VOGONS


First post, by JayAlien

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Hello Vogons,
I've run into a problem with a computer I'm playing about with. This computer was previously running Windows 98 with a Radeon X850 Pro (256MB), but I wanted a slower card in there. I've previously run this computer without issue for a few years.

I thought a Radeon 9x00 would be more period correct, but went for a Radeon X700 Pro AGP 256Mb in lieu of a 9800 XT, as they're about the same performance but a fraction of the cost. The only change aside from the GPU is the operating system, a fresh install of XP SP3 instead of W98

Specs of new build
Windows XP SP3
X700 Pro AGP
Athlon 3200+
GA-7VT600 - firmware 15
512MB

In Bios I loaded failsafe defaults, I've forced 8x AGP (from the default of Auto). I've changed the AGP aperture size to 256MB (from a default of 128MB). I changed init display first from PCI to AGP.

And now the problem:
1. An extra item is showing in device manager. I have the X700 primary and secondary showing, but I have a third unknown device
2. 3Dmark 2000 runs fine (13322), but 3D mark 2001SE won't run the benchmark, it tells me I don't have enough video memory for the default resolution
3. 3DMark 2001 system specs reports Total Local Video Memory as 256MB, but Total AGP Memory as 117MB
4. 3DMark03 gives COMM Surrogate error and won't initialize

Anyone have any ideas on this?
Thanks
J

386sx25 SBP2 2M
P75(486) SB16 8M
P133 S3 Vir DX A64g 32M
P233MMX R128Pro A64 64M
Pii400 TNT2 Live! 128M
P3-1G V5 M80 256M
P3-1.4G R8500 A1 256M
A3200 9700Pro A2 512M
X6800 X850XT A2ZS 1G
E8600 X1950XTX Xfi 2G
QX9650 3870 Xfi 2G
i7-975 GTX570 Xfi 3GB

Reply 1 of 8, by The Serpent Rider

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but I have a third unknown device

Probably ATI Rage Theater chip.

I must be some kind of standard: the anonymous gangbanger of the 21st century.

Reply 2 of 8, by JayAlien

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Thanks Serpent Rider, now that you mention that, that rings a bell. I'm surprised the drivers (10.2 from the AMD site) don't include the driver for that.
I installed UT99 for an additional test, and it seems to work fine. Perhaps I'm just running into quirky 3dmark issues, although quite surprised 03 won't run as all the hardware is pretty close to that period.
J

386sx25 SBP2 2M
P75(486) SB16 8M
P133 S3 Vir DX A64g 32M
P233MMX R128Pro A64 64M
Pii400 TNT2 Live! 128M
P3-1G V5 M80 256M
P3-1.4G R8500 A1 256M
A3200 9700Pro A2 512M
X6800 X850XT A2ZS 1G
E8600 X1950XTX Xfi 2G
QX9650 3870 Xfi 2G
i7-975 GTX570 Xfi 3GB

Reply 4 of 8, by JayAlien

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A further observation, UT99 works flawlessly (except the lack of resolution options, however UT03 is a garbled mess. The audio works, but the graphics are a mix between wireframe and random patches of shading.

386sx25 SBP2 2M
P75(486) SB16 8M
P133 S3 Vir DX A64g 32M
P233MMX R128Pro A64 64M
Pii400 TNT2 Live! 128M
P3-1G V5 M80 256M
P3-1.4G R8500 A1 256M
A3200 9700Pro A2 512M
X6800 X850XT A2ZS 1G
E8600 X1950XTX Xfi 2G
QX9650 3870 Xfi 2G
i7-975 GTX570 Xfi 3GB

Reply 5 of 8, by swaaye

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Hey that card has the AGP to PCIe bridge chip. That is something that tends to cause problems with various motherboard AGP implementations.

You might want to search the forum and see if anyone else ran into issues with KT600 and that chip. It's called Rialto.

Reply 6 of 8, by JayAlien

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Hi Swaaye, I hadn't thought of that. Those bridge chips were pretty common towards the end of the AGP era - cards were developed for the PCI-e bus, then 'retrofitted' with the AGP interface and bridge chip to make them work. I had a look around, didn't find anything specifically on this forum, however I found a few mentions around the web about compatibility issues with VIA chipsets overall. I think my best bet is to pick up another AGP card that pre-dates the arrival of PCI-e then I can avoid this problem. Unfortunately the nVidia FX series and Radeon 9xxx series seem quite collectible currently 🙁

Edit:
As mentioned, this PC in its previous incarnation was running a Radeon X850 Pro AGP on Windows 98. I ran this PC for many years without issue. I assume that the Radeon X850 Pro AGP also uses a bridge chip, I'm wondering if Windows 98 is more tolerant of these chips. With that in mind, I'm tempted to put Windows 98 back on here and see if these issues go away.

386sx25 SBP2 2M
P75(486) SB16 8M
P133 S3 Vir DX A64g 32M
P233MMX R128Pro A64 64M
Pii400 TNT2 Live! 128M
P3-1G V5 M80 256M
P3-1.4G R8500 A1 256M
A3200 9700Pro A2 512M
X6800 X850XT A2ZS 1G
E8600 X1950XTX Xfi 2G
QX9650 3870 Xfi 2G
i7-975 GTX570 Xfi 3GB

Reply 7 of 8, by swaaye

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Stirring the brain here... You may want to try a wide range of Catalyst releases. I ran an X800XL with the bridge chip for awhile and I remember ATI had poor QA testing for their bridged cards. In fact I remember there was some amount of releases with broken D3D. I had the card on a K8M800 motherboard.

I'm not sure what the oldest driver supporting the card is but that would be a place to start. Drivers prior to 5.9 have truform support by the way. But 5.8 seems to have very poor truform performance so probably avoid that one.