Oetker wrote on 2022-07-09, 10:23:eddman wrote on 2022-07-09, 10:13:Are these APIs only for 3D acceleration, or can they be used for 2.5D games? IINM rebel moon is not a true 3D game, correct?
Sure, for example there's a Glide (not what this thread is about, I know) version of GTA, a 2D game.
I am pretty sure GTA is true 3D.
Putas wrote on 2022-07-09, 16:37:Oetker wrote on 2022-07-09, 10:23:eddman wrote on 2022-07-09, 10:13:Are these APIs only for 3D acceleration, or can they be used for 2.5D games? IINM rebel moon is not a true 3D game, correct?
Sure, for example there's a Glide (not what this thread is about, I know) version of GTA, a 2D game.
I am pretty sure GTA is true 3D.
looks like eddman is confused with game perspective over game graphics quality
previously known as Discrete_BOB_058
GTA is 2.5D like Doom, draws fixed Z-depth scaled lines
For GTA 1, there are 3dfx patches, and "true room over room" so things can be above and below each other. Those bridges between houses on roofs, for example.
But the perspective is still 2d.
BEEN_Nath_58 wrote on 2022-07-09, 17:24:Putas wrote on 2022-07-09, 16:37:Oetker wrote on 2022-07-09, 10:23:Sure, for example there's a Glide (not what this thread is about, I know) version of GTA, a 2D game.
I am pretty sure GTA is true 3D.
looks like eddman is confused with game perspective over game graphics quality
No; I was simply under the impression that acceleration applies to games with true 3D engines, like quake engine, unreal, lithtech, etc. I suppose that's not the case; unless games like rebel moon and legacy GTA actually use true 3D engines.
GTA uses constant Z engine - all the polygons (quads actually) are cleverly constructed in a way to not require perspective correction (same as Doom). That doesnt mean you cant accelerate it by throwing those polygons at the Voodoo.
rasz_pl wrote on 2022-07-13, 16:06:GTA uses constant Z engine - all the polygons (quads actually) are cleverly constructed in a way to not require perspective correction (same as Doom). That doesnt mean you cant accelerate it by throwing those polygons at the Voodoo.
Do we have a thread about engines of games? It will be very interesting to know this. I have had problem to know if the game have a true 3D.
Descent II: The Infinite Abyss [DOS/Win95]
Later re-release of the full version of Descent II from 1996.
Includes Windows 95 support and bundled 3D accelerated drivers.
Also includes “The Vertigo Series” extra episode with 22 levels and multiplayer.
Win95 executable supports ViRGE natively, but appears to fall back to software rendering on DX / GX cards and isn’t runnable with S3DRUN.
D2Virge.exe won’t start with DX / GX cards under DOS and throws an “unrecoverable exception” error with S3DRUN, but runs under Windows with S3DRUN.
TOCA Touring Car Championship / TOCA Championship Racing [Win95]
Select “S3 Chipset” option under “3D Acceleration” in the game’s launcher after installing. No patch required.
DX / GX compatible.
WIP glitchy S3D S3 Virge API port of Post Apocalyptic Petra
Mystique SDK https://github.com/kytulendu/MSISDK/find/master
Resident evil 2 can be a rendition verite? https://originaldll.com/file/redline.dll/32854.html
FIFA 99 - can be a PowerVR game https://www.spieleforum.de/t/fifa-99-unter-xp.517095/
MDK - Mission Laguna Beach - Power VR
Sentient Explore the Infinite - need to check can be a matrox mystique and/or creative 3d blaster game
i suspect because of this -> https://forum.winworldpc.com/discussion/comme … #Comment_151203
Myst should be Rendition game comes from https://fabiensanglard.net/vquake/
Acua Soccer Source Code contains Creative 3D Blaster CGL usage in source files.
Re: Fun with CGL (Creative Graphics Library) on 3D Blaster
Descent II source code contains programming with s3 virge , 3dfx and rendition versions. vire also for windows too.
