That sounds like it might be a ground loop, except for the fact that doing nothing more than swapping in the old sound card fixes it.

As a test, can you plug in headphones directly to the sound card instead of the speakers ( which I presume are AC mains powered )? Maybe the issue is linked to an interaction with the speakers and the new card.

darry wrote on 2024-02-03, 16:01:

That sounds like it might be a ground loop, except for the fact that doing nothing more than swapping in the old sound card fixes it.

As a test, can you plug in headphones directly to the sound card instead of the speakers ( which I presume are AC mains powered )? Maybe the issue is linked to an interaction with the speakers and the new card.

But I tested 2 different speakers - same results. One thing in common is they're both USB powered. And yeah I've tested yet another sound card in same config - Yamaha YMF724 - this also gives clear audio.

I'll test both the working sound card and the vortex 2 using earphones, and post the outcome here in a while..

> both USB powered

Did you power them from the PC's USB ports, or from some external PSU? And were you consistent with where everything was plugged in (including the outlet in case of external power)?

elszgensa wrote on 2024-02-03, 16:29:

> both USB powered

Did you power them from the PC's USB ports, or from some external PSU? And were you consistent with where everything was plugged in (including the outlet in case of external power)?

Yes, same USB port for both speakers. There's no external power for either speaker

I guess I'll test the vortex 2 sound card on another motherboard? It's newer (P5KPL) than the 775i65G. Just to see if there's some fundamental incompatibility between the current mobo and that sound card

Quick update - I just tested the two sound cards (the working one - CS4281 and the problematic one - vortex 2) on a different motherboard (P5KPL-AM/PS). Again, clear audio with CS4281 and still humming sound with vortex 2.

Seems pretty definitive now that it's a sound card issue. Is there any way to further troubleshoot exactly what part of the sound card is giving the issue, and how to fix it?

xtreger wrote on 2024-02-03, 17:07:

Quick update - I just tested the two sound cards (the working one - CS4281 and the problematic one - vortex 2) on a different motherboard (P5KPL-AM/PS). Again, clear audio with CS4281 and still humming sound with vortex 2.

Seems pretty definitive now that it's a sound card issue. Is there any way to further troubleshoot exactly what part of the sound card is giving the issue, and how to fix it?

I would tend to agree with that assessment.

I cannot really suggest debugging strategies (not in my skill set), other than looking at the card closely to try to spot potential damage or degradation, as a starting point.

I can suggest a potential workaround, however. If your card has coaxial or optical digital, using an inexpensive external DAC might be an option .

Another bit of info that hopefully helps with debugging - there are 4 slots in the sound card - "in", "front", "back", "mic". Switching between front and back doesn't eliminate humming - just that the volume output of the "back" slot is higher.

For both front and back slots (the only difference being that sounds and humming are both louder for the back slot),
1. when I unplug the USB keyboard, the humming reduces, but doesn't go away
2. when I move the mouse (PS2), it temporarily changes to a different kind of humming (higher pitched) for a few seconds, and then switches back to "default" humming
3. while I'm moving the mouse, there's kind of a static-y noise accompanying the mouse movement
4. when I plug the USB keyboard back in, the humming becomes quite louder

And this is the additional info I could gather

Very sorry for the double post. But I thought a video would illustrate the issue better: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OEO97wBTXbs

I recently bought one of those Covox/DSS replicas from Tindie and was so disappointed when I plugged it in. The hum was unbearable and was really obvious even when I had music playing through it. I bought a ground loop isolator from Amazon for $10 and it fixed the problem. I now have a great little sound device that I can use with old laptops that don't have a sound card. I'm not sure if this would help you, but it might be worth trying, as you can get one for cheap. This is the one that I got:

https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B0171PQLB8/r … e?ie=UTF8&psc=1

xtreger wrote on 2024-02-03, 18:05:

Very sorry for the double post. But I thought a video would illustrate the issue better: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OEO97wBTXbs

I also had that high pitched squeal with my Covox. That sounds pretty close to how I remember it.

If you have any of those USB cable with a cylinder in them, you might want to try them as well. The cylinder is a ferrite choke and a lot of musicians recommend them. I'm not sure if it's a myth or not, but it wouldn't hurt trying if you have any lying around.

Could you post a photo of the humming card, both front & back .

weedeewee wrote on 2024-02-03, 18:42:

Could you post a photo of the humming card, both front & back .

Here they are: https://imgur.com/a/JhEwflj

And another thing - even when I use the normal sound card, if I turn the volume all the way to max, then I can hear a very very slight hum if I put my ear right next to the speaker (WITHOUT USB keyboard plugged in). And once I plug the keyboard in, then that same humming tone comes up - BUT it's still very faint even at max volume.

