VOGONS


First post, by LightStruk

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Does anyone know what the differences are between the A and C revisions of the CMI8330? Is it a bug fix revision? A die shrink? Did features change?

What about the rebadged HT1869V? Does anyone know precisely which chip it really is?

I have the data sheet for the CMI8330A, but I can't find the data sheet for the CMI8330C anywhere. The C revision was found both on motherboards and on expansion cards. From what I can see in images online, the A revision was manufactured in 1997 and early 1998, with production switching to the C revision later in 1998.

Reply 1 of 33, by Marmes

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There are differences.
I have both version A and C.
Version A does not have 3D Sound on chip. While version C already has.
I never seen a version B.
I guess HT1869V is just a relabel of version C.
These chips have good compatibility, but current design makes them noisy.
I guess there is no ADPCM Support in DOS , but that 's not really a big deal, most of the games don't use it, only a handful of them and those have patches or fixes to run without ADPCM, like DN2.
Overall is a nice card.

Reply 2 of 33, by Tiido

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C version integrates the 3D chip that is normally external, it also makes the card more noisy due to it. I have not observed any other functional differences between various chip revisions.

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Reply 3 of 33, by carlostex

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I really like the CMI chip, though a few things really nag me. I don't like the WSS can't share resources with the SB part. The chip will take 3 IRQ's and 3 DMA's. And it seems WSS can't be disabled.

Also the mixer program writes to autoexec.bat everytime it runs. A little but annoying.

But overall a very good chip.

Reply 4 of 33, by appiah4

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I'm currently trying out a 8330 (Not sure what revision, never lifted the sticker to check but the 3D spatializer appears to be discrete so it's likely an A) in my Celeron 533 tinkerbox rig (which I use to basically tinker with various AGP/PCI/ISA cards for fun..)

Zoltrix-Audio-Plus-6400-3-D-Pn-P-V-5-AV310.jpg

This computer normally has an AWE64 Value in it. I am so pleasantly surprised by this card that I may possibly replace the AWE64 with this card + Dreamblaster S2.

It has decent line out, SPDIF In/Out, Wavetable header, bugfree MPU-401, what seems to be an integrated 100% OPL3 clone and both SB Pro and SB 16 compatibility. It is in theory the perfect ISA sound card. I just wish it had cleaner PCM. But it will do until the day comes when I can get an Orpheus 😁

The DOS drivers it comes with are a bit of a pain in the ass though. I believe UNISOUND covers this card so that's at least some relief.

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Reply 5 of 33, by ODwilly

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The integrated C-Media chip on my P4S Dragon is funny in that audio wise it seems ok, at least under XP, havent tried 98, but if you use it with a ps2 mouse it causes terrible cursor stuttering. I think one of the IRQ's is shared with the PS2 mouse port by default.

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Reply 6 of 33, by carlostex

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ODwilly wrote on 2021-01-05, 14:15:

The integrated C-Media chip on my P4S Dragon is funny in that audio wise it seems ok, at least under XP, havent tried 98, but if you use it with a ps2 mouse it causes terrible cursor stuttering. I think one of the IRQ's is shared with the PS2 mouse port by default.

Maybe it's the WSS IRQ. Unfortunately WSS can't be disabled and you cannot Share resources with SB.

Reply 7 of 33, by LightStruk

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appiah4 wrote on 2021-01-05, 14:05:

It has decent line out, SPDIF In/Out, Wavetable header, bugfree MPU-401, what seems to be an integrated 100% OPL3 clone and both SB Pro and SB 16 compatibility. It is in theory the perfect ISA sound card. I just wish it had cleaner PCM. But it will do until the day comes when I can get an Orpheus 😁

I ordered a CMI8330A card like yours yesterday from a super sketchy website (the TLD was ".top". Seriously.) The shipping costs more than the card, so the price was right. Anyway, I'm planning on trying the SPDIF out to see if it's noise-free. It's possible that the noise happens outside of the chip, or it might be happening in the mixer. If it happens in the mixer, then digital output won't help. I'll be disabling all of the analog inputs in the mixer to be sure.