Wipeout has source code and it has ati3dcif source code too
I've made a list of games mentioned in this topic, which might have API support except D3D/Glide (timestamps by cd images, its not release dates):
1996.07.10 Starfighter 3000 [CGL]
1996.10.30 Descent 2 [Re-release][S3D]
1996.11.10 NEC 3DEngine (PCX1) Driver CD (Ground Master, Omega Field, PacfaMoroWh, Dual Power) [PowerSGL]
1997.03.19 ReLoaded [Glide][DirectX][Software]{Patch, force methods is unknown}
1997.04.11 Sentient Explore the Infinite [DirectX][CGL][MSI]
1997.05.02 A2 Racer [PowerSGL][DirectX]
1997.07.15 Terracide (VideoLogic OEM) [ATI CIF][S3D][DirectX]
1997.07.28 Terracide [S3D][DirectX]
1997.08.24 Speedboat Attack [Glide][DirectX]
1997.09.10 International Rally Championship [ATI CIF][DirectX]
1997.10.24 Overboard! (aka Shipwreckers!) [S3D][DirectX]{Force methods is unknown}
1997.10.29 G-Police [ATI CIF][Glide][DirectX]
1997.11.03 MDK Mission Laguna Beach [PowerSGL]
1997.11.04 Doctor Who Destiny of the Doctors [S3D][ATI CIF][MSI][Glide][DirectX]{Force methods is unknown}
1997.11.19 Joint Strike Fighter [Glide][DirectX]
1997.11.27 TOCA Touring Car Championship [S3D][DirectX]{Force methods is unknown}
1997.12.20 Ski Racing Extreme Edition aka Front Page Sports Ski Racing [S3D][Glide][DirectX]{Force methods is unknown}
1998.03.08 Triple Play 99 [Glide][DirectX]
1998.03.27 Plane Crazy [PowerSGL][DirectX]
1998.06.10 Actua Soccer 2 aka Fox Sports Soccer 99 [PowerSGL][Glide][DirectX]
1998.08.10 Tiger Woods 99 PGA Tour Golf [Glide][DirectX]{}
1998.08.21 Spearhead [PowerSGL][Glide][DirectX]
1998.09.03 Need for Speed III - Hot Pursuit [Glide][DirectX]
1998.09.10 NHL 99 [ATI CIF][PowerSGL][Glide][DirectX]
1998.09.13 Lunatik [PowerSGL][DirectX]
1998.10.25 NBA Live 99 [ATI CIF][Glide][DirectX]
1998.10.29 Future Cop LAPD [PowerSGL][ATI CIF][Glide][DirectX]
1998.11.02 FIFA 99 [PowerSGL][Glide][DirectX]
1998.11.25 Asghan The Dragon Slayer [S3D][ATI CIF][MSI][Glide][DirectX]{Force methods is unknown}
1998.11.30 Actua Soccer 3 [PowerSGL][Glide][DirectX]{}
1999.02.02 Resident Evil 2 [Rendition RRedline][DirectX]
1999.02.26 Tank Racer [PowerSGL][DirectX]
1999.03.28 Actua Ice Hockey 2 [PowerSGL][DirectX]{}
1999.04.29 Star Wars - Episode I - Racer [PowerSGL][DirectX]
1999.05.11 Alien vs Predator [PowerSGL][DirectX]
1999.06.04 Sega Rally 2 [PowerSGL][DirectX]
1999.06.29 X-Tom3D [PowerSGL][Glide][DirectX][OGL-wrapper]
1999.07.30 Dr. Brain Action Reaction [PowerSGL][Glide][DirectX]
1999.11.03 Need for Speed - High Stakes [Glide][DirectX]
1999.11.22 Formula One 99 [PowerSGL][DirectX]
2000.03.12 Triple Play 2001 [PowerSGL][ATI CIF][Glide][DirectX]
2000.04.17 John Romero's Daikatana [OGL-wrapper]
2000.10.04 Thandor the Invasion [DirectX][Glide]
2000.11.07 The Typing of the Dead [PowerSGL][DirectX]
2001.02.08 Triple Play Baseball [PowerSGL][ATI CIF][Glide][DirectX][OpenGL]
2001.08.25 Sega GT [PowerSGL][DirectX]
2001.08.31 Sega Marine Fishing [PowerSGL][DirectX]
These games doesn't have API support:
1997.08.09 Virtua Fighter 2 [DirectX]
1997.09.08 Mageslayer [DirectX]{PowerVR and 3DFX is best on real hardware according to README}
