NVIDIA Fermi is now officially retro (or atleast unsupported)

Discussion about old graphics cards, monitors and video related things.

Re: NVIDIA Fermi is now officially retro (or atleast unsupported)

Postby candle_86 » 2018-5-25 @ 02:50

swaaye wrote:I picked up a GTX 580 last year. Surprisingly quiet card even if it's power hungry. NV makes some nice OEM cooling solutions.

2900 XT is pretty irritating. The cooler steps up and down through annoying blower speeds. Even at idle. At load it's a hair dryer. Cards from those years have awful idle power characteristics. About 70W minimum doing nothing at the desktop. It's difficult to think up a good reason to use any DX10 GPUs.

I had a 290X for a brief time. They certainly cheaped out on the cooler for that card and got lots of bad press for it.

5800 Ultra mostly suffered from bad cooler engineering. They hadn't stepped up their game in cooler design yet. I also believe they designed it with looks as a primary consideration. Seemed to take a cue from Abit Siluro.


Reason for a DX10 GPU is era correct
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Re: NVIDIA Fermi is now officially retro (or atleast unsupported)

Postby FFXIhealer » 2018-5-25 @ 14:13

I have two GTX 480s that I run in an older Lynnfield (LGA-1156) MB in SLI and under gaming load, it'll dump some serious heat onto my feet. That's why I got a pair of matching water blocks by EK for them that I plan on doing a custom water-cooling loop. Should solve the "noise" issue at least.
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Re: NVIDIA Fermi is now officially retro (or atleast unsupported)

Postby LunarG » 2018-5-25 @ 18:53

Retro =/= No longer officially supported.
A 2001 Ford Mondeo is by no means a new car. A lot of people would call it an old car. But it is in no way, shape or form "retro".
Retro is defined not just by age, but also, to a much larger extent, by desirability. Hardware that is still semi-modern, will not be "retro" for many years yet.
Sure, there will be a niche who will want to build the ultimate 2010 system, but as any current PC will be, natively, able to run anything from 2010 better than the systems from back then, that niche will be small.
Prices of Fermi card will not shoot up. The demand will drop, rather than go up. In another 5-10 years, then perhaps, but as it's still within the same bracket of APIs as today, it's unlikely.
No offence to younger people who love the hardware of their childhood 8-10 years ago, but hardware isn't changing nearly as dramatically as it was during the 80's and 90's, hence there is less likelyhood it will actually become "retro".
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Re: NVIDIA Fermi is now officially retro (or atleast unsupported)

Postby Tetrium » 2018-5-25 @ 19:47

LunarG wrote:Retro =/= No longer officially supported.

^^ This.

Fermi was released in 2010 or so? It's only 8 years old...

This topic does come back from time to time and it's very hard to set some standard for what is retro and what is not. One could even argue that a card 3 years old is retro (or rare or "wanted" or whatever the label they stick on em) but even if it's old and rare, it doesn't necessarily make it retro.
The definition of what is "retro" is also not set in stone, but to me this doesn't mean it is something to be set kinda arbitrarily.

Also, due to it not being some official definition, which for a fact is not something I would definitely want, nor would want to exclude that I would not want it indefinitely or would actually see being officially defined, I can see it being used as a term thrown around in some conceived legitimate way. But if such a thing would be warranted? I dunno.

I tend to prefer to refer to cold hard definitions of retro being something that defines a thing of the past. Going backwards, so to say.
I also think "retro" is more a fluid thing, with things not being of absolute value when concerning its retroness as this tends to chance over time.

BUT if I were to pin it to some number, I'd say it should be at the very least be 10 years old.
But like I said, ask 100 people about what is retro and you shall receive 100 different answers.

Fermi is not officially retro, because there is no such thing.
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Re: NVIDIA Fermi is now officially retro (or atleast unsupported)

Postby ynari » 2018-5-26 @ 01:36

I have two GTX480s (actually three, managed to knock a component off the third and kill it), lovely cards. Yes, they are power hungry, but they're also fast.