Reply 8 of 33, by PARUS

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carlostex wrote on 2021-01-05, 14:34:

Maybe it's the WSS IRQ. Unfortunately WSS can't be disabled and you cannot Share resources with SB.

Unisound can disable. I have also modified DOS init for AV310 and it can put WSS+SB16 on single low DMA and single IRQ, or it can disable WSS too while SB16 is enabled. But this program can work only on one motherboard because of its BIOS. Sadly.

appiah4 wrote on 2021-01-05, 14:05:

It has decent line out, SPDIF In/Out, Wavetable header, bugfree MPU-401, what seems to be an integrated 100% OPL3 clone and both SB Pro and SB 16 compatibility. It is in theory the perfect ISA sound card. I just wish it had cleaner PCM. But it will do until the day comes when I can get an Orpheus 😁

Orpheus has not real S/PDIF output because CS4237 has not. CMI8330 has. I made tests with TB Malibu and AV310. Malibu doesn't give clear digital sound via S/PDIF and background noise is present always, it's ADC. CMI8330 gives clear sound and after playing I even see on my receiver's panel that PCM data stream is fading out and then absent. With TB Malibu PCM out on S/PDIF is present always. Why? Of course it's ADC! And: Malibu's "digital" sound is crap, CMI's digital sound is very clean.
And why "in theory"? CMI8330 is perfect in practice.

LightStruk wrote on 2021-01-05, 14:54:

I ordered a CMI8330A card like yours yesterday from a super sketchy website (the TLD was ".top". Seriously.) The shipping costs more than the card, so the price was right. Anyway, I'm planning on trying the SPDIF out to see if it's noise-free. It's possible that the noise happens outside of the chip, or it might be happening in the mixer. If it happens in the mixer, then digital output won't help. I'll be disabling all of the analog inputs in the mixer to be sure.

Do you really think "happens in the mixer" is a digital phase? It's absolutely wrong. CMI's mixer is totally analog. The analog noise happens inside the chip at analog phase but outside the chip too much more and the only terrible effect. All channels entering into the S/PDIF output are only three - S/PDIF IN, WAVE and FM. Nothing more. So it's noise-free not "if", it's noise-free for sure. S/PDIF input is working not ideally, may be distortions here, depends to other source and you'll never know until try it. CMI8330 "understands" 44kHz and 48kHz input signal (32-no!). 48>44 resampling is very poor but it is possible to listen; 44>44 without resampling sometimes may make distortions. Sound from daughterboard, from line input should be routed via other method, never present on CMI's digital output.

If you want digital+analog mixer with reasonable good quality for DOS games using with ISA cards you have only two ways. First is external mixer with analog and S/PDIF standards, second is PC with PCI+ISA bus and Live/Audigy card.

Reply 9 of 33, by carlostex

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PARUS wrote on 2021-01-06, 00:09:

Unisound can disable. I have also modified DOS init for AV310 and it can put WSS+SB16 on single low DMA and single IRQ, or it can disable WSS too while SB16 is enabled. But this program can work only on one motherboard because of its BIOS. Sadly.

Can you guide me through the process of disabling WSS using Unisound? What parameters should i put on the SET BLASTER before calling Unisound?

I don't mind SB16 taking DMA 1 and 5 but i do mind WSS stealing another IRQ and low DMA channel. I'm fine with WSS if it shares same resources as SB.

Reply 11 of 33, by keropi

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PARUS wrote on 2021-01-06, 00:09:

Orpheus has not real S/PDIF output because CS4237 has not. CMI8330 has. I made tests with TB Malibu and AV310. Malibu doesn't give clear digital sound via S/PDIF and background noise is present always, it's ADC. CMI8330 gives clear sound and after playing I even see on my receiver's panel that PCM data stream is fading out and then absent. With TB Malibu PCM out on S/PDIF is present always. Why? Of course it's ADC! And: Malibu's "digital" sound is crap, CMI's digital sound is very clean.
And why "in theory"? CMI8330 is perfect in practice.

