VOGONS


First post, by Old PC Hunter

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Hello, I have come here today looking for help and a solution as to why I cannot get any driver supplied by ATI to work on my system. This system I built for playing DirectX 9 games at high settings, and I put Windows 7 x64 on it due to some former XP games only supporting 7 now (Half Life 2). I really want to get this card to work properly, but driver issues have gotten in my way. Firstly, no driver supplied by ATI is able to work with this configuration as of yet. I run the drivers in compatibilty mode for Vista SP2, they install, but nothing happens. The only drivers that work with the card are the ones supplied by Microsoft, but they have their own issues. With these Microsoft drivers, no OpenGL game (except minecraft, 🤣) works properly. CoD 1 just has black bars all over the screen and warping and flickering that you can barely make out an image. Doom 3 is the same way. DirectX 9 programs work great with no artifacting. On one rare occasion, I was able to get Catalyst 10.2 working with the Windows driver, but ATI Overdrive is not present, and the card does not change its clocks to 650/775 when gaming, they always stay on 500/594. Another issue i'm having is that the drivers i try to install always get overwritten by the windows drivers. Ive tried to get them to stop being overwritten by windows by unplugging my network cable, but I see that the drivers are cached in Driverstore and I cannot delete those files there. What I do not understand is how many with the same card are able to get the latest drivers working under compatibility mode in Windows 7 and have the boost clocks working as well.

Any help will be appreciated
Thanks,
Old PC Hunter

Set up retro boxes:
DOS:286 10 MHZ/ET4000AX1MB/270 MB HDD/4 MB RAM/Adlib/80287 XL
W98:P2 450/Radeon 7000 64 MB/23 GB HDD/SB 16 clone/384 MB RAM
XP:ATHLON X2 6000+/2 GB RAM/Radeon X1900XTX/2x120 GB SSD/1x160 GB and 1x250 GB 7.2k HDD's/ECS A740 GM-M/SB X-Fi

Reply 2 of 21, by Old PC Hunter

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Tried those drivers, but they failed to work. I think one problem i'm having is that when I scan for hardware changes after uninstalling my driver, it detects the VGA controller and then just immediately installs the driver. I deleted the cached driver from Driverstore, but it's found the driver DLL's in different locations and just installs an alternate driver which dosent solve my problems. I cannot get it to stop installing the Windows driver and just leave me with a VGA compatible device in Device Manager, which I can install my own drivers to.

Set up retro boxes:
DOS:286 10 MHZ/ET4000AX1MB/270 MB HDD/4 MB RAM/Adlib/80287 XL
W98:P2 450/Radeon 7000 64 MB/23 GB HDD/SB 16 clone/384 MB RAM
XP:ATHLON X2 6000+/2 GB RAM/Radeon X1900XTX/2x120 GB SSD/1x160 GB and 1x250 GB 7.2k HDD's/ECS A740 GM-M/SB X-Fi

Reply 4 of 21, by Scali

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The Serpent Rider wrote:

Get old DriverCleaner and delete all ATi data.

This.
Have you ever had a newer (DX10+) ATi/AMD card in your machine?
I had, and the uninstaller left some DLLs on my drive.
The XT1900XTX didn't work, because the driver optionally loads these DLLs when they are present, not checking whether or not the hardware actually supports it.
This led the OpenGL driver to crash because of a nullpointer somewhere, which meant that no OpenGL software worked.
After cleaning all ATi-related files and then re-installing the legacy XT1900XTX driver, it worked again.
See also my blog here: https://scalibq.wordpress.com/2012/03/03/lega … ms-with-opengl/

http://scalibq.wordpress.com/just-keeping-it- … ro-programming/

Reply 5 of 21, by Old PC Hunter

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I already used DDU to clean all the files, but ive found multiple DLL's on the system that go with the driver. I'll attempt to remove every last one of them. Also no, the x1900xtx is the only GPU this system has ever had. After I clear all the DLL's, i'll attempt to install a driver, then if OpenGL support still dosent work, i'll attempt using a different driver or look for more ATI related files as stated above.