So this means that even a normal sound card is giving that hum - it's just imperceptible. And the vortex 2 is giving that same hum, but at much much higher volume.

xtreger wrote on 2024-02-03, 19:23:

Here they are: https://imgur.com/a/JhEwflj […]
Show full quote

weedeewee wrote on 2024-02-03, 18:42:

Could you post a photo of the humming card, both front & back .

Here they are: https://imgur.com/a/JhEwflj

And another thing - even when I use the normal sound card, if I turn the volume all the way to max, then I can hear a very very slight hum if I put my ear right next to the speaker (WITHOUT USB keyboard plugged in). And once I plug the keyboard in, then that same humming tone comes up - BUT it's still very faint even at max volume.

So this means that even a normal sound card is giving that hum - it's just imperceptible. And the vortex 2 is giving that same hum, but at much much higher volume.

That is not a Vortex 2 (aka Aureal AU8830 based card ), unless the main chip is remarked .

EDIT : Your card's PCB looks a lot like the one in this thread . Generic Aureal Vortex 2 - Worth It?
Except yours has Vortex Intex branding on PCB and obviously the markings on the main chip .

EDIT2 : Does your card work with official Aureal drivers ? Official Crystal Semiconductor drivers ? Or are you using the drivers provided with the card (which could have been altered as part of a chip remarking to look like something else) ?

EDIT3: CS4624 and AU8830 are not software compatible and I doubt that they would happen to be pin-compatible .

darry wrote on 2024-02-03, 20:03:

That is not a Vortex 2 (aka Aureal AU8830 based card ), unless the main chip is remarked . […]
Show full quote

xtreger wrote on 2024-02-03, 19:23:

Here they are: https://imgur.com/a/JhEwflj […]
Show full quote

weedeewee wrote on 2024-02-03, 18:42:

Could you post a photo of the humming card, both front & back .

Here they are: https://imgur.com/a/JhEwflj

And another thing - even when I use the normal sound card, if I turn the volume all the way to max, then I can hear a very very slight hum if I put my ear right next to the speaker (WITHOUT USB keyboard plugged in). And once I plug the keyboard in, then that same humming tone comes up - BUT it's still very faint even at max volume.

So this means that even a normal sound card is giving that hum - it's just imperceptible. And the vortex 2 is giving that same hum, but at much much higher volume.

That is not a Vortex 2 (aka Aureal AU8830 based card ), unless the main chip is remarked .

EDIT : Your card's PCB looks a lot like the one in this thread . Generic Aureal Vortex 2 - Worth It?
Except yours has Vortex branding on PCB and obviously the markings on the main chip .

EDIT2 : Does your card work with official Aureal drivers ? Official Crystal Semiconductor drivers ? Or are you using the drivers provided with the card (which could have been altered as part of a chip remarking to look like something else) ?

EDIT3: CS4624 and AU8830 are not software compatible and I doubt that they would happen to be pin-compatible .

I used the AU8830 drivers on vogons first. They were giving some primary PCI slot related message. Then I uninstalled them and installed vortex 2 drivers provided on philscomputerlab website. These drivers installed just fine along with all components like gameport, etc.

xtreger wrote on 2024-02-03, 20:16:

darry wrote on 2024-02-03, 20:03:

That is not a Vortex 2 (aka Aureal AU8830 based card ), unless the main chip is remarked . […]
Show full quote

xtreger wrote on 2024-02-03, 19:23:

Here they are: https://imgur.com/a/JhEwflj

And another thing - even when I use the normal sound card, if I turn the volume all the way to max, then I can hear a very very slight hum if I put my ear right next to the speaker (WITHOUT USB keyboard plugged in). And once I plug the keyboard in, then that same humming tone comes up - BUT it's still very faint even at max volume.

So this means that even a normal sound card is giving that hum - it's just imperceptible. And the vortex 2 is giving that same hum, but at much much higher volume.

That is not a Vortex 2 (aka Aureal AU8830 based card ), unless the main chip is remarked .

EDIT : Your card's PCB looks a lot like the one in this thread . Generic Aureal Vortex 2 - Worth It?
Except yours has Vortex Intex branding on PCB and obviously the markings on the main chip .

EDIT2 : Does your card work with official Aureal drivers ? Official Crystal Semiconductor drivers ? Or are you using the drivers provided with the card (which could have been altered as part of a chip remarking to look like something else) ?

EDIT3: CS4624 and AU8830 are not software compatible and I doubt that they would happen to be pin-compatible .