1999.09.28 Thomas & Friends The Great Festival Adventure {PC only, arcade and dreamcast versions didn't exist}
Also made another lists:
Games with multiple API support (Retail only):
1996.04.26 Battle Arena Toshinden [CGL][NVLib][Software]
1996.06.26 Battlerace [CGL][S3D][Software]
1997.04.18 UEFA Champions League 1996-1997 [MSI][Glide][Software]
1997.05.19 EuroFighter 2000 (EF2000) v2.0 [Rendition Speedy3D][Glide][Software]
1997.06 Time Warriors [ATI CIF][S3D][MSI][Glide][DirectX][Software]
1997.07.11 Hardcore 4x4 [PowerSGL][Glide][DirectX]
1997.10.10 Sub Culture [Rendition RRedline][PowerSGL][Glide][DirectX]
1997.10.29 Myth: The Fallen Lords [Rendition RRedline][Glide][DirectX]
1997.10.30 POD Gold [S3D][PowerSGL][Glide][DirectX]
1997.10.30 Screamer Rally [CGL][MSI][Glide][Software]
1997.11.04 FIFA Soccer 98 Road to the World Cup [PowerSGL][Glide][DirectX]
1997.11.12 Turok: Dinosaur Hunter [ATI CIF][PowerSGL][Glide][DirectX]
1997.11.13 Actua Soccer 2 [PowerSGL][Glide][DirectX]
1997.11.17 Heavy Gear [Rendition RRedline][Glide][DirectX]
1997.12.02 Croc: Legend of the Gobbos [ATI CIF][S3D][MSI][Glide][DirectX]
1998.01.19 Actua Golf 2 [PowerSGL][Glide][DirectX]
1998.02.04 Actua Ice Hockey [PowerSGL][Glide][DirectX]
1998.02.16 Tomb Raider: Unfinished Business [ATI CIF][S3D][PowerSGL][Glide][Software]
1998.02.27 Interstate 76 Gold [Rendition RRedline][PowerSGL][Glide][DirectX]
1998.02.28 Ultim@te Race Pro [PowerSGL][Glide][DirectX]
1998.03.14 Die by the Sword [Rendition RRedline][Glide][DirectX]
1998.03.23 Mechwarrior 2 Titanium Edition [Rendition RRedline][Glide][DirectX]
1998.04.08 Monster Truck Madness 2 [Rendition RRedline][PowerSGL][Glide][DirectX]
1998.04.14 World Cup 98 [PowerSGL][Glide][DirectX]
1998.05.17 Unreal [PowerSGL][Glide][DirectX]
1998.05.28 Team Apache [Rendition RRedline][Glide][DirectX]
1998.06.05 Deathtrap Dungeon [ATI CIF][Glide][DirectX]
1998.08.17 Hardwar [PowerSGL][Glide][DirectX]
1998.08.21 Spearhead [PowerSGL][Glide][DirectX]
1998.08.21 The Fifth Element [PowerSGL][Glide][DirectX]
1998.09.04 Grand Prix Legends [Rendition RRedline][Glide][DirectX]
1998.09.13 Actua Tennis aka Virtual Tennis [PowerSGL][Glide][DirectX]
1998.09.18 Star Trek The Next Generation Klingon Honor Guard [PowerSGL][Glide][DirectX]
1998.09.22 Buggy [PowerSGL][Glide][DirectX]
1998.11.02 TNN Outdoor Pro Hunter [PowerSGL][Glide][DirectX]
1998.11.04 NASCAR Racing 1999 Edition [Rendition RRedline][Glide][DirectX][Software]
2000.04.11 Metal Fatigue [PowerSGL][Glide][DirectX]
Exclusive game versions with API support:
1994.12.05 3D Superpack (IceHawk*, Sento, Spectre)[Matrox Impression Plus][Software]
1995.10.19 NASCAR Racing [3D Blaster VLB][CGL][Software]
1995.10.24 Flight Unlimited [3D Blaster VLB][CGL][Software]
1995.10.24 NASCAR Racing [NVLib]
1995.10.25 Virtua Fighter Remix [NVLib]
1995.10.27 Hi-Octane [3D Blaster VLB][CGL][Software]
1995.10.27 Magic Carpet Plus [3D Blaster VLB][CGL][Software]
1995.12.15 Panzer Dragoon [NVLib]
1996.04.20 Mechwarrior 2 ATI 3D Rage Edition [ATI CIF]
1996.04.29 Descent II Destination Quartzon 3D [S3D]
1996.04.30 Destruction Derby [S3D]
1996.05.17 Euro 96 [3D Blaster VLB][CGL][Software]
