VOGONS


First post, by fsmith2003

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Ok guys and gals, I hope you can help me out here. I just bought a motherboard for a 1998 era build on a whim from ebay. A few hours after purchasing it I got to looking and realized it did not have an AGP slot! It is a P2B98-XV board. It had already been shipped so I could not cancel.

I was hoping to make this rig 1998 era specific. But now without the AGP slot I was curious. If I were to take a PCI card from say 1999 or 2000 with slightly more Memory and Clock speeds would it equal out to a slower 1998 era AGP card. I will also be installing 2 Voodoo 2's in SLI so would the third card even make a difference for 1998 era gaming?

Reply 1 of 16, by Jorpho

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Put in the card, play your games, and decide for yourself if they're fast and pretty enough for you. If they aren't fast enough, or if you can't turn up the details as high as you'd like, then get another motherboard. And if you really want to max out everything, see if there's a way to patch things up so your games will run on a current machine. Simple.

If for some reason you demand nothing less than the warm fuzzy feeling that you're using the exact same components you could have been using in 1998 if you had thousands of dollars to sling around, then clearly only an authentic AGP card will do.

And no, any game that uses your Voodoo2 cards will function entirely independently of what other video card you have in there. If every game you want to run will be using your Voodoo2 cards, then it does not matter in the slightest whether your other card is PCI or AGP.

Reply 2 of 16, by The Serpent Rider

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fsmith2003 wrote:

If I were to take a PCI card from say 1999 or 2000 with slightly more Memory and Clock speeds would it equal out to a slower 1998 era AGP card.

Nope. PCI won't hurt perfomance that bad to equalize them, unless you're pushing vram limits, which may require some use of AGP texturing.

I must be some kind of standard: the anonymous gangbanger of the 21st century.

Reply 3 of 16, by fsmith2003

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Thanks for the info. But let me ask the question again but never mind the fact that I am wanting to build a 1998 era computer and all that. Just in general, if you were to take an AGP card, lets just say for example a Rage Pro. Then a PCI (first gen) card, like maybe an All In Wonder 128, which has faster memory and gpu clock speeds as well as memory itself. On paper, is it possible that the PCI would be on par or better than that AGP card? Or is it still slower because of the bandwidth capabilities of PCI as opposed to AGP?

Reply 4 of 16, by The Serpent Rider

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If clocks are faster - yes, will be faster in general.

Last edited by The Serpent Rider on 2017-04-26, 20:33. Edited 1 time in total.

I must be some kind of standard: the anonymous gangbanger of the 21st century.

Reply 6 of 16, by cyclone3d

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The 2d card will be fine with PCI.

Absolutely no reason you need AGP for 2d games.

Everything 3d will be running off the the Voodoo 2 cards. The 2d card just acts as a passthrough when using the Voodoo 2 cards.

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Reply 7 of 16, by dirkmirk

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The perfect solution would be to get a PCI Voodoo3 as the AGP cards were no faster and the Voodo3 is as fast or faster than 2 voodoo2s in SLI.

1 card vs 3.....

Reply 8 of 16, by xplus93

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I upgraded a TNT2 M64 AGP to a Radeon 9250 PCI back in the day. Significant boost in performance. A GeForce 2 or 3 would probably be a good choice IMO. That way you can play non glide games as well.

XPS 466V|486-DX2|64MB|#9 GXE 1MB|SB32 PnP
Presario 4814|PMMX-233|128MB|Trio64
XPS R450|PII-450|384MB|TNT2 Pro| TB Montego
XPS B1000r|PIII-1GHz|512MB|GF2 PRO 64MB|SB Live!
XPS Gen2|P4 EE 3.4|2GB|GF 6800 GT OC|Audigy 2

Reply 9 of 16, by dirkmirk

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IF you don't want to get tooo carried away with something a Geforce FX5200(2003/4 vintage) I would recommend something like this
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Jaton-Nvidia-Geforce4 … 4kAAOSwNnRYgh9V

The MX4000 would be a lot faster than a period correct TNTM64

http://www.gpureview.com/show_cards.php?card1=130&card2=207

A directX7 card wouldn't be too far from a period correct pc of that era plus I highly recommend buying new parts for retro pc when possible and for a measly $12 OR make an offer why not? Good pairing for your Voodoo2s.