More importantly, they can be soft modded to be a Quadro 6000, the last generation where this was possible. Great for PCI passthrough, and VDI.
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Re: NVIDIA Fermi is now officially retro (or atleast unsupported)

Postby The Serpent Rider » 2018-5-26 @ 01:47

they can be soft modded to be a Quadro 6000

With 4x less memory and probably without ECC.
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Re: NVIDIA Fermi is now officially retro (or atleast unsupported)

Postby ynari » 2018-5-27 @ 23:29

Yes you're quite right, no ECC, still 1.5GB rather than 6GB. However, it's a lot cheaper than a real Quadro 6000 - five times less even on ebay now.
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Re: NVIDIA Fermi is now officially retro (or atleast unsupported)

Postby pico1180 » 2018-5-28 @ 03:56

LunarG wrote:Retro =/= No longer officially supported.
A 2001 Ford Mondeo is by no means a new car. A lot of people would call it an old car. But it is in no way, shape or form "retro"..


I take issue with this! That shit late 90's sedan look is classically represented in the 2001 Ford Mondeo. Classic retro, my friend. Classic retro.
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Re: NVIDIA Fermi is now officially retro (or atleast unsupported)

Postby oeuvre » 2018-5-28 @ 13:07

nothing screams ultra luxury like the 2001 Ford Mondeo. Get your Maybachs, Bentleys, and Rolls Royces outta here. This place is for ultra lux only.
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Re: NVIDIA Fermi is now officially retro (or atleast unsupported)

Postby infiniteclouds » 2019-7-31 @ 21:39

Have there actually been any discovered benefits of Fermi over say... Kepler? - Which we know to be the last well-supported generation for Windows XP. I imagined Kepler cards might run into some issues with early XP but based on other posts around it seems not?
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Re: NVIDIA Fermi is now officially retro (or atleast unsupported)

Postby BushLin » 2019-7-31 @ 22:32

infiniteclouds wrote:Have there actually been any discovered benefits of Fermi over say... Kepler? - Which we know to be the last well-supported generation for Windows XP. I imagined Kepler cards might run into some issues with early XP but based on other posts around it seems not?

The only one I can think of is it's very easy to modify a Fermi BIOS to undervolt/underclock to quieten a card.
Partly because the power states are simpler and partly because the tools work.
That said, the fan on a Fermi card likely sounds like a sick engine by now and replacements are usually hard to find.
Also, Maxwell GTX 960s run great on XP and are so underutilised that they're effectively silent.

EDIT: oh yeah, heat viewtopic.php?f=63&t=60307&start=40#p775788
Last edited by BushLin on 2019-8-08 @ 19:04, edited 1 time in total.
Screw period correct, I wanted a faster system back then. I choose no dropped frames, super fast loading, fully compatible and quiet operation.
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Re: NVIDIA Fermi is now officially retro (or atleast unsupported)

Postby swaaye » 2019-8-08 @ 00:56

Yeah I was playing Dark Messiah of Might & Magic on a GTX 960 on XP the other day. Even at 1440p with maxed out settings I found the GPU fans on that particular EVGA card weren't even spinning! That's a bit different than what the GTX 580 does lol (though it is still a very quiet card.) Stupendous difference in power consumption as one would expect.

Fermi cards are probably nicer for XP though because you can run considerably older drivers. They work with the last XP release for the 8800 series for example. Which I found nice because forced AA seems quirky to get working with newer drivers.
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Re: NVIDIA Fermi is now officially retro (or atleast unsupported)

Postby The Serpent Rider » 2019-8-08 @ 01:33

They work with the last XP release for the 8800 series for example

Tesla support was stopped for all products simultaneously (G80-GT200). That's hardly an achievement.
Last edited by The Serpent Rider on 2019-8-08 @ 08:41, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: NVIDIA Fermi is now officially retro (or atleast unsupported)

Postby swaaye » 2019-8-08 @ 02:48

The point is you can run those old drivers on a Fermi card but not on the Maxwell 960.

It also occurs to me that Maxwell dropped CSAA support. Some games did support that.
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Re: NVIDIA Fermi is now officially retro (or atleast unsupported)

Postby infiniteclouds » 2019-8-08 @ 03:02

I just got a Titan Black to replace my 760GTX for my main rig. It is an Ivy-E from 2014 so I'll be installing Windows XP on a separate drive for alternate boot. Titan Black only just finally dropped low enough in price for me to get one -- I was wondering what took it so damn long until I realized it was 1K$ at release. It performs about a bit faster than a 970 but being the fastest Kepler card I'm happy to own one. Nvidia's current line-up is still dog-crap to me at the prices they're charging -- I always went for the x60 tiers for price/performance.