I am sorry but this statement about CS4237 is completely wrong.
Not only there is the extensive CS4237 datasheet that can back this up but it can also be debunked from the the oprhinit "min. digital mode" that is exactly this: pure spdif output from 4237+YMF289 without any ADC involved - that is why all other sources are getting disabled.
If you want a fully-fledged soundcard output with your fancy wt board , your line-in and your cd-audio then ofcourse ADC block will get activated and ofcourse it will introduce to the output signal whatever deficiencies the analog sources have.
The fact that CMI "shuts off" the s/pdif signal when no activity is present means nothing at all, if anything it's like later soundblasters that physically disconnect analog output when there is no sound playing so there is the impression of a really quiet card (not a bad idea tbh)
And please don't compare Orpheus to Malibu or any other CS4237-based card. The only comparison that can be made is when you want to see if a game likes CS4237 and works as expected. Even s/pdif output is better implemented on Orpheus without cheapening out on it - that was the point of many revisions and sending cards to knowledgeable people for testing and critique.

Having said that I also like the CMI8830 chip but sadly 99% of it's implementations were cheap/budget cards.

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Reply 12 of 33, by Marmes

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PARUS wrote on 2021-01-06, 00:09:

Orpheus has not real S/PDIF output because CS4237 has not. CMI8330 has. I made tests with TB Malibu and AV310. Malibu doesn't give clear digital sound via S/PDIF and background noise is present always, it's ADC. CMI8330 gives clear sound and after playing I even see on my receiver's panel that PCM data stream is fading out and then absent. With TB Malibu PCM out on S/PDIF is present always. Why? Of course it's ADC! And: Malibu's "digital" sound is crap, CMI's digital sound is very clean.
And why "in theory"? CMI8330 is perfect in practice.

About Malibu or Orpheus not having real SPDIF, you are totally wrong. They both have SPDIF and they respect IEC-958 specification. CMI DOES NOT respect specification.
So CMI IS THE CHIP that doesn't comply with SPDIF specifications. If it does comply, show me where its written.
I also want to know how you disable WSS, because CMI IS a WSS chip with SB Support, if you disable WSS, you disable the card. On official CMI instruction manual this is stated. Or CMI would be a SB card.
Your experience with SPDIF on Malibu was with Unisound, I presume. If that's the case , Jazefox already knows there is an issue to be resolved there. I do own a Malibu64 and 2 versions of CMIi330, and as Tiido says ,it cand be noisy, if you use a certain version. I can say that Malibu kicks CMI's ass in terms of audio quality and noise. Thd wise is 10x quieter than CMI. Orphinit corrected this matter, CS4237 is so cotumizable ,you can do many things, even wrong things. Crystal codecs were reference audiophile dac/adc. Even today, Cirrus, that bought crystal,makes codecs for top audio card brands ,even cmedia recommends.
Yamaha cards are others that work perfect in many ways. These are cards that can be very clean, in fact it's the only chip, in my audiotrix 3dxg, that has a crystal clear sound like Malibu or Orpheus. Tiido I need your card in my collection!😁
So you should read datasheets and be more specific when you say something.
Comments like yours could lead to wrong decisions for less experienced users.

CMI8330 IS an excellent chip, but you cannot compare with others. All manufacturers use different aproachs to add compatibility to a cheap designed card like SB.
Some are more acurate than others. But they all have their strong points and weak points, it's a matter of what's better for you and what you want to compromise.

This is like comparing FM aproaches from ess, yamaha, crystal ,alsfm, cmifm. It's a matter of taste. For me I like CrystalFM, and not too keen on ess, but they are all good in their way. Matter of personal taste.

CMI does not support Adpcm in DOS, some other card support it . Ones IMA standard, others Creative. So no, CMI8330 is NOT the perfect card.

Check another one.