Reply 10 of 16, by xplus93

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dirkmirk wrote:
IF you don't want to get tooo carried away with something a Geforce FX5200(2003/4 vintage) I would recommend something like this […]
Show full quote

IF you don't want to get tooo carried away with something a Geforce FX5200(2003/4 vintage) I would recommend something like this
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Jaton-Nvidia-Geforce4 … 4kAAOSwNnRYgh9V

The MX4000 would be a lot faster than a period correct TNTM64

http://www.gpureview.com/show_cards.php?card1=130&card2=207

A directX7 card wouldn't be too far from a period correct pc of that era plus I highly recommend buying new parts for retro pc when possible and for a measly $12 OR make an offer why not? Good pairing for your Voodoo2s.

Looks like it's missing the full height bracket. Good pick though for the price. Looks like GF2s are a little pricier. Here's one with the bracket.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/PNY-TECHNOLOGY-GeFORC … zUAAOSw7U5Y-MT6

XPS 466V|486-DX2|64MB|#9 GXE 1MB|SB32 PnP
Presario 4814|PMMX-233|128MB|Trio64
XPS R450|PII-450|384MB|TNT2 Pro| TB Montego
XPS B1000r|PIII-1GHz|512MB|GF2 PRO 64MB|SB Live!
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Reply 11 of 16, by Chaniyth

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Just remember that you're talking 1998, AGP didn't come out until late 1997 and was still not mainstream in 1998 as most gamers and casual gamers were doing just fine with dual 12MB Voodoo 2 cards in SLI mode. At that point in time AGP was still a niche thing and mainly only hardcore gamers were all about it, it wasn't until 1999 that AGP became more mainstream and the casual gamer began to want it.

When it comes to AGP vs PCI then AGP 1x was identical to PCI 2.1.

You stated that you'll be installing 2 Voodoo 2's in SLI anyway so any PCI 2D card will work. Get yourself a nice S3 ViRGE or S3 Trio/Trio64 chipset PCI 2D card and you'll be golden. Diamond made some of the best ones for those chipsets as did Tseng. Or simply get a Voodoo 3 3000 PCI that way you have Direct3D, OpenGL, Glide and 2D support all with in one single card and a bit better performance than Voodoo 2 SLI. Voodoo 3 3000 came out in early 1999.

BTW the fastest CPUs that the ASUS P2B98-XV supports is Slot-1 Celeron 533 @ 533 Mhz, Pentium II @ 450 Mhz and Pentium III @ 600 MHz -- if you want to stick with 1998 era specs then get yourself a Pentium II 450 Mhz because Celerons from that era were really bad performers. If you're willing to push to 1999 specs you could max out the board with Pentium III 600 Mhz as that is what most people would have eventually done anyway.

Having a period correct system from that era is difficult as the technology was rapidly advancing, so IMHO the best way to go would be a 1998/1999 hybrid; best of both worlds both technology wise and performance wise. 😎

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Reply 12 of 16, by Captain NA

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Have tried to compare AGP and PCI based Voodoo5 5500 cards and cant really see any diffrence, and thats cards from 2000. Cant see why it should be a problem form a 1998 build then 😀

When thats told, Voodoo5 is a real bad card for such comparasion cuz it dont support AGP textureing. But pretty sure that aint a problem.

Just fooling around.

Reply 13 of 16, by meljor

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When comparing my v5 agp vs pci I did see a difference of around 15% in favor of the agp version. This was in 3dmark99 1024x768 and in one game benchmark on a fast 1400mhz tualatin p3.

This is probably less on a slower system. The same comparison i made with voodoo3 3000 agp vs pci and again, with this system, there was a gap. This time around 10% while on a much slower p2 the pci version was sometimes a tiny bit faster....

Geforce2mx agp vs pci: these were about the same on various systems.

So all in all i think it is safe to say that you will be able to play the same games on the same settings, an agp version will at most be marginally faster.

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asus p5a, k6-3+ @ 550mhz, voodoo2 12mb sli, gf2 gts, awe32
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Reply 14 of 16, by candle_86

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PCI wasn't really a slow down until DX7 class, and didn't really hurt until we got to 2nd gen DX9 cards, at least for the PCI cards we got, but 9200SE and FX5200 where not anymore than 10% slower than their AGP versions, look at Voodoo 3 on the other hand, its a PCI card plugged into an AGP slot 🤣