I used the AU8830 drivers on vogons first. They were giving some primary PCI slot related message. Then I uninstalled them and installed vortex 2 drivers provided on philscomputerlab website. These drivers installed just fine along with all components like gameport, etc.

The good news is that either is actually an Aureal chip that has been re-marked as a C4624 for some odd (to me) reason OR some company cloned a Vortex chip AND marked it wrong . The first scenario is most likely.

If we add all this together, it seems very likely that your card is cheaply designed and built, probably with left over chips from after when Aureal went out of business .
EDIT : So the noise issue might be due to the card's design, unfortunately .

EDIT2 : You might be able to add S/PDIF out to the card by doing something similar to this Aureal Vortex 2 (Montego II) S/PDIF connection and digital output drivers?

EDIT3: Did you make sure to mute all the unused inputs on the cards (line-in , microphone and anything input related that may appear in the mixer but may not actually exist on the card) ? The noise might be coming from one of the inputs.

darry wrote on 2024-02-03, 20:03:

That is not a Vortex 2 (aka Aureal AU8830 based card ), unless the main chip is remarked . […]
Show full quote

xtreger wrote on 2024-02-03, 19:23:

Here they are: https://imgur.com/a/JhEwflj […]
Show full quote

weedeewee wrote on 2024-02-03, 18:42:

Could you post a photo of the humming card, both front & back .

Here they are: https://imgur.com/a/JhEwflj

And another thing - even when I use the normal sound card, if I turn the volume all the way to max, then I can hear a very very slight hum if I put my ear right next to the speaker (WITHOUT USB keyboard plugged in). And once I plug the keyboard in, then that same humming tone comes up - BUT it's still very faint even at max volume.

So this means that even a normal sound card is giving that hum - it's just imperceptible. And the vortex 2 is giving that same hum, but at much much higher volume.

That is not a Vortex 2 (aka Aureal AU8830 based card ), unless the main chip is remarked .

EDIT : Your card's PCB looks a lot like the one in this thread . Generic Aureal Vortex 2 - Worth It?
Except yours has Vortex Intex branding on PCB and obviously the markings on the main chip .

EDIT2 : Does your card work with official Aureal drivers ? Official Crystal Semiconductor drivers ? Or are you using the drivers provided with the card (which could have been altered as part of a chip remarking to look like something else) ?

EDIT3: CS4624 and AU8830 are not software compatible and I doubt that they would happen to be pin-compatible .

Nice to compare. That vortex 2 card seems to have a seperate power regulator, while OPs card is lacking this.
though OPs has a lot more capacitors while the other card lacks a lot of them.

darry wrote on 2024-02-03, 20:24:

The good news is that either is actually an Aureal chip that has been re-marked as a C4624 for some odd (to me) reason OR some c […]
Show full quote

xtreger wrote on 2024-02-03, 20:16:

darry wrote on 2024-02-03, 20:03:

That is not a Vortex 2 (aka Aureal AU8830 based card ), unless the main chip is remarked . […]
Show full quote

That is not a Vortex 2 (aka Aureal AU8830 based card ), unless the main chip is remarked .

EDIT : Your card's PCB looks a lot like the one in this thread . Generic Aureal Vortex 2 - Worth It?
Except yours has Vortex Intex branding on PCB and obviously the markings on the main chip .

EDIT2 : Does your card work with official Aureal drivers ? Official Crystal Semiconductor drivers ? Or are you using the drivers provided with the card (which could have been altered as part of a chip remarking to look like something else) ?

EDIT3: CS4624 and AU8830 are not software compatible and I doubt that they would happen to be pin-compatible .

I used the AU8830 drivers on vogons first. They were giving some primary PCI slot related message. Then I uninstalled them and installed vortex 2 drivers provided on philscomputerlab website. These drivers installed just fine along with all components like gameport, etc.

The good news is that either is actually an Aureal chip that has been re-marked as a C4624 for some odd (to me) reason OR some company cloned a Vortex chip AND marked it wrong . The first scenario is most likely.

If we add all this together, it seems very likely that your card is cheaply designed and built, probably with left over chips from after when Aureal went out of business .
EDIT : So the noise issue might be due to the card's design, unfortunately .

EDIT2 : You might be able to add S/PDIF out to the card by doing something similar to this Aureal Vortex 2 (Montego II) S/PDIF connection and digital output drivers?

EDIT3: Did you make sure to mute all the unused inputs on the cards (line-in , microphone and anything input related that may appear in the mixer but may not actually exist on the card) ? The noise might be coming from one of the inputs.