Yeah CSAA support is nice if only for my OCD of being able to turn up all in-game settings. I did pretty extensive 3DMark/Unigine benchmarks before and after replacing the 760GTX (4GB) and it is a nice upgrade.
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Re: NVIDIA Fermi is now officially retro (or atleast unsupported)

Postby mothergoose729 » 2019-8-08 @ 03:59

infiniteclouds wrote:I just got a Titan Black to replace my 760GTX for my main rig. It is an Ivy-E from 2014 so I'll be installing Windows XP on a separate drive for alternate boot. Titan Black only just finally dropped low enough in price for me to get one -- I was wondering what took it so damn long until I realized it was 1K$ at release. It performs about a bit faster than a 970 but being the fastest Kepler card I'm happy to own one. Nvidia's current line-up is still dog-crap to me at the prices they're charging -- I always went for the x60 tiers for price/performance.

Yeah CSAA support is nice if only for my OCD of being able to turn up all in-game settings. I did pretty extensive 3DMark/Unigine benchmarks before and after replacing the 760GTX (4GB) and it is a nice upgrade.


The titan black performs about the same as the 980ti when both are overclocked, but has more VRAM.
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Re: NVIDIA Fermi is now officially retro (or atleast unsupported)

Postby Warlord » 2019-8-08 @ 04:53

if it can play 4k youtube it isn't retro yet.
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Re: NVIDIA Fermi is now officially retro (or atleast unsupported)

Postby infiniteclouds » 2019-8-08 @ 05:03

mothergoose729 wrote:
infiniteclouds wrote:I just got a Titan Black to replace my 760GTX for my main rig. It is an Ivy-E from 2014 so I'll be installing Windows XP on a separate drive for alternate boot. Titan Black only just finally dropped low enough in price for me to get one -- I was wondering what took it so damn long until I realized it was 1K$ at release. It performs about a bit faster than a 970 but being the fastest Kepler card I'm happy to own one. Nvidia's current line-up is still dog-crap to me at the prices they're charging -- I always went for the x60 tiers for price/performance.

Yeah CSAA support is nice if only for my OCD of being able to turn up all in-game settings. I did pretty extensive 3DMark/Unigine benchmarks before and after replacing the 760GTX (4GB) and it is a nice upgrade.


The titan black performs about the same as the 980ti when both are overclocked, but has more VRAM.


Yeah? I was going by https://gpu.userbenchmark.com/

It has the 980 ti at 30-40% faster than the Titan Black.

https://gpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/N ... 3158vs3439

Or here https://technical.city/en/video/GeForce ... ITAN-BLACK
I looked at a few game benchmarks and the 980 ti seems faster in those, as well... but of course I don't have one I can test myself.

They also both have 6GB of ram.

Still, I prefer having the Black because it is the last Kepler -- I don't intend on overclocking it since I'd like it to last as long as possible.
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Re: NVIDIA Fermi is now officially retro (or atleast unsupported)

Postby mothergoose729 » 2019-8-08 @ 05:26

I'm sorry, I am thinking of the Titan X, which was maxwell.
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Re: NVIDIA Fermi is now officially retro (or atleast unsupported)

Postby TheAbandonwareGuy » 2019-8-08 @ 06:41

I think 780Ti's are going to be very expensive cards someday. Like they will be the V5 5500 of this era when they are approaching the age the V5s are now. All due to Windows XP support, proper DX9 support (Maxwell cards are shit at DX9 in most titles), CSAA support, they were some of the last cards to have analog capable DVI ports, and they were the most powerful of that final generation.

I've still got a PNY GeForce GTX 780Ti XLR8 Community Edition 3GB card inside my main gaming rig. They are still very viable. Unfortunately NVIDIA is scummy as hell and even though they were 10 percent faster than 970s in all titles when they were new, now due to NVIDIA gimping the drivers for Kepler and not porting improvements and optimizations over to the Kepler end of the deal (even though there are still TONS of Kepler cards in use) they are now 10 percent slower than a 970. I can confirm this isn't just rumour as well, I have another rig that is literally identical except it has a GTX 970 4GB SCC ACX2 (part of the reason they are losing ground might be related to memory limitations, honestly) and my 780ti rig is losing more and more ground on it in new titles as time goes on.

Such a beautiful card. Seriously they don't make them this well anymore. White LEDS inside clear fans, with an aluminum shroud and jet black backplate.

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