Set up retro boxes:
DOS:286 10 MHZ/ET4000AX1MB/270 MB HDD/4 MB RAM/Adlib/80287 XL
W98:P2 450/Radeon 7000 64 MB/23 GB HDD/SB 16 clone/384 MB RAM
XP:ATHLON X2 6000+/2 GB RAM/Radeon X1900XTX/2x120 GB SSD/1x160 GB and 1x250 GB 7.2k HDD's/ECS A740 GM-M/SB X-Fi

Reply 6 of 21, by swaaye

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I have used a variety of X1000 series cards over the years with no drama with XP and Win7. DDU is certainly not a necessary step. What is the CPU and motherboard / chipset involved here? It is possible that something very modern could be a problem with ATI's driver setup program. I ran into that with a Sandy Bridge 2500K CPU and Catalyst 5.8. I was able to workaround the problem with manual install via device manager and running the Catalyst Control Center setup separately. I have not tried a X1000 card with any CPUs newer than Sandy Bridge.

To prevent Windows 7 from automatically installing drivers, be sure Windows Update is not set to automatically install "recommended updates". Just have it do the "important updates".

10.2 works fine for the most part, however you may want to use Catalyst 7.11. The Vista build may work with Win7. After 7.11 the ATI OpenGL driver was "modernized" (I believe it was a rewrite) and they dropped a lot of old extensions and it causes problems with old games. Missing effects for example.

Regarding clock speeds, I too have noticed that some programs report the card isn't clocking up with 3D programs. I believe there are some monitoring programs that do show it is behaving properly however. So don't worry about that.

Reply 7 of 21, by Scali

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Old PC Hunter wrote:

I already used DDU to clean all the files, but ive found multiple DLL's on the system that go with the driver. I'll attempt to remove every last one of them. Also no, the x1900xtx is the only GPU this system has ever had. After I clear all the DLL's, i'll attempt to install a driver, then if OpenGL support still dosent work, i'll attempt using a different driver or look for more ATI related files as stated above.

What may help is to let Windows install the driver first... And after that, install the Catalyst on top of that.
I believe that convinces Windows that it had already updated it, and the one you put on is newer/better, so it will leave you alone after that.

http://scalibq.wordpress.com/just-keeping-it- … ro-programming/

Reply 8 of 21, by Old PC Hunter

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I have not tried the solutions above yet, but one thing I can say is I know for sure it's not clocking up. When I take GPU Z and put it on another monitor, it always shows the clocks at 500/594, even at %100 load. I also know it isn't clocking up because i'm getting substansially better 3Dmark06 scores when I overclock the card to what it's supposed to boost it's clocks to during 3D applications. For example, I get my system to give me around 5100 3Dmarks at 500/594, but when I overclock it to x1900xt 3D speeds, I get around 6050 3dmarks. I also noticed that in games I get better framerates when it is overclocked to the 3D speeds. Also, the only way I was able to get Catalyst to work with the Windows driver was by installing Catalyst 8.2 after the Windows driver install, but it did not leave me alone. Also, I tried installing 7.10 for Vista 64 and it didn't work, but i'll try again. Also, I doubt the cpu/motherboard/chipset is a problem, but the CPU is an AMD Athlon 64 X2 6000+, paired with an ECS A740 GM-M motherboard and a 740G chipset. I'm also pretty sure I have Windows Update set to important updates. I'm not home right now, so I cant check. But when I finally get home, i'll try installing the driver through Device Manager, and install Catalyst on top, but first I need to remove every single ATI DLL or driver package from driverstore or it's gonna automatically install the driver before I can even click on Video Controller (VGA compatible).

Set up retro boxes:
DOS:286 10 MHZ/ET4000AX1MB/270 MB HDD/4 MB RAM/Adlib/80287 XL
W98:P2 450/Radeon 7000 64 MB/23 GB HDD/SB 16 clone/384 MB RAM
XP:ATHLON X2 6000+/2 GB RAM/Radeon X1900XTX/2x120 GB SSD/1x160 GB and 1x250 GB 7.2k HDD's/ECS A740 GM-M/SB X-Fi

Reply 9 of 21, by swaaye

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Something else you can do with Win7 is just set Windows Update to not install updates automatically at all. Instead set it to notify you of new updates and then go through them and choose what you want.

And the "Delete the driver software for this device" option in device manager should work to get rid of driver files when you uninstall a device. I don't think I've ever had a problem with that. Use that, then do a "scan for hardware changes". If it finds a driver again do the delete process another time. Sometimes there are multiple revisions stored as backups for the "driver rollback" function.

