VOGONS


First post, by zaphod77

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Not to be confused with BALLADE.MID, JAZZ.MID, MINUET.MID, and REGGAE.MID. 😀

i've litereally found ONE recording of each of these on the net.

https://www.vgmpf.com/Wiki/index.php?title=Ballad_2
https://www.vgmpf.com/Wiki/index.php?title=Reggae_2
https://www.vgmpf.com/Wiki/index.php?title=Jazz_3
https://www.vgmpf.com/Wiki/index.php?title=Minuet_In_G_Major

Anyone have a way to get these to playback right on modern systems withotu actually runnign windows 3.1 and installing those old pre general midi sound drivers?

(yes these midis use a non gm compatible instrument map that was used in the old dos voyetra sequencer, and the old dos SB music FM driver, that also wodl play these exact same midis).

I remember trying to fix these midis by hand way back in the day, because the NEW gm compatible windows driver broke them, and they just sounded wrong. For example, the grand piano instrument needed to be changed to Bright Grand Piano to get the piano to sound right, and that wasn't the only change needed.

I'm sure that if i can get my hands on the 2 and 4 op super sapi banks and load them into libadlmidi somehow. I can play these back right.

Reply 1 of 10, by zaphod77

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Anyone at least have the darned instrument map? I've been trying to find a copy of the sequencer with the pre-GM instrument mapping in it, and failing completely. also the versions i've found so far have the 4op drivers, and i want the 2 perator bank. the midi files itself for ballad2 is no help, just calling the non piano non bass track "Melody", and it's most definitely not the pan flute used for ballade.mid

Reply 2 of 10, by NJRoadfan

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The following file might work (came with the driver). If you have the SuperSAPI! Windows drivers installed, load it via the palette selection screen. Tested it and it seems to work, canyon.mid is noticeably less rich sounding. You will get confirmation of "128 Patches Read" by the driver after loading.

Attachments

  • Filename
    OPL32OP.zip
    File size
    3.92 KiB
    Downloads
    9 downloads
    File comment
    Voyetra SuperSAPI! 2-OP Palette File.
    File license
    Fair use/fair dealing exception

Reply 4 of 10, by NJRoadfan

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Based on what I've...heard...that's about right. WIndows FM MIDI drivers almost always map to GM instruments by default. Given the samples were recorded under Windows on that site, one can assume the MIDI files are GM, or close to it. The SuperSAPI! driver is exclusively an OPL3 driver since it supports stereo and 4OP modes. There may be an earlier revision of the driver that came with the dual-OPL2 SB Pros (different register layout, no 4OP, and limited stereo). Maybe the 2OP palette approximates this with the OPL3 driver?

Reply 5 of 10, by NJRoadfan

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The recordings on that site sound close to the default Windows OPL driver, aka the Yamaha reference driver that uses The Fat Man patch set. This is the same OPL2/3 driver that comes with Windows 9x. OK, not quite, the drums are definitely the Voyetra patch set. I'm going with an early Voyetra Windows driver for those, I just have to find it.

Reply 6 of 10, by zaphod77

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there's an old windows 3.0 driver, and a newer one.

the old one didn't use a GM compatible instrument mapping.

these four midi files came with sound blaster and sound blaster pro, and played correctly with those drivers only, and not with the newer updated GM compatible drivers.

the versions that game with later drivers were without the numbers at the end of the filename, and had different mappings that were more GM compatible, but did NOT sound the same. Reggae's melody is an octave lower than reggae 2 and the instruments are different, ballade uses pan flute instead of whatever chromatic percussion the version i'm talking about sounds like it's using (though the bass was corrected to fingered bass instead of saxophone 🤣), and jazz while most similar still sounded better as jazz3 on the old re GM drivers.

As i said, i want that non gm patch list, so i can remap the instruments correctly, and then play them on fat man 2 op or the voyetra gm 2-op patchsets, and then try it on real synths. my copy of sequencer plus pro has the gm 4-op opl3 driver, which definitely sound different from the two op, and thus can't be used to id the patch by trial and error. The fat man 2-op doesn't actually seem to have that instrument, though a number of them sound similar.

I strongly suspect that the instrument was intended to be vibraphone, judging by the tremolo present that exists on a real vibraphone with the fan on, but i don't have access to the voyetra 2-op patchset in adlplug to mess around with.

If someone can find me that bank in wopl format or something else adlplug can load, i can probably get my answer.

Reply 7 of 10, by zaphod77

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ok, i figured out the darn instrument mapping. it's MT-32. because of course it is. That's the pre gm standard, of COURSE it was that.

therefore, ballad 2 uses warm bell, which translates as tubular bells according to SCUMM, which is really darn similar in the fat man 2 op patchset, and probably identical in the voyetra 2 op one.

so those four midi files are actually composed for the mt32 instrument mapping, which has acoustic piano three instead of electric grand, which explains why it's not right. and the bass is suposed to be accoustic bas, not fingered electric, so that's wrong in ballad.mid as well.

so, mystery solved. 😀

Reply 8 of 10, by NJRoadfan

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Somehow I suspected that. I have a few other MIDI files that were composed for the MT-32 that I managed to sound "decent" on OPL3 by changing the instrument mappings. The MIDI Mapper in Windows 3.1 allows you to set custom patch maps as well. The built-in MT-32 and EMU Proteus "drivers" do this for you. Those mappings get erased when you install a 3rd party driver though since Microsoft never setup a way to programmatically add new MIDI maps. All drivers just copy a whole new MIDIMAP.CFG file!

Reply 9 of 10, by zaphod77

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also it seems that what i really want is a (virtual) sound canvass in mt-32 mode to play those midi files on, as those GS devices have many of those instruments that were on mt32 and not on general midi, like the 303 acid bass and dr. solo, presumably one of them is "warm bell", though i have no idea which.

Anyone have the instrument mapping for a high end sound canvas mt-32 mode? with that, i can remap those midis to GS mode.

Actually, anyone have a FM 2op and 4op GS patch set? 😀

Still want the 2 op drivers for sequencer plus pro, and i can't find them. there doesn't seem to be a TAPISB.COM anywhere, and no amoutn of mesing with vpi and sapi gets them to operate on my copy of sequencer.

and wow. so warm bell IS included in an actual sound canvas in bank 127, but it's a combination of two other voices, and of course the manual doesn't say which one. And it's NOT included in any of the GS maps. what the heck, Roland???

so i just need to set CC00 to 127 in the midi file, and then they should play back correctly on roland devices that actually have the mt-32 mode.

Reply 10 of 10, by zaphod77

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finally figured out how to get seq plus gold to operate. but even with the opl2 sapi drivers (either version) they still don't have a patch that sounds like their mt32 one.

the hunt for the mt-32 fm bank continues...