VOGONS


First post, by LunarG

User metadata
Rank Oldbie
Rank
Oldbie

Right. Dramatic headline, but here goes:
I have a Sound Blaster AWE64 Gold in my K6-3 system. It sounds just fine for wave playback, so no issues there. The problem is that half the time I boot the system, I get an error message about not being able to load sound font bank. I check the sound font util, and it shows the card as having 0KB of memory. The other half (or so) times, it gives no error message and shows up as having 2048KB or memory. Being an AWE64 Gold, it should have 4096KB or memory, so something is clearly not right.
I bought a SIMMCONN a longish while ago, and due to real life(TM) I've not had a chance to try it out yet. I was hoping that adding some memory via SIMMCONN might circumvent the issues with the onboard memory being finicky. But as it turns out, with every memory module I've tried, the SIMMCONN does exactly zip, zero, nada.
So I figured I'd try the diagnose util via MS-DOS (it's a Win98se system), but it simply doesn't start. As soon as I try launching the diagnose util, the system just appears to freeze up.

So... Do I happen to have a permanently faulty AWE64 Gold? I mean, when it boots with 2MB of memory, the midi playback is just fine. I actually quite like the punchiness of the 2meg creative soundfont. But I was hoping to be able to play around with different sound fonts, and perhaps even try doing some midi sequencing on it.

Any suggestions as to what to try next?

If I end up having to abandon it, I guess that's a great excuse to use my XG card instead.

WinXP : PIII 1.4GHz, 512MB RAM, 73GB SCSI HDD, Matrox Parhelia, SB Audigy 2.
Win98se : K6-3+ 500MHz, 256MB RAM, 80GB HDD, Matrox Millennium G400 MAX, Voodoo 2, SW1000XG.
DOS6.22 : Intel DX4, 64MB RAM, 1.6GB HDD, Diamond Stealth64 DRAM, GUS 1MB, SB16.

Reply 2 of 16, by LunarG

User metadata
Rank Oldbie
Rank
Oldbie

Tried both ISA slots. It is having the same issue in either slot as far as I have noticed.
I also can't see any visible signs of damage on the card. Caps look alright as far as I can tell without studying them with a magnifying glass.
The thing I find most weird, is that the SIMMCONN seems to contribute nothing. Makes me wonder if it's the chip that communicates with the memory that is faulty or something.

WinXP : PIII 1.4GHz, 512MB RAM, 73GB SCSI HDD, Matrox Parhelia, SB Audigy 2.
Win98se : K6-3+ 500MHz, 256MB RAM, 80GB HDD, Matrox Millennium G400 MAX, Voodoo 2, SW1000XG.
DOS6.22 : Intel DX4, 64MB RAM, 1.6GB HDD, Diamond Stealth64 DRAM, GUS 1MB, SB16.

Reply 3 of 16, by cyclone3d

User metadata
Rank l33t++
Rank
l33t++

Have you tried cleaning the cards edge connector with a pencil eraser? Might also want to try cleaning the connection on the ISA slots themselves.

For the ISA slots, get a piece of printer paper and fold it so it is thick enough to have a bit of resistance when inserted into the slot. Then move it back and forth in the slot. If you are not wanting to try the whole move back and forth thing, you can always just insert/remove a whole bunch of times. The move back and forth method is a lot quicker. When you take it out it will most likely have a lot of black residue on it from the paper cleaning off the oxidation on the connectors.

You may have to do this multiple times with different pieces of paper before the paper stops picking up oxidation/dirt from the slot connectors.

Bad connections can do really funny things.

It could also be a bad solder connection on the card itself.

It could also be your power supply not giving the correct voltage. What power supply are you using and how old is it?

Yamaha modified setupds and drivers
Yamaha XG repository
YMF7x4 Guide
Aopen AW744L II SB-LINK

Reply 4 of 16, by LunarG

User metadata
Rank Oldbie
Rank
Oldbie

I will have to try to clean the ISA slots. I've cleaned the card contacts with Akasa TIM-Clean, and I've done the pencil eraser trick before.
The power supply is an AOpen AO350-12AHNF 350W. Not sure exactly when it's from, as I got it from my boyfriend. He'd had it sitting around for years.
Best info I can find online suggests it is from 2005 or so.