You usually can't just go deleting on your own on anything after Windows 98 because Windows may silently restore those files as a part of Windows File Protection. Vista added that "delete driver software" checkbox.

Reply 10 of 21, by Old PC Hunter

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I have finally found the time to work on this issue again. I have found out that Windows has been set on important updates this whole time. I also have it on never check for updates. I tried deleting dll's of the driver but I do not have the permissions to do so. I see there are about 5 copies of every single DLL. Continiously uninstalling does not remove every driver file. Iv'e uninstalled these drivers on this computer about 20 times since ive had this card and it still keeps installing the same driver version even when I'm not connected to the internet. Gonna try DriverCleaner now.

Set up retro boxes:
DOS:286 10 MHZ/ET4000AX1MB/270 MB HDD/4 MB RAM/Adlib/80287 XL
W98:P2 450/Radeon 7000 64 MB/23 GB HDD/SB 16 clone/384 MB RAM
XP:ATHLON X2 6000+/2 GB RAM/Radeon X1900XTX/2x120 GB SSD/1x160 GB and 1x250 GB 7.2k HDD's/ECS A740 GM-M/SB X-Fi

Reply 12 of 21, by Old PC Hunter

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I did use DDU as stated above. Last night, I was able to successfully install a driver, but ive run into more issues. I was able to install the driver by going to gpedit.msc and disabling windows from installing any drivers from there. I was then able to scan for hardware changes and get the VGA controller to display without Windows instantly installing drivers for it. I ran the 7.10 Catalyst setup, but did a custom install and made it so it did not install Catalyst or any other crap. The install of course failed, since I made it so Windows couldn't install drivers anymore, so I went back to gpedit.msc and re-allowed windows to install drivers. I guess the quick re-enabling of the policy confused Windows so it didn't automatically install the VGA driver. I then proceeded to click on VGA controller and I manually installed the driver. The installation was successful, but the drivers don't work due to error code 52, saying that Windows cannot verify the driver signatures. I feel like I might know how to fix this, but it might just be that the drivers are incompatible. If anyone knows how to fix this, please tell me here.

Set up retro boxes:
DOS:286 10 MHZ/ET4000AX1MB/270 MB HDD/4 MB RAM/Adlib/80287 XL
W98:P2 450/Radeon 7000 64 MB/23 GB HDD/SB 16 clone/384 MB RAM
XP:ATHLON X2 6000+/2 GB RAM/Radeon X1900XTX/2x120 GB SSD/1x160 GB and 1x250 GB 7.2k HDD's/ECS A740 GM-M/SB X-Fi

Reply 13 of 21, by swaaye

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Actually now that I think about this more, I'm sure that Win7 shipped with a driver for the X1000 cards. Windows Update isn't downloading it.

Is this what you've been trying to install? It must say legacy.
10-2_legacy_vista32-64_dd_ccc.exe

All I've ever done is install 10.2 Legacy on top of those MS drivers and have not had any problems. Lots of Direct3D and OpenGL games tried.

I'm not sure I've tried Vista 7.11 on Windows 7. It may not work. I use the XP version and Windows XP. Sounds like the driver signature isn't working with 7. You can bypass the driver signing requirement though if you want to mess with that.

Reply 14 of 21, by Scali

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There is no official driver for Windows 7 for the Radeon 1x00-series. That's one of the reasons why I replaced mine.
Mind you, you could install the Vista legacy driver under Windows 7, and it worked reasonably well.

But as I said, you should plug the card in and let Windows detect it first, and install its drivers. Then install your drivers on top of that (don't try to uninstall the ones Windows installed first).

http://scalibq.wordpress.com/just-keeping-it- … ro-programming/

Reply 15 of 21, by Old PC Hunter

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Update: The 7.10 drivers do work, after disabling driver signature enforcment. They work fine, and they fix my OpenGL problem in atleast one game so far. I havent tried other games yet. They also upclock the GPU and I get proper 3dMark scores now and better preformance. The only issues I am having is that these drivers seemed to drop compatibility for some games, such as newer GL titles like Minecraft, but that isnt too much of an issue as I probably wont be playing that too much on my system. For some reason, Battlefield 2 half-works on these drivers. It worked very well on the previous ones. Some maps work, but last night, I tried to join Wake Island multiple times and the game kept crashing. Karkand worked, but I havent tried any other maps besides that. In some games though it feels like the preformance is worse but of course those are always the games made after the driver's release. The major problem though is that Catalyst dosent work at all. It says failed to load CLI implementation or something like that. I think I am going to replace these drivers though due to me not being able to fully enjoy BF2, and BF2 is one of my main games I play. I am gonna probably try 7.11 next, then attempt to install Catalyst 8.2 or something because that was the only Catalyst that ever worked on this system