1996.07.31 Wipeout [ATI CIF]
1996.08.06 S3D Game Pak (Actua Soccer, Havoc, Terminal Velocity)[S3D]
1996.08.19 Flight Unlimited [3D Blaster PCI][CGL][Software]
1996.08.23 Mechwarrior 2 Mystique Edition [MSI]
1996.08.23 Scorched Planet [OEM][MSI]
1996.09.06 Mechwarrior 2 PowerVR edition [PowerSGL]
1996.09.17 Fatal Racing 3D & Actua Soccer 3D [Glide]
1996.09.27 Assault Rigs [ATI CIF]
1996.10.17 Destruction Derby 2 [MSI]
1996.10.18 Whiplash + VR Soccer '96 [Glide]
1996.10.29 Whiplash 3D [S3D]
1996.11.03 Mechwarror 2 31st Century Combat [Glide]
1996.11.11 Resident Evil [PowerSGL]
1996.11.14 Mechwarrior II S3 Virge edition [S3D]
1996.11.25 NASCAR Racing II [Rendition Speedy3D][Software]
1996.12.06 Fatal Racing [S3D]
1997.01.27 Ultim@te Race 1-Track [PowerSGL]
1997.03.25 CyberTroopers Virtual On [PowerSGL]
1997.07.16 Ultim@te Race 3-Track [PowerSGL]
1997.09.09 CART Racing [Rendition Speedy3D][Software]
1997.11.03 MDK Mission Laguna Beach [PowerSGL]
* - could be exclusive game
Exclusive games with API support:
1996.08.26 Rebel Moon [3D Blaster PCI][CGL][Rendition Speedy3D][Software]
1995.10.25 Rebel Moon [3D Blaster VLB][CGL][Software]
1996.11.10 NEC 3DEngine (PCX1) Driver CD (Ground Master, Omega Field, PacfaMoroWh, Dual Power) [PowerSGL]
1996.11.12 Revolte! [PowerSGL]
1996.12.20 A Train No. 5 [PowerSGL]
1997.07.10 Enigma [PowerSGL]
1997.08.04 3D Shooting Maker [PowerSGL]
1997.08.23 Nirgends [PowerSGL]
1997.09.11 Moon Racer [PowerSGL]
1997.12.03 PureVex [PowerSGL]
Games with API and D3D support (need tests for some probably):
1997.04.11 Sentient Explore the Infinite [DirectX][CGL][MSI]
1997.05.02 A2 Racer [PowerSGL][DirectX]
1997.07.15 Terracide (VideoLogic OEM) [ATI CIF][S3D][DirectX]
1997.07.28 Terracide [S3D][DirectX]
1997.09.10 International Rally Championship [ATI CIF][DirectX]
1998.03.27 Plane Crazy [PowerSGL][DirectX]
1998.09.13 Lunatik [PowerSGL][DirectX]
1999.02.26 Tank Racer [PowerSGL][DirectX]
1996.11.29 POD [ATI CIF][S3D][DirectX]
1996.09.25 Scorched Planet [MSI][Rendition Speedy3D][DirectX][Software]
1997.12.04 Nightmare Creatures [PowerSGL]{Glide}[DirectX]
1996.09.28 Virtua Cop [NVLib][DirectX]
1996.10.19 FX Fighter Turbo [S3D][DirectX]
1996.10.25 Daytona USA [DirectX][NVLib]
1996.10.28 CyberGladiators [Glide][DirectX]
1997.04.17 Formula 1 [Rendition RRedline][DirectX]
1997.10.06 SODA Off-Road Racing [Rendition RRedline][DirectX]
Games with API and Software support:
1994.11.23 Creep Clash / Sento [Matrox Impression Plus][Software]
1996.07.10 Starfighter 3000 [CGL*][Software] (* - need confirmation)
Missing:
NASCAR Racing [Matrox Millennium]
Daytona USA OEM [NVLib]
FX Fighter [Paradise Tasmania 3D]
Tank Commander [Paradise Tasmania 3D]
Descent Destination Saturn [NVLib]
Actua Soccer [ATI CIF]
Formula 1 [ATI CIF]
Actua Soccer Semifinals 3D [ATI CIF]
VR Soccer Semifinals 3D [ATI CIF]
Screamer [S3D]
Descent II Destination Quartzon 3D [Rendition Speedy3D]
IndyCar Racing II [Rendition Speedy3D]
Actua Soccer [PowerSGL]
Flight Unlimited [PowerSGL]
Tried to test S3D emulation and ATI CIF wrapping:
Actua Soccer (S3D) - works in 86Box (4.0.0.4640, 02.06.2023), didn't find visual glitches.
