NVIDIA Kepler/Maxwell/Pascal VESA Bios Bug (workaround found)

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Re: NVIDIA Kepler/MaxWell/Pascal VESA Bios Bug (Please, participate since more data needed)

Postby Falcosoft » 2018-12-27 @ 11:12

Hi,
Here's a new version of MSKVBEF7 that seems to work at least with Quake 1. It modifies the NumberOfImagePages field in the ModeInfoBlock structure.
More info in this thread:
viewtopic.php?f=63&t=62586&start=40#p722398

MSKVBEF7_2.zip
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Re: NVIDIA Kepler/MaxWell/Pascal VESA Bios Bug (Please, participate since more data needed)

Postby RayeR » 2018-12-27 @ 16:21

Thanks for your effort, it works, even for Blood and DND3D (and sure it will for all Build-based games too :)
Good work. Now it is nice playable at 1600x1200 mode at 40-55 FPS.
You can add this utility to 1st post for other random visitors, maybe change topic name to mark we have a workaround now.

BTW I also tested vid_wait 1 option in quake and it turn on vsync in non-page flipping modes - I got FPS capped at 60Hz
For Ruthan: my time demo benchmark - 67,2 FPS @1280x1024 with MTRRLFBE, machine below exc. VGA is GTX670.
Last edited by RayeR on 2018-12-27 @ 18:28, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: NVIDIA Kepler/MaxWell/Pascal VESA Bios Bug (workaround found)

Postby Falcosoft » 2018-12-27 @ 17:44

Thanks for your tests. I have modified topic's title and added download link to first post as you have suggested.
@RayerR: Now something completely different. We had a broken conversation earlier about MTRRLFBE not working under protected/V86 mode with some systems. Can we continue this, please? Original conversation:
viewtopic.php?f=61&t=61044&start=20#p684979

@Edit: LFB WC performance problem under v86 mode confirmed by RayeR:
https://www.bttr-software.de/forum/foru ... p?id=15770
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Re: NVIDIA Kepler/MaxWell/Pascal VESA Bios Bug (workaround found)

Postby infiniteclouds » 2019-2-24 @ 05:02

When trying an A64+ 939 machine for high-res 98/DOS gaming the build engine games (Duke3D/Blood) gave me issues on my FX5900 Ultra and Geforce 4 Ti4200 -- I had to drop down to a Geforce 3 for them to work well without -- though the built-in FPS counter still 'lied' at certain resolutions. Is the bug mentioned here part of this or does this only apply to modern GPUs?
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Re: NVIDIA Kepler/MaxWell/Pascal VESA Bios Bug (workaround found)

Postby RayeR » 2019-2-24 @ 14:26

No, in your case it is something different. This thread is about new GPUs GTX 5xx+, older was not affected.
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Re: NVIDIA Kepler/Maxwell/Pascal VESA Bios Bug (workaround found)

Postby ruthan » 2019-5-04 @ 16:32

I just tested with patch with My MSI Geforce 980, if it would fix that high resolution text modes bug with File Wizzard Filemanager and its still broken, so there has to some other bugs with these new Nvidia cards. Its not nothing special its just default FW mode, broken from Geforce 730 GDR5 above.

Picture is completely broken.
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Re: NVIDIA Kepler/Maxwell/Pascal VESA Bios Bug (workaround found)

Postby RayeR » 2019-5-04 @ 17:34

And what mode FW use? Does it have some config that you can select different mode that works OK? You can try ask FW author what modes he use and what VESA library/what functions to focus wehere the problem is...
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Re: NVIDIA Kepler/Maxwell/Pascal VESA Bios Bug (workaround found)

Postby ruthan » 2019-5-04 @ 19:24

I dunno details, but you can download my drivers and utils package, here is FW folder with File Wizzard with same settings which im using.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/4g8snw60ouf1j ... 3.zip?dl=0

I already, tried to find details about FW author to try to find out, why when i try to start first program after its start and boot, it crashes and for second time run its all fine.. Its some hungarian guy with pretty generatic name, i wasnt able to find some working contact.
Im old goal oriented goatman, i care about facts and freedom, not about egos+prejudices. Hoarding=sickness. If you want respect, gain it by your behavior. I hate stupid SW limits, SW=virtual world, everything should be possible if you have enough HW.
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Re: NVIDIA Kepler/Maxwell/Pascal VESA Bios Bug (workaround found)

Postby Falcosoft » 2019-5-04 @ 23:50

ruthan wrote:I just tested with patch with My MSI Geforce 980, if it would fix that high resolution text modes bug with File Wizzard Filemanager and its still broken, so there has to some other bugs with these new Nvidia cards. Its not nothing special its just default FW mode, broken from Geforce 730 GDR5 above.
Picture is completely broken.

Hi,
I do not think this problem has anything to do with VESA. AFAIK NVIDIA never supported VESA Text modes at all or at least finished supporting VESA Text modes long before Kepler/Maxwell (my Geforce 6600 GT does not support any VESA Text modes at all either). The missing support is also reflected by FWIZARD since all the extra high resolution modes are disabled (it seems strange at first but green means mode is disabled and yellow means mode is enabled in FWIZARD).
This problem is triggered by a non-standard VGA Text mode when 8px character width is requested with 720x400/90x25 resolution. So this problem can be considered a bug but definitely not a VESA BIOS bug. And since this problem is related to a non-standard VGA resolution I consider this a not so serious issue.
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Re: NVIDIA Kepler/Maxwell/Pascal VESA Bios Bug (workaround found)

Postby ruthan » 2019-5-05 @ 00:01

I didnt check details about patch, i hoped its simply fix main Dos problems for these new Nvidia cards.