Reply 13 of 33, by appiah4

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PARUS wrote on 2021-01-06, 00:09:
appiah4 wrote on 2021-01-05, 14:05:

It has decent line out, SPDIF In/Out, Wavetable header, bugfree MPU-401, what seems to be an integrated 100% OPL3 clone and both SB Pro and SB 16 compatibility. It is in theory the perfect ISA sound card. I just wish it had cleaner PCM. But it will do until the day comes when I can get an Orpheus 😁

Orpheus has not real S/PDIF output because CS4237 has not. CMI8330 has. I made tests with TB Malibu and AV310. Malibu doesn't give clear digital sound via S/PDIF and background noise is present always, it's ADC. CMI8330 gives clear sound and after playing I even see on my receiver's panel that PCM data stream is fading out and then absent. With TB Malibu PCM out on S/PDIF is present always. Why? Of course it's ADC! And: Malibu's "digital" sound is crap, CMI's digital sound is very clean.
And why "in theory"? CMI8330 is perfect in practice.

Well, as far as I know its SPDIF In/Out is 5V and not directly compatible with most audio gear, no?

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Reply 14 of 33, by PARUS

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Marmes wrote on 2021-01-06, 12:20:

They both have SPDIF and they respect IEC-958 specification. CMI DOES NOT respect specification.

What the hell do you waving with IEC-958 in front of my nose? Does CMI8330 make digital 44kHz 16bit? Yes, it does. Does it sound? Yes. It sounds excellent. I'm hearing it very good and don't care if it respects IEC-958 or not. It sounds good and has good compatibility, I don't need anything more.

Marmes wrote on 2021-01-06, 12:20:

Your experience with SPDIF on Malibu was with Unisound, I presume.

Unfortunately you presume wrong, my sage. No. I have tried it with its own Windows driver, the sound from LINE OUT was very very excellent (much better than on AV310), the sound from S/PDIF was a real bullshit (much worse than on AV310). I was not interested in Orpheus because of Malibu S/PDIF bad experience.

Marmes wrote on 2021-01-06, 12:20:

I also want to know how you disable WSS, because CMI IS a WSS chip with SB Support, if you disable WSS, you disable the card. On official CMI instruction manual this is stated. Or CMI would be a SB card.

You say so right! Probably you know all in the world, do you? I say you again: I disable on my AV310 WSS part easy while SB part is working and I don't care about specs, manuals, standards and other bloody rules if it really works! I attach this utility to this message but it works only with one motherboard (compiled for it). If I try to run it on other mobos it shows "reset ISA bus". If somebody can adapt it to any motherboard it would be great. Regular cminit.exe has these command line keys:
/VA:220 /VI:05 /VL:01 /VH:05 /VE /WA:530 /WI:11 /WM:00 /FM:398 /MI:10 /MA:330 /ME /GS:201
This utility has keys typed in HEX mode:
/VA:0220 /VI:05 /VL:01 /VH:05 /VE /WA:0530 /WI:0B /WM:01 /FM:0398 /WD /MI:0A /MA:0330 /ME
As you see WSS and SB use one low DMA and WSS can be disabled with /WD key.

Filename
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If somebody can disassemble and analyze this program please welcome. It's for CMI8330. I think anybody would be happy if possible to put WSS+SB on one low DMA or disable WSS at all. Unfortunately as I said it's working now properly on one motherboard only. On others it resets ISA bus.

Marmes wrote on 2021-01-06, 12:20:

I can say that Malibu kicks CMI's ass in terms of audio quality and noise. Thd wise is 10x quieter than CMI. Orphinit corrected this matter, CS4237 is so cotumizable ,you can do many things, even wrong things.

And I can say that I'm hearing just the opposite. You're so wise, you know all, you give me advices, you scold me, you tell me that I must read specs.
OK, let's suppose that Orpheus is totally, completely different card. I did listening Malibu once and it was terrible! I was very surprised that S/PDIF sound is much worse than LINE OUT sound. It was a new card. My reciever is Sony DA1200ES.

keropi wrote on 2021-01-06, 11:38:

Even s/pdif output is better implemented on Orpheus without cheapening out on it - that was the point of many revisions and sending cards to knowledgeable people for testing and critique.

OK. And what you mean "even S/PDIF"? Only S/PDIF! I didn't say anywhere that analog output is not good. Only S/PDIF! I said it was bullshit on new Malibu card. Can you tell something about it? It would be very interesting. What S/PDIF "testing and critique"? What the difference compare to Malibu's S/PDIF (except min digital mode)? Thank you.