Terminal Velocity (S3D) - works in 86Box (4.0.0.4640, 02.06.2023), render is glitchy but could be playable.
Terracide (S3D) - VideoLogic OEM and Retail versions have S3D support but render is very glitchy (86Box).
Descent 2 (Re-release)(S3D) - can't detect S3 Virge (86Box).
Battlerace (S3D) - incorrect rendering, unplayable (86Box).
Destruction Derby (S3D) - didn't run even with noCD (86Box).
Havoc (S3D) - didn't run (86Box).
Whiplash 3D|Fatal Racing 3D (S3D) - render don't work in title screen and gameplay, but menu displays normally (86Box).
Mechwarrior II S3 Virge edition (S3D) - crash after mission start (86Box).
FX Fighter Turbo (S3D) - only software version runs, S3D not (86Box).
POD (S3D) - didn't run (86Box).
Time Warriors (S3D) - runs, but render is glitching (86Box).
Terracide (VideoLogic OEM)(ATI CIF) - GLRage ddraw error.
International Rally Championship (ATI CIF) - GLRage ddraw error.
Wipeout (ATI CIF) - works with GLRage. Cannot be run in Win9x (86Box).
Assault Rigs (ATI CIF) - works with GLRage. Cannot be run in Win9x (86Box).
I wish every similar thread had a sticky at the *start* of the post that summarized all findings in the thread, like above. After another 10 pages, who will be able to find this excellent summary?
Great work, thanks!
Are you collect the oldest versions? For example Hi-Octane has two versions (at least), the older one is the 19951027 one (latest file date is 19951026), and the newer one has no timestamp ("00000000" and the latest file date is 19951106). The only difference between this two versions that the earlier one has the CGL Revision 1.6, but the later one has CGL Revision 1.61a linked-in-binary.
Descent Destination Saturn [NVLib] -> no timestamp, newest file: 19951201
Thanks.
I would like to preserve all versions with API support which not Glide or PowerVR (Actua Soccer and Flight Unlimited is exception), so if possible to share you can PM me links for download (dropmefiles will be enough for me).
Try to figure out what ELSA Victory 3D mean and it was PCI card with S3 Virge chip - https://www.classicvga.com/product-page/elsa- … e-4mb-sdram-pci
Maybe it could be more runnable than S3D option.
Driver cds is avaliable on archive.org.
DosWin wrote on 2023-06-05, 21:26:Try to figure out what ELSA Victory 3D mean and it was PCI card with S3 Virge chip - https://www.classicvga.com/product-page/elsa- … e-4mb-sdram-pci
Maybe it could be more runnable than S3D option.
Driver cds is avaliable on archive.org.
By S3D API there is no difference between S3 ViRGE 325 based cards. If we look all S3D compatible chips (All ViRGE family), the AGP ones (MX and GX2) produces artifacts sometimes. You can read more about this on Putas great page: https://vintage3d.org/virgemx.php
The Wikipedia page for "FX Fighter" says that "OEM versions of this title have support for 3D acceleration, bundled with 3D graphics accelerator cards such as the Diamond Monster 3D."
I saw this quoted on other sites, such as Moby Games as well.
Is it true?
Following the citation leads to a press release from Diamond, that is archived in the wayback-machine, talking about the release of the retail version of the 3D Monster, with "more than 10 frightfully popular games".
The wayback machine does not have the rest of the press release, but I was able to locate it here:
https://www.atariarchives.org/cfn/08/09/03/0550.php
(starts at "SAN JOSE, Calif.--Oct. 31, 1996--Diamond Multimedia Systems Inc. (Nasdaq: DIMD), the world's leading supplier of PC graphics subsystems")
According to that press release, the games bundled with the card do not in fact include "FX Fighter"...
