VOGONS


First post, by Robx66

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Hi, got Voodoo 1 to play with... bought it as non working. Few capacitors damaged or missing. Checked pin legs, resistors fine. After fixing that windows 98se recognise it, installs drivers etc. All seems OK but can't see anything when trying to run d3d test in dxdiag just a black screen and after that ask8ng me if I see this and that. Donut demo starts and closes immediately. Don't know if I need any special drivers or I'm missing something. It's a fresh install of win98se with direct 8 installed. Tried with dx7 too and same thing. Pics attached.
Don't know what to try. Any help appreciated.
Thanks

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Reply 1 of 32, by Robx66

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Also nearly 55 Celsius on tmu with no load. Is it normal? ...

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Reply 2 of 32, by Robx66

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Thats the one...

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Reply 3 of 32, by Rwolf

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I don't have exactly these, but some of the online photos I see of them do have a couple of heatsinks on the 3Dfx chips.

Looking at some pictures at a museum site: http://hw-museum.cz/vga/3/a-trend-helios-3d

I can see some components that differs (in the middle of the back side):
R148: you have this mounted - the other board has not.
R149: you have this missing - other board has it mounted.

Reply 4 of 32, by Imperious

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You really need to test it in Pure Dos mode with Tomb Raider 3DFX executable.

Also You can get hold of the 3dfx sdk and run MOJO (in dos) which will help with diagnosis.

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Reply 5 of 32, by drosse1meyer

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you shouldnt need heatsinks for voodoo1. even voodoo2 didnt come with heatsinks. however its not a bad idea to finagle a cooling solution for longevity's sake.

+1 to the mojo / dos test idea

P1: Packard Bell - 233 MMX, Voodoo1, 64 MB, ALS100+
P2-V2: Dell Dimension - 400 Mhz, Voodoo2, 256 MB
P!!! Custom: 1 Ghz, GeForce2 Pro/64MB, 384 MB

Reply 6 of 32, by Robx66

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Imperious wrote on 2023-05-16, 00:31:

You really need to test it in Pure Dos mode with Tomb Raider 3DFX executable.

Also You can get hold of the 3dfx sdk and run MOJO (in dos) which will help with diagnosis.

Will run mojo test soon and see what I will get and will let you know.

Save vintage / retro computers from ending up in the bin. Keep them in working condition. It's a great history !

Reply 7 of 32, by Robx66

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So I did run MOJO and that's what I got from it...
Screen capture as well from mojo without log and log as you can see underneath.

sst1Init Routines: InitCode $Revision: 8 $
sst1InitMapBoard(): BoardsInSystem = 1
sst1InitMapBoard(): vAddr:0xe1000000 pAddr:0xe1000008 Dev:0x14 Board:0
sst1InitRegisters(): Setting TREX-to-FBI FIFO THRESHOLD to 0x8...
sst1InitRegisters(): Setting PRELIM FT-CLK delay to 0x8...
sst1InitDacDetect(): Entered...
sst1InitDacDetectICS(): Entered...
dacWr(0x7,0xb)
dacRd(0x5,0x79)
dacRd(0x5,0x2e)
dacWr(0x7,0x1)
dacRd(0x5,0x55)
dacRd(0x5,0x49)
dacWr(0x7,0x7)
dacRd(0x5,0x71)
dacRd(0x5,0x29)
sst1InitDacDetectICS(): Exiting...
sst1InitRegisters(): Storing TREX0INIT0=0x5441
sst1InitRegisters(): Storing TREX0INIT1=0xf420
sst1InitRegisters(): Storing TREX1INIT0=0x5441
sst1InitRegisters(): Storing TREX1INIT1=0xf420
sst1InitRegisters(): Storing TREX2INIT0=0x5441
sst1InitRegisters(): Storing TREX2INIT1=0xf420
sst1InitSetGrxClk(): Entered...
dacWr(0x7,0xe)
dacRd(0x5,0x0)
dacWr(0x4,0xa)
dacWr(0x5,0x7b)
dacWr(0x5,0x6c)
dacWr(0x4,0xe)
dacWr(0x5,0x0)
sst1InitRegisters(): Setting up FAST DRAM Configuration
sst1DeviceInfo: Board ID: Obsidian GE
sst1DeviceInfo: FbiConfig:0x2, TmuConfig:0x1
sst1DeviceInfo: FBI Revision:2, TMU Revison:1, Num TMUs:1
sst1DeviceInfo: FBI Memory:2, TMU[0] Memory:2
sst1DeviceInfo: Dac Type: ICS ICS5342
sst1DeviceInfo: SliDetect:0
sst1InitRegisters(): LFB Writes go through memory FIFO...
sst1InitRegisters(): TEXTURE Writes go through memory FIFO...
sst1InitRegisters(): exiting with status 1...
sst1InitShutdown(): Shutting down SST-1 #0...
sst1InitSetGrxClk(): Entered...
dacWr(0x7,0xe)
dacRd(0x5,0x0)
dacWr(0x4,0xa)
dacWr(0x5,0x41)
dacWr(0x5,0x62)
dacWr(0x4,0xe)
dacWr(0x5,0x0)
sst1InitShutdown(): Returning with status 1...