Set up retro boxes:
DOS:286 10 MHZ/ET4000AX1MB/270 MB HDD/4 MB RAM/Adlib/80287 XL
W98:P2 450/Radeon 7000 64 MB/23 GB HDD/SB 16 clone/384 MB RAM
XP:ATHLON X2 6000+/2 GB RAM/Radeon X1900XTX/2x120 GB SSD/1x160 GB and 1x250 GB 7.2k HDD's/ECS A740 GM-M/SB X-Fi

Reply 16 of 21, by swaaye

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Their driver quality varied wildly back then. That 7.11 era had some hotfix releases too. It was also the year of broken Direct3D on AGP bridge cards IIRC. And yeah they did some kind of overhaul to the OpenGL at that time which probably improved something while hosing various oldies.

And also the monthly Catalyst releases were funky. They were alternating development trees so there was a big lag time for fixes unless they did a Hotfix release. And in that case you'd get something like 7.10 Hotfix that was newer than the normal 7.12 release. It was messy. My "favorite" disaster was when Rage was released. There were about 4 Hotfix drivers spewed forth over 2 months as they tried to shore up their OpenGL again. It was unclear which driver to use.

Reply 17 of 21, by The Serpent Rider

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Radeon X1xxx series are not very pleasant to run under Vista/7 environment overall, especially any crossfire setup.

Get up, come on get down with the sickness
Open up your hate, and let it flow into me

Reply 18 of 21, by Old PC Hunter

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Well, the setup has been working fine, until now. I got 7.11 working and I used the driver for several days without preformance drops or issues and I was able to overclock to 688/792 with ATI overdrive and the card did not pass 80c even on stock cooling with the fan at 100%. I got Quake 4 to work, by enabling GL triple buffering, but then the game all of a sudden dosent want to work anymore. It had pretty poor preformance at ultra 1280x1024, with my framerates being in the 30s most of the time but dropping below that a lot, but there were no graphical errors. When I boot the game now, windows says that atioglxxx.dll is just crashing. But now I have a different issue. I was playing F.E.A.R on the card for about 3 hours, and then the preformance started to feel a lot lower than it normally did. I was right with this suspicion, and testing the game with the ingame benchmark yielded me an average of 60 fps. I am also getting more stuttering in the game now. I used to get 84 fps avg with 1152x864 4x aa/8x af, but now it dropped below that. Every time I boot the game now the game averages 60 fps. I also notice in 3dmark06, my scores have been a lot lower. I havent noticed any programs hogging resources. I normally get 6100 3dmarks, but right after FEAR started having issues I got 5975 3dmarks. Keep in mind every time iv'e run 3dmark in the past iv'e never had a score drop so far like this. I notice sometimes the score is normal, sometimes it is not. I really do not know what to say at this point.

Set up retro boxes:
DOS:286 10 MHZ/ET4000AX1MB/270 MB HDD/4 MB RAM/Adlib/80287 XL
W98:P2 450/Radeon 7000 64 MB/23 GB HDD/SB 16 clone/384 MB RAM
XP:ATHLON X2 6000+/2 GB RAM/Radeon X1900XTX/2x120 GB SSD/1x160 GB and 1x250 GB 7.2k HDD's/ECS A740 GM-M/SB X-Fi

Reply 19 of 21, by Old PC Hunter

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I think I might of been overreacting too much, because scores are getting slowly back to normal, but my preformance in FEAR is the same.

Set up retro boxes:
DOS:286 10 MHZ/ET4000AX1MB/270 MB HDD/4 MB RAM/Adlib/80287 XL
W98:P2 450/Radeon 7000 64 MB/23 GB HDD/SB 16 clone/384 MB RAM
XP:ATHLON X2 6000+/2 GB RAM/Radeon X1900XTX/2x120 GB SSD/1x160 GB and 1x250 GB 7.2k HDD's/ECS A740 GM-M/SB X-Fi