The only mention of the game is:
Top game companies currently working on Voodoo Graphics-enhanced games
include Argonaut/GTE Entertainment (FX Fighter)
So apparently the game was not bundled with the card. But was it ever released with Voodoo support?
Never heard about a Voodoo version of FX Fighter that was actually released. Its a common theme, which you will also see in the list that many press releases mentions upcoming titles which never materialize. The worst case I'd say was Nvidia/Activison who published a press release for a Mechwarrior 2 version with NV1 support that had finished development, but that never saw the light of the day. There is many indications that the NV1 version of Mechwarrior 2 was in fact either very close to finished or actually finished.
Gona wrote on 2018-02-05, 21:34:wrote:Yes, there were. It came with the European releases of the Orchid Righteous 3DFX card and it was the OEM Semi Finals version (no […]
wrote:@Vetz: it looks like you have great knowledge about early 3D OEM releases. So, maybe you know the answer. Was there an Actua Soc […]
@Vetz: it looks like you have great knowledge about early 3D OEM releases.
So, maybe you know the answer.
Was there an Actua Soccer 3dfx OEM release? I have the retail EN/FR version backup (the original cd is long ago dead from aging). I have the VR Soccer '96/Whiplash OEM cd somewhere (was included with 1 of Voodoos). But I can't find any trace of an european 3dfx release/OEM.
Tnx.Yes, there were. It came with the European releases of the Orchid Righteous 3DFX card and it was the OEM Semi Finals version (not full). Please not that the bundle in the Orchid cards was later replaced with Jedi Knight and Sega Rally Championship.
See this auction on Ebay (from 2013):
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Orchid-Righteous-3D … =p2047675.l2557I don't own this disc as I only have the US version with VR Soccer, but I'm sure alot of people on this forum do (Artex does not, so don't bother to ask him 🤣). If someone wants to help out with the .exe file please raise your voice 😀
If someone interested I have made a 3Dfx patch (full with 44 teams) for retail or other PC releases (using the VR Soccer '96/Whiplash OEM cd):
https://gona.mactar.hu/3D/files/SOC3DFX.zip
I guess it is not possible to make a similar patch for Euro 96 and Actua Club Soccer
robertmo3 wrote on 2023-08-16, 15:24:Gona wrote on 2018-02-05, 21:34:wrote:Yes, there were. It came with the European releases of the Orchid Righteous 3DFX card and it was the OEM Semi Finals version (no […]
Yes, there were. It came with the European releases of the Orchid Righteous 3DFX card and it was the OEM Semi Finals version (not full). Please not that the bundle in the Orchid cards was later replaced with Jedi Knight and Sega Rally Championship.
See this auction on Ebay (from 2013):
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Orchid-Righteous-3D … =p2047675.l2557I don't own this disc as I only have the US version with VR Soccer, but I'm sure alot of people on this forum do (Artex does not, so don't bother to ask him 🤣). If someone wants to help out with the .exe file please raise your voice 😀
If someone interested I have made a 3Dfx patch (full with 44 teams) for retail or other PC releases (using the VR Soccer '96/Whiplash OEM cd):
https://gona.mactar.hu/3D/files/SOC3DFX.zipI guess it is not possible to make a similar patch for Euro 96 and Actua Club Soccer
Yes, these are not released in 3DFx versions so we cannot make patch.
I decided to check "Realimation STE" Program from debunked Verite apps - this program actually can use 3dfx glide api
From other question : did someone got a luck to get this Mirage Demo for Verite? Re: Rendition Verite Thread
Also Verite Descent II destinaltion is super rare as IndyCar Racing II oem for veite too, never saw this on selling . Hmm
Ray Dream Studio as Debunked in Rendition Program its not uses any of apis.
NASCAR Racing Online Series (located on nascar 1999 edition is Rendition Verite Speedy3d !!!! ) but doe to TEN closure , this multipleyer client can\t be used.
Hello , anyone with Rendition Verite v1000 can help on testing this app Re: RReady (Rendition Verite wrapper) Test Build (Alpha 1)
this is from rendition verite wrapper developer for adding dos games support. all windows games already supported.