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Reply 8 of 32, by drosse1meyer

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I'm not an expert on mojo.exe but the output looks OK. Detects the FBI, TMU, memory and doesnt hang at any point. Have you tried the DOS tomb raider 3dfx ver? (This could point to a problem with your Windows 3dfx drivers and/or installation)

P1: Packard Bell - 233 MMX, Voodoo1, 64 MB, ALS100+
P2-V2: Dell Dimension - 400 Mhz, Voodoo2, 256 MB
P!!! Custom: 1 Ghz, GeForce2 Pro/64MB, 384 MB

Reply 9 of 32, by Robx66

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drosse1meyer wrote on 2023-05-17, 23:06:

I'm not an expert on mojo.exe but the output looks OK. Detects the FBI, TMU, memory and doesnt hang at any point. Have you tried the DOS tomb raider 3dfx ver? (This could point to a problem with your Windows 3dfx drivers and/or installation)

For me it looks completely normal. I haven't tried anything in DOS to be fair. Would have to gat that Tomb Raider for dos from somewhere...
Seems like will be lots of digging on Google for it unless someone knows where to get it from ??

Save vintage / retro computers from ending up in the bin. Keep them in working condition. It's a great history !

Reply 10 of 32, by Imperious

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I Think You can use the demo version https://archive.org/details/tomb3dem
This is the 3dfx version.

Atari 2600, TI994a, Vic20, c64, ZX Spectrum 128, Amstrad CPC464, Atari 65XE, Commodore Plus/4, Amiga 500
PC's from XT 8088, 486, Pentium MMX, K6, Athlon, P3, P4, 775, to current Ryzen 5600x.

Reply 11 of 32, by Robx66

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Imperious wrote on 2023-05-18, 00:12:

I Think You can use the demo version https://archive.org/details/tomb3dem
This is the 3dfx version.

Thank you !! I will try it when get back home from work 😀

Save vintage / retro computers from ending up in the bin. Keep them in working condition. It's a great history !

Reply 12 of 32, by Robx66

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Ok, I did a test on Tomb Raider for 3dfx in dos.
Instalation went fine. When I started demo my screen went straight into suspend mode. In this case it seems like there I no signal from voodoo to the monitor.
I did some voltage measurements on ramdac and ramdac has its 5 Volts on input and crystal oscillator on way in has voltage around 1.2-1.3 Volts but..... there is no voltage on way out of the oscillator at all. Tried with handheld oscilloscope to see if there is 14MHz and nothing at all on the way out. My thinking is that the crystal oscillator doesn't work or signal on the way out of the oscillator is shortened to ground somewhere.
I might try to replace the crystal tomorrow and see what happens. Thankfully I've got a spare new one so can give it a go.

Save vintage / retro computers from ending up in the bin. Keep them in working condition. It's a great history !

Reply 13 of 32, by Imperious

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It won't be the oscillator. MOJO is correctly identifying the DAC, TMU, and FBI and would not be able to without the oscilator running.

You can try disabling the TMU/FBI or limiting the Ram amount and see if that gets it working.
see my post here 3dfx Voodoo 1 fault diagnosis and repair

Atari 2600, TI994a, Vic20, c64, ZX Spectrum 128, Amstrad CPC464, Atari 65XE, Commodore Plus/4, Amiga 500
PC's from XT 8088, 486, Pentium MMX, K6, Athlon, P3, P4, 775, to current Ryzen 5600x.

