them somewhere out on the moptherboard. Some motherboards do have the signals brought out by traces, and just don't have the header soldered to them. I found a few such motherboards and added the header myself, and in most cases it worked (see the previous posts in the thread about that). I have become pretty good at spotting unpopulated PC/PCI solder pads on pictures from ebay auctions. I must have looked at hundreds of them by now. There's also information about it in my other thread on the subject viewtopic.php?f=46&t=48553

If the manufacturer didn't bring the signals out, then adding them yourself would involve unsoldering the southbridge chip (in most cases it's in BGA package), finding the relevant pads on the motherboard, soldering wires to then, somehow bringing the wires out in a manner that wouldn't interfere with the next step, soldering back the southbridge chip after you've reballed it (added solder balls to make it a BGA package again), then adding a header to the signals you brought out and attaching it somewhere on the motherboard. IMHO this can't be done at a home enthusiast level, as it requires access to specialized equipment - and even then it would be iffy.
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With a bit and a byte
And a read and a write,
I/O, I/O
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Re: List of motherboards with SB-link (PC/PCI) header

Postby feipoa » 2016-12-11 @ 11:27

I am looking at one of my MVP3 motherboards at the moment and the southbridge is QFP, not BGA. In which case, it would not be very difficult if we know the pins to solder and, if any, external discrete components to add. The Southbridge on this board is the VIA VT82C586B. Unfortunately, I do not see any reference to SB-LINK or PC/PCI on the datasheet. http://www.datasheetcatalog.com/datashe ... 586B.shtml

EDIT: Referenced MVP3 motherboard is an FIC PA-2013.
Last edited by feipoa on 2016-12-11 @ 11:56, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: List of motherboards with SB-link (PC/PCI) header

Postby feipoa » 2016-12-11 @ 11:54

The manual for the EPOX EP-MVP3C mentions that the SB-LINK is specifically for the AWE64D PCI. Have people confirmed that this motherboard/chipset will work with other PCI sound cards in DOS via the SB-LINK?
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Re: List of motherboards with SB-link (PC/PCI) header

Postby j^aws » 2016-12-11 @ 12:08

^^ I've tried that 586B southbridge and SB-Link across various boards: SS7, Slot 1 and S370. Also a similar Epox board as the one above, and SB-Link worked in DOS using PC-PCI and S-IRQ using YMF724 cards.

Regarding datasheets, you might find distributed DMA mentioned instead for the chipset.
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Re: List of motherboards with SB-link (PC/PCI) header

Postby feipoa » 2016-12-11 @ 12:17

Indeed, it is listed under distributed DMA. Would anybody with a QFP 586B southbridge motherboard be willing to trace out which pins are needed and any accompanying components?
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Re: List of motherboards with SB-link (PC/PCI) header

Postby stamasd » 2016-12-11 @ 14:38

As a rule of thumb, PC/PCI is supported primarily by Intel chipsets (from BX/LX till chipset 845) with very few chipsets from other manufacturers supporting it. Conversely, DDMA is supported primarily on VIA chipsets, with very few Intel chipsets supporting it (none after BX AFAIK).
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With a bit and a byte
And a read and a write,
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Re: List of motherboards with SB-link (PC/PCI) header

Postby feipoa » 2016-12-11 @ 15:27

What is the difference between DDMA and PC/PCI (SB-LINK)?
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Re: List of motherboards with SB-link (PC/PCI) header

Postby Kamerat » 2016-12-11 @ 15:39

feipoa wrote:What is the difference between DDMA and PC/PCI (SB-LINK)?

Most apparently the physical as PC/PCI requires it's own cable from the sound card to the motherboard. In my experience VIA DDMA works for most sound cards up to the KT133A/686B chipset, for newer VIA chipsets DDMA compatibility are more limited.
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Re: List of motherboards with SB-link (PC/PCI) header

Postby j^aws » 2016-12-11 @ 15:41

feipoa wrote:What is the difference between DDMA and PC/PCI (SB-LINK)?

They're both legacy DMA solutions but PC/PCI uses a physical signal to the host card with the SB-Link connection, bypassing the PCI bus to access ISA signals.
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Re: List of motherboards with SB-link (PC/PCI) header

Postby blackmasked » 2016-12-16 @ 10:11

I own a Lucky Star 6ABX2V (i440BX) and it does indeed have an PC/PCI a.k.a SB-LINK connector on board. Never used it but it's there ;]
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Re: List of motherboards with SB-link (PC/PCI) header

Postby PARUS » 2016-12-16 @ 18:45

I think most people never used SB Link on boards which have ISA bus. Because it's madness to want SB Link if you have ISA. SB Link is needed on boards which haven't ISA. But manufacturers removed it exactly when ISA was removed. And it is doubly madness.
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