Marmes wrote on 2021-01-06, 12:20:
Crystal codecs were reference audiophile dac/adc. Even today, Cirrus, that bought crystal,makes codecs for top audio card brands […]
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Crystal codecs were reference audiophile dac/adc. Even today, Cirrus, that bought crystal,makes codecs for top audio card brands ,even cmedia recommends.
Yamaha cards are others that work perfect in many ways. These are cards that can be very clean, in fact it's the only chip, in my audiotrix 3dxg, that has a crystal clear sound like Malibu or Orpheus. Tiido I need your card in my collection!😁
So you should read datasheets and be more specific when you say something.
Comments like yours could lead to wrong decisions for less experienced users.

Maybe you can read some poetry about Crystal, Cirrus Logic and their datasheets? Don't tell me what I should do please. Are you sure you're telling all right and don't lead wrong conclusions for users?
Malibu does not have crystal clear sound on its digital output. Probably it's some manufacture mistake.

Marmes wrote on 2021-01-06, 12:20:

CMI8330 IS an excellent chip, but you cannot compare with others. All manufacturers use different aproachs to add compatibility to a cheap designed card like SB.
Some are more acurate than others. But they all have their strong points and weak points, it's a matter of what's better for you and what you want to compromise.

Dear sage, I'm not stupid and I understand all this. I didn't compare their compatibility, accuracy, specifications compliance. I compared S/PDIF sound quality only. On CS4237 and CMI8330. It were Malibu and AV310. Malibu was shit, AV310 excellent. If I'm wrong about CS4237 and Orpheus proves it I will very glad. Really!

Marmes wrote on 2021-01-06, 12:20:

CMI does not support Adpcm in DOS, some other card support it . Ones IMA standard, others Creative. So no, CMI8330 is NOT the perfect card.

It's a cavil about ADPCM. CMI8330 IS the card with the perfect S/PDIF output. Therefore CMI8330 is perfect because there are not a lot of ISA cards with good digital output. For example AWE64 plays via its S/PDIF only EMU MIDI and CQM FM but no WAVE "SFX".

Thank you.

Reply 15 of 33, by PARUS

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appiah4 wrote on 2021-01-06, 12:43:

Well, as far as I know its SPDIF In/Out is 5V and not directly compatible with most audio gear, no?

It does not matter. Both TTL and COAX are full-fledged proper S/PDIF. They differ in signal amplitude only. If you have TTL (2-3+ V, often 4-5V) and need COAX you can just use this:
s-l1600.jpg

Reply 16 of 33, by Joseph_Joestar

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PARUS wrote on 2021-01-07, 20:50:

For example AWE64 plays via its S/PDIF only EMU MIDI and CQM FM but no WAVE "SFX".

Do you mean sound effects and voice? The manual of the AWE64 Gold states that it can output digital audio through SPDIF, but only if it's running at 44.1 kHz. So in theory, you should be able to record it from some late-era DOS games like Crusader: No Remorse which do support that.

Disclaimer: I haven't actually tried this on my CT4390 yet. I'm just going off of what is written in the manual:

The digital audio signals from the SPDIF Out jack contain audio output from the EMU8000 wavetable chip mixed with digital voice playback if the playback is in 16-bit stereo mode, 44.1 kHz CD quality.

Using Audigy drivers with a Sound Blaster Live
Installing DOS drivers on an Audigy2 ZS
OPL3 vs. ESFM vs. CQM vs. SBLive
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Reply 17 of 33, by keropi

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PARUS, you went from "Orpheus has not real S/PDIF output because CS4237 has not" to weird custom init programs that work only with 1 mobo to prove you are correct about another thing and from there to assuming your bad windows malibu experience is a universal truth of some sorts.