Dude! Thanks so so much! You are best. I went to the mixer and muted the Microphone - that reduced the hum drastically, though it's not gone completely. And it goes away almost completely when I unplug the USB keyboard.
I also mixed and matched the USB ports into which I plug in keyboard and speakers - that makes a mild difference in the hum volume. I suspect that using headphones may get rid of the hum entirely (or using an external power speaker instead of a USB one).

xtreger wrote on 2024-02-03, 21:34:

darry wrote on 2024-02-03, 20:24:

The good news is that either is actually an Aureal chip that has been re-marked as a C4624 for some odd (to me) reason OR some c […]
Show full quote

xtreger wrote on 2024-02-03, 20:16:

I used the AU8830 drivers on vogons first. They were giving some primary PCI slot related message. Then I uninstalled them and installed vortex 2 drivers provided on philscomputerlab website. These drivers installed just fine along with all components like gameport, etc.

The good news is that either is actually an Aureal chip that has been re-marked as a C4624 for some odd (to me) reason OR some company cloned a Vortex chip AND marked it wrong . The first scenario is most likely.

If we add all this together, it seems very likely that your card is cheaply designed and built, probably with left over chips from after when Aureal went out of business .
EDIT : So the noise issue might be due to the card's design, unfortunately .

EDIT2 : You might be able to add S/PDIF out to the card by doing something similar to this Aureal Vortex 2 (Montego II) S/PDIF connection and digital output drivers?

EDIT3: Did you make sure to mute all the unused inputs on the cards (line-in , microphone and anything input related that may appear in the mixer but may not actually exist on the card) ? The noise might be coming from one of the inputs.

Dude! Thanks so so much! You are best. I went to the mixer and muted the Microphone - that reduced the hum drastically, though it's not gone completely. And it goes away almost completely when I unplug the USB keyboard.
I also mixed and matched the USB ports into which I plug in keyboard and speakers - that makes a mild difference in the hum volume. I suspect that using headphones may get rid of the hum entirely (or using an external power speaker instead of a USB one).

Hi,

Glad that you did find ways to minimize the issue. I just remembered that I once had a hum issue that was caused by the cheap power supply bundled with an OSSC (scan converter connected to between VGA and monitor). Sttrangely enough, only my AWE64 was affected. A better PSU fixed it. For 5V, I tend to use branded, UL listed ones from the likes of Anker or Amazon Basics (for example) with a USB A connector. I then use an appropriate USB-A to barrel jack lead. You can get multi-output ones that save on AC outlet use well.

darry wrote on 2024-02-03, 22:17:

xtreger wrote on 2024-02-03, 21:34:

darry wrote on 2024-02-03, 20:24:

The good news is that either is actually an Aureal chip that has been re-marked as a C4624 for some odd (to me) reason OR some c […]
Show full quote

The good news is that either is actually an Aureal chip that has been re-marked as a C4624 for some odd (to me) reason OR some company cloned a Vortex chip AND marked it wrong . The first scenario is most likely.

If we add all this together, it seems very likely that your card is cheaply designed and built, probably with left over chips from after when Aureal went out of business .
EDIT : So the noise issue might be due to the card's design, unfortunately .

EDIT2 : You might be able to add S/PDIF out to the card by doing something similar to this Aureal Vortex 2 (Montego II) S/PDIF connection and digital output drivers?

EDIT3: Did you make sure to mute all the unused inputs on the cards (line-in , microphone and anything input related that may appear in the mixer but may not actually exist on the card) ? The noise might be coming from one of the inputs.

Dude! Thanks so so much! You are best. I went to the mixer and muted the Microphone - that reduced the hum drastically, though it's not gone completely. And it goes away almost completely when I unplug the USB keyboard.
I also mixed and matched the USB ports into which I plug in keyboard and speakers - that makes a mild difference in the hum volume. I suspect that using headphones may get rid of the hum entirely (or using an external power speaker instead of a USB one).

Hi,

Glad that you did find ways to minimize the issue. I just remembered that I once had a hum issue that was caused by the cheap power supply bundled with an OSSC (scan converter connected to between VGA and monitor). Sttrangely enough, only my AWE64 was affected. A better PSU fixed it. For 5V, I tend to use branded, UL listed ones from the likes of Anker or Amazon Basics (for example) with a USB A connector. I then use an appropriate USB-A to barrel jack lead. You can get multi-output ones that save on AC outlet use well.

Yes you're right. I'm definitely thinking of buying a better PSU. It's a bit tricky since there'd be so many things connected to it - motherboard, ssd, cd drive, floppy drive, gfx card, sound card, etc. Current PSU I have is 450 watts. I'll search for a better one