WinXP : PIII 1.4GHz, 512MB RAM, 73GB SCSI HDD, Matrox Parhelia, SB Audigy 2.
Win98se : K6-3+ 500MHz, 256MB RAM, 80GB HDD, Matrox Millennium G400 MAX, Voodoo 2, SW1000XG.
DOS6.22 : Intel DX4, 64MB RAM, 1.6GB HDD, Diamond Stealth64 DRAM, GUS 1MB, SB16.

Reply 5 of 16, by Ozzuneoj

User metadata
Rank l33t
Rank
l33t

I'd recommend getting out a magnifying glass and looking at the solder connections on the back of the card for any that look like they have cracked, or any that have an obvious separation between the pin and the solder. Also, check the legs of any surface mount components. It's very common for one of the tiny legs on the main chip (or a memory chip) to get bent, and if it touches another it will cause all sorts of issues. Check any jumpers on the board too, in case they are loose... I had a problem with a GUS a couple days ago that was caused by a few loose jumpers that had been damaged.

Also, look for any visible marks or scratches on the board and follow them closely to see if they cross any traces or lead to any damaged components.

Erratic problems may be some kind mechanical issue... by that I mean it will be noticeably affected by applying pressure to the card or moving it. Broken solder joints, damaged traces, bent pins, or bent over (damaged) capacitors cause issues like this.

Now for some blitting from the back buffer.

Reply 6 of 16, by LunarG

User metadata
Rank Oldbie
Rank
Oldbie

I think I have finally found the problem.
Some pins on the corner of the large CT8903 chip are bent. They are probably just touching, and hopefully not broken.
Added a link to picture of the bent pins. Are they likely to break if I try to bend them back into position?

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1NP-lSBVhQ_y … ApgIpCbCeuvSy73

WinXP : PIII 1.4GHz, 512MB RAM, 73GB SCSI HDD, Matrox Parhelia, SB Audigy 2.
Win98se : K6-3+ 500MHz, 256MB RAM, 80GB HDD, Matrox Millennium G400 MAX, Voodoo 2, SW1000XG.
DOS6.22 : Intel DX4, 64MB RAM, 1.6GB HDD, Diamond Stealth64 DRAM, GUS 1MB, SB16.

Reply 7 of 16, by shock__

User metadata
Rank Oldbie
Rank
Oldbie

Take a fine sewing needle and carefully bend them back (going from bottom to top in small steps) - chances are good that might fix your card. I've had a similar issue on a Hercules Dynamite 128 in the past which is working nicely to this day.

Current Project: new GUS PnP compatible soundcard

[Z?]

Reply 8 of 16, by LunarG

User metadata
Rank Oldbie
Rank
Oldbie

Okay. Now I am even more confused.
I appear to have managed to unbend the pins as well as I'm likely to manage. A macro shot with my Panasonic camera actually makes the "repair" job look surprisingly effective.
I still get the same error in Windows, but when running the diagnose util, it now does start as it should, it appears to check out perfectly and it plays "AWE Synthesized music" perfectly.
Could this be a driver related issue rather than a hardware related issue?

WinXP : PIII 1.4GHz, 512MB RAM, 73GB SCSI HDD, Matrox Parhelia, SB Audigy 2.
Win98se : K6-3+ 500MHz, 256MB RAM, 80GB HDD, Matrox Millennium G400 MAX, Voodoo 2, SW1000XG.
DOS6.22 : Intel DX4, 64MB RAM, 1.6GB HDD, Diamond Stealth64 DRAM, GUS 1MB, SB16.

Reply 9 of 16, by cyclone3d

User metadata
Rank l33t++
Rank
l33t++

So the DOS test program is using the built in ROM for the test I am pretty sure.

Windows is still showing 0 or 2048KB for the RAM?

Yamaha modified setupds and drivers
Yamaha XG repository
YMF7x4 Guide
Aopen AW744L II SB-LINK

Reply 10 of 16, by LunarG

User metadata
Rank Oldbie
Rank
Oldbie

Currently, it is reporting 2048KB ram in both the diagnose program and in Windows. I've had about a good dozen reboots now, and it reports 2048KB every single time.
Midi playback with the 2MB creative GMGSMT soundfont works perfectly. So, currently I see this a 1/3 victory. At least the card is usable for gaming.
However, it still will not detect additional RAM installed on the SIMMCONN, and I've tried a good few memory modules of different sizes now.