I have now Geforce 6600 GT in same machine, i thing that its from Gigabyte and its fine, im using FW as default FM, so i tested it with 50+ cards, ATI / AMD / Matroxes /S3/ 3Dfx.. all in my Dos videocards performance lists.. and Geforces from 4MX up to 730 DDR3 PCI-E all these new are ok, only these Nvidia with PCI-E gen 3 arent working with FW.
I never tested it with Geforce 4xx - 6xx line because i dont have these cards. I also dont have Radeons HD 7000 and newer.
Im old goal oriented goatman, i care about facts and freedom, not about egos+prejudices. Hoarding=sickness. If you want respect, gain it by your behavior. I hate stupid SW limits, SW=virtual world, everything should be possible if you have enough HW.
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Re: NVIDIA Kepler/Maxwell/Pascal VESA Bios Bug (workaround found)

Postby Falcosoft » 2019-5-05 @ 07:44

i hoped its simply fix main Dos problems for these new Nvidia cards.

No, the patch is very specific in this sense as it can be read in its description:
'MSKVBEF7 is a TSR that masks/hides VESA VBE Function 07h - Set/Get Display Start. It can somewhat cure the rather serious VESA BIOS bug of Nvidia Kepler/Maxwell/Pascal series that can cause flickering/skipped frames under DOS programs that use hardware page flipping for double/triple buffering.'

I have now Geforce 6600 GT in same machine, i thing that its from Gigabyte and its fine, im using FW as default FM, so i tested it with 50+ cards, ATI / AMD / Matroxes /S3/ 3Dfx.. all in my Dos videocards performance lists.. and Geforces from 4MX up to 730 DDR3 PCI-E all these new are ok, only these Nvidia with PCI-E gen 3 arent working with FW.

Hi,
I have not said this non-standard VGA mode is also buggy with Geforce 6600 GT. I have just said that it's not buggy on Geforce Kepler/Maxwell because of VESA Bios bug since VESA Text modes are not supported by NVIDIA VESA Bios at all.

Here are some pictures what I'm talking about:
1.a. If VESA text modes are supported then you get something like this in FWIZARD:
vesatxt_support_fw.jpg

1.b. And something like this in AIDA 'Graphics -> SVGA VESA Text Mode' section:
vesatxt_support_aida.jpg


2.a. If VESA text modes are not supported then you get something like this in FWIZARD (as I said green means not supported):
vesatxt_nosupport_fw.jpg

2.b. And in AIDA:
vesatxt_nosupport_aida.jpg


In case of both Geforce 6600 GT and Geforce Kepler/Maxwell you get something like the 2. case: VESA Text modes are not supported at all.
But yes, Geforce 6600 GT and Geforce Kepler/Maxwell are different in the way that 720x400/90x25 non-stanard VGA mode is supported by Geforce 6600 but not by Geforce Kepler/Maxwell.
But this mode is not a standard VGA Text mode so the support is not 'demanded' by VGA standard:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VGA-compa ... text_modes
The bug is triggered on Geforce Kepler/Maxwell when you select any modes represented by the 4th yellow 'X' column in FWIZARD.
I mean these ones:
bug1.jpg


PS:
Its some hungarian guy with pretty generatic name, i wasnt able to find some working contact.

I'm also Hungarian so I can say he does not have a 'general' name as far as Hungarian names are concerned. On one hand 3 names are not so general in Hungary (the typical is 2) and overall 'Gulyás Antal Dénes' is rather distinguishable. I have found some reference and it seems he was an active member of the community of late famous 'Enterprise 128' era in Hungary, but I also could not find an active contact.
But it seems you can reach 'Laci' at http://www.ep128.hu/ and maybe he can help since one of his pages refer to a program written by 'Gulyás Antal Dénes' and Laci's site seems to be still active (last modification date is 2019.03.30.)
http://www.ep128.hu/Ep_Games/Leiras/Tetris.htm
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Re: NVIDIA Kepler/Maxwell/Pascal VESA Bios Bug (workaround found)

Postby ruthan » 2019-5-05 @ 09:43

Thanks for detail analysis of problem. So its rare case.
On paper, by the book, its not standard implementation, but if all other videocards manufacturers support these modes (and they do), its de facto standard mode, even older Nvidia cards supported them.

To author thanks for research, i will try to ask middleman, i only can tell that when i googled him, i find more than 2,3 guys with same name, im not sure its long time, but i maybe because i wasnt successfull with 3 names, only used first and last name not middle name.
Im old goal oriented goatman, i care about facts and freedom, not about egos+prejudices. Hoarding=sickness. If you want respect, gain it by your behavior. I hate stupid SW limits, SW=virtual world, everything should be possible if you have enough HW.
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Re: NVIDIA Kepler/Maxwell/Pascal VESA Bios Bug (workaround found)

Postby RayeR » 2019-5-05 @ 15:06

Just don't wonder that newer cards has worse VESA implementation as it is common thrend to strip everything legacy down and focus on new stuffs - UEFI. During years Nvidia dropped various VESA features like refresh rate setting for CRT monitors, 8x14 font, etc. so we have to live with it or use some older VGA. I personally don't use this hires text VESA modes so I didn't meet this problem. As page flipping patch works for me I can live with GTX670 quite well. What I'm missing is accelerated driver for Win98 but it's diff. story...
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