Maybe you had a broken malibu card, maybe you had your SRS sliders to max, maybe your receiver just does not like Malibu's output, maybe you installed old drivers, maybe your connection was not isolated, maybe the CS4237 in your card was bad, maybe it was one of the first revisions, maybe maybe... don't know - don't care.
(and YES, orpheus's s/pdif circuit is different than the malibu one that misses things - probably because TB though "eh it works it's ok" and 1997 was a different time)

You have the hots for the 8830 s/pdif output that's fine and good for you. Just don't insist on false facts and most important of all stop dragging in the mud other cards that you don't even own.
I am not in the habit of selling fraudulent and misleading products or just outright lie to people about Orpheus's capabilities.
What I claim I can backup with those pesky things called datasheets and their hidden poetry 🤣 - not with arguments of the "it did not work for me therefore it's all a gigantic scam" nature.

This is all I am ever gonna say about the matter, not really interested in continuing this pointless discussion further.

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Reply 18 of 33, by PARUS

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keropi, I did not go from to wierd custom. I told all one at a time, step by step.

keropi wrote on 2021-01-07, 22:39:

Maybe you had a broken malibu card

Yes, maybe

keropi wrote on 2021-01-07, 22:39:

maybe you had your SRS sliders to max

No

keropi wrote on 2021-01-07, 22:39:

maybe your receiver just does not like Malibu's output

No, I tried with different routing too (through spdif input of other cards).

keropi wrote on 2021-01-07, 22:39:

maybe you installed old drivers

Maybe.

keropi wrote on 2021-01-07, 22:39:

maybe your connection was not isolated

No.

keropi wrote on 2021-01-07, 22:39:

maybe the CS4237 in your card was bad

Yes, maybe.

keropi wrote on 2021-01-07, 22:39:

maybe it was one of the first revisions

What can you say about earlier revisions?

keropi wrote on 2021-01-07, 22:39:

(and YES, orpheus's s/pdif circuit is different than the malibu one that misses things - probably because TB though "eh it works it's ok" and 1997 was a different time)

Probably because? Tell please don't you know or don't you want to say?

keropi wrote on 2021-01-07, 22:39:

You have the hots for the 8830 s/pdif output that's fine and good for you. Just don't insist on false facts and most important of all stop dragging in the mud other cards that you don't even own.
I am not in the habit of selling fraudulent and misleading products or just outright lie to people about Orpheus's capabilities.

What? Am I blaming you? I have not a right to accuse you of dishonesty, don't say this stupidity! I'm interested in details because didn't have more tests than one Malibu.

PARUS wrote on 2021-01-07, 20:50:

Malibu was shit, AV310 excellent. If I'm wrong about CS4237 and Orpheus proves it I will very glad. Really!

Really.

Reply 19 of 33, by Marmes

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PARUS wrote on 2021-01-07, 20:50:

What the hell do you waving with IEC-958 in front of my nose? Does CMI8330 make digital 44kHz 16bit? Yes, it does. Does it sound? Yes. It sounds excellent. I'm hearing it very good and don't care if it respects IEC-958 or not. It sounds good and has good compatibility, I don't need anything more.

Well Standards do exist for something, if you work out of standards that's your problem. If CMI is the best card for you! Great!
If you don't need anything more, why are you discussing this if you already have your opinion. Where is the complete datasheet of CMI describing all you say it can do?

PARUS wrote on 2021-01-07, 20:50:

Unfortunately you presume wrong, my sage. No. I have tried it with its own Windows driver, the sound from LINE OUT was very very excellent (much better than on AV310), the sound from S/PDIF was a real bullshit (much worse than on AV310). I was not interested in Orpheus because of Malibu S/PDIF bad experience.

As I said, and I can prove it it to you, CS4237 can have plenty configurations, even bad, it's a very flexible chip, you can route sound in many ways. So I say for sure that you did something wrong or you have a bad sound card, because I do have a Malibu and a CMI, and I still say with a good and a bad DAC, it always has an excellent sound! I'm not even talking about orpheus so you don't think I'm protecting the card me an keropi made.