WinXP : PIII 1.4GHz, 512MB RAM, 73GB SCSI HDD, Matrox Parhelia, SB Audigy 2.
Win98se : K6-3+ 500MHz, 256MB RAM, 80GB HDD, Matrox Millennium G400 MAX, Voodoo 2, SW1000XG.
DOS6.22 : Intel DX4, 64MB RAM, 1.6GB HDD, Diamond Stealth64 DRAM, GUS 1MB, SB16.

Reply 11 of 16, by cyclone3d

User metadata
Rank l33t++
Rank
l33t++

Can you post some good close up pics of the card?

Yamaha modified setupds and drivers
Yamaha XG repository
YMF7x4 Guide
Aopen AW744L II SB-LINK

Reply 12 of 16, by LunarG

User metadata
Rank Oldbie
Rank
Oldbie

Right. Pictures of front and back of card, and a closeup of the pins after unbending.
There is a scratch on the traces going from some of the pins near the bent ones, but I think it is only superficial, and that it doesn't actually cut through the traces.
Perhaps I am wrong, and that is the source of the problem? Anyone know the pinout of the chip? That might make it easier to figure out.

https://interruptrequest.files.wordpress.com/ … awe64_front.jpg
https://interruptrequest.files.wordpress.com/ … /awe64_back.jpg
https://interruptrequest.files.wordpress.com/ … 10/p1010608.jpg

WinXP : PIII 1.4GHz, 512MB RAM, 73GB SCSI HDD, Matrox Parhelia, SB Audigy 2.
Win98se : K6-3+ 500MHz, 256MB RAM, 80GB HDD, Matrox Millennium G400 MAX, Voodoo 2, SW1000XG.
DOS6.22 : Intel DX4, 64MB RAM, 1.6GB HDD, Diamond Stealth64 DRAM, GUS 1MB, SB16.

Reply 13 of 16, by cyclone3d

User metadata
Rank l33t++
Rank
l33t++

Well, not seeing anything obvious. Those pins you unbent do go to the ROM, so it makes sense that those being unbent fixed it being able to play from the ROM.

I was hoping to see a missing capacitor or resistor going to the RAM chips but it looks like everything is present. I'll try to take out my 4390 soon to compare.
It could be that one of the RAM chips has failed and is not being detected.

The scratch definitely looks superficial.

Yamaha modified setupds and drivers
Yamaha XG repository
YMF7x4 Guide
Aopen AW744L II SB-LINK

Reply 14 of 16, by LunarG

User metadata
Rank Oldbie
Rank
Oldbie

Would a dead ram chip prevent it from accessing memory on the SIMMCONN though? I suppose it might not look for more memory if it detects less than the full 4MB?

WinXP : PIII 1.4GHz, 512MB RAM, 73GB SCSI HDD, Matrox Parhelia, SB Audigy 2.
Win98se : K6-3+ 500MHz, 256MB RAM, 80GB HDD, Matrox Millennium G400 MAX, Voodoo 2, SW1000XG.
DOS6.22 : Intel DX4, 64MB RAM, 1.6GB HDD, Diamond Stealth64 DRAM, GUS 1MB, SB16.

Reply 15 of 16, by cyclone3d

User metadata
Rank l33t++
Rank
l33t++

I'm not sure... Is your Simmconn the original or one from the revival project?

Yamaha modified setupds and drivers
Yamaha XG repository
YMF7x4 Guide
Aopen AW744L II SB-LINK

Reply 16 of 16, by LunarG

User metadata
Rank Oldbie
Rank
Oldbie

It is from the revival. I guess it could be that none of my simms work with it.

WinXP : PIII 1.4GHz, 512MB RAM, 73GB SCSI HDD, Matrox Parhelia, SB Audigy 2.
Win98se : K6-3+ 500MHz, 256MB RAM, 80GB HDD, Matrox Millennium G400 MAX, Voodoo 2, SW1000XG.
DOS6.22 : Intel DX4, 64MB RAM, 1.6GB HDD, Diamond Stealth64 DRAM, GUS 1MB, SB16.