PARUS wrote on 2021-01-07, 20:50:
You say so right! Probably you know all in the world, do you? I say you again: I disable on my AV310 WSS part easy while SB part […]
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You say so right! Probably you know all in the world, do you? I say you again: I disable on my AV310 WSS part easy while SB part is working and I don't care about specs, manuals, standards and other bloody rules if it really works! I attach this utility to this message but it works only with one motherboard (compiled for it). If I try to run it on other mobos it shows "reset ISA bus". If somebody can adapt it to any motherboard it would be great. Regular cminit.exe has these command line keys:
/VA:220 /VI:05 /VL:01 /VH:05 /VE /WA:530 /WI:11 /WM:00 /FM:398 /MI:10 /MA:330 /ME /GS:201
This utility has keys typed in HEX mode:
/VA:0220 /VI:05 /VL:01 /VH:05 /VE /WA:0530 /WI:0B /WM:01 /FM:0398 /WD /MI:0A /MA:0330 /ME
As you see WSS and SB use one low DMA and WSS can be disabled with /WD key.

cminit2.zip

If somebody can disassemble and analyze this program please welcome. It's for CMI8330. I think anybody would be happy if possible to put WSS+SB on one low DMA or disable WSS at all. Unfortunately as I said it's working now properly on one motherboard only. On others it resets ISA bus.

Well I don't know anything, but apparently you know all, so what can I say? And why should people reverse engineer software if they can do things with documentation available....Oh wait there is no detailed documentation for CMI8330.
You sound like those software houses that say it can only be used with one type of hardware configuration or game will not run, so you must buy that hardware to run the game!

PARUS wrote on 2021-01-07, 20:50:

And I can say that I'm hearing just the opposite. You're so wise, you know all, you give me advices, you scold me, you tell me that I must read specs.
OK, let's suppose that Orpheus is totally, completely different card. I did listening Malibu once and it was terrible! I was very surprised that S/PDIF sound is much worse than LINE OUT sound. It was a new card. My reciever is Sony DA1200ES.

I didn't scold you, if you feel that way, it's your problem. You scold many people here that dedicate their time to make things, not everyone can be please. You just said that CMI8330 is the best and CS4237 is "crap" in SPDIF.
I never said that CMI or anyother card is crap, I value each card . As I said they have their good and bad things!

PARUS wrote on 2021-01-07, 20:50:

OK. And what you mean "even S/PDIF"? Only S/PDIF! I didn't say anywhere that analog output is not good. Only S/PDIF! I said it was bullshit on new Malibu card. Can you tell something about it? It would be very interesting. What S/PDIF "testing and critique"? What the difference compare to Malibu's S/PDIF (except min digital mode)? Thank you.

I will not repeat myself , I don't like it.

PARUS wrote on 2021-01-07, 20:50:

Maybe you can read some poetry about Crystal, Cirrus Logic and their datasheets? Don't tell me what I should do please. Are you sure you're telling all right and don't lead wrong conclusions for users?
Malibu does not have crystal clear sound on its digital output. Probably it's some manufacture mistake.

I'm not the poet here , you are, you're the one that says wonderful things about a subject and bashing others.

PARUS wrote on 2021-01-07, 20:50:

Dear sage, I'm not stupid and I understand all this. I didn't compare their compatibility, accuracy, specifications compliance. I compared S/PDIF sound quality only. On CS4237 and CMI8330. It were Malibu and AV310. Malibu was shit, AV310 excellent. If I'm wrong about CS4237 and Orpheus proves it I will very glad. Really!

No one called you stupid, or yes?
You come here and describe your personal experience, which is not the same as mine and other people that own malibu cards and you want to be right and others are all wrong.

PARUS wrote on 2021-01-07, 20:50:

It's a cavil about ADPCM. CMI8330 IS the card with the perfect S/PDIF output. Therefore CMI8330 is perfect because there are not a lot of ISA cards with good digital output. For example AWE64 plays via its S/PDIF only EMU MIDI and CQM FM but no WAVE "SFX".

Thank you.

Did I mention the opposite? CMI8330 outputs SPDIF, that's nice...But does it respect IEC958? Because IEC958 may be important to me and others, maybe if it doesn't support is a deal break for me or others, if it's not for you , then GREAT for you! Keep you card and enjoy it!