Reply 14 of 32, by drosse1meyer

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Are you using a pass through or manually changing the VGA cable to the voodoo's VGA-out?

Are the games running? For example, do you hear any game noise when you get the blank screen?

Does your LCD support the resolution mode of 512x384? That is the lowest default mode voodoo will start with iirc

P1: Packard Bell - 233 MMX, Voodoo1, 64 MB, ALS100+
P2-V2: Dell Dimension - 400 Mhz, Voodoo2, 256 MB
P!!! Custom: 1 Ghz, GeForce2 Pro/64MB, 384 MB

Reply 15 of 32, by bloodem

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Robx66 wrote on 2023-05-18, 12:25:
Ok, I did a test on Tomb Raider for 3dfx in dos. Instalation went fine. When I started demo my screen went straight into suspend […]
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Ok, I did a test on Tomb Raider for 3dfx in dos.
Instalation went fine. When I started demo my screen went straight into suspend mode. In this case it seems like there I no signal from voodoo to the monitor.
I did some voltage measurements on ramdac and ramdac has its 5 Volts on input and crystal oscillator on way in has voltage around 1.2-1.3 Volts but..... there is no voltage on way out of the oscillator at all. Tried with handheld oscilloscope to see if there is 14MHz and nothing at all on the way out. My thinking is that the crystal oscillator doesn't work or signal on the way out of the oscillator is shortened to ground somewhere.
I might try to replace the crystal tomorrow and see what happens. Thankfully I've got a spare new one so can give it a go.

What system are you using to test the Voodoo card?
Personally, I've encountered all kinds of issues when running a working Voodoo 1 on a faster system (anywhere from "signal out of range" to checkerboard patterns/artifacts on the screen).
So, my suggestion before trying anything else with the card, is to make sure you test it on a period correct socket 7 motherboard with a Pentium MMX or similar CPU running at FSB 66 MHz or less.

As others have pointed out, that MOJO output looks fine, so the oscillator should also be fine in this case. The card might still have other issues (like faulty memory ICs), but you need to test it on a slow system, otherwise you might come to the wrong conclusion.

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Reply 16 of 32, by Robx66

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drosse1meyer wrote on 2023-05-19, 11:44:

Are you using a pass through or manually changing the VGA cable to the voodoo's VGA-out?

Are the games running? For example, do you hear any game noise when you get the blank screen?

Does your LCD support the resolution mode of 512x384? That is the lowest default mode voodoo will start with iirc

I'm using pass through cable. Can't hear anything as don't have sound card in it. Got SB Live Pci but not sure if will be ok for win98se or need to be some isa card.
Lcd for sure can display 640x480 but don't know If any lower than that. Need to find a spec and see.

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Reply 17 of 32, by Gmlb256

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bloodem wrote on 2023-05-19, 11:59:

What system are you using to test the Voodoo card?
Personally, I've encountered all kinds of issues when running a working Voodoo 1 on a faster system (anywhere from "signal out of range" to checkerboard patterns/artifacts on the screen).
So, my suggestion before trying anything else with the card, is to make sure you test it on a period correct socket 7 motherboard with a Pentium MMX or similar CPU running at FSB 66 MHz or less.

OP is testing it on a Pentium 200MMX computer if you look the second picture which displays DxDiag.

Last edited by Gmlb256 on 2023-05-19, 12:27. Edited 1 time in total.

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Reply 18 of 32, by konc

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bloodem wrote on 2023-05-19, 11:59:

What system are you using to test the Voodoo card?

I thought the same, but second screenshot (DirectX diags) shows a P1 MMX. Yes detection might be completely wrong, but with 16MB RAM it's unlikely that it is something too fast like a PIII

Edit: heh exactly what Gmlb256 wrote seconds earlier

Reply 19 of 32, by bloodem

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konc wrote on 2023-05-19, 12:26:

I thought the same, but second screenshot (DirectX diags) shows a P1 MMX. Yes detection might be completely wrong, but with 16MB RAM it's unlikely that it is something too fast like a PIII

True, my bad. Sadly, I skipped through most of the pictures in the first post. 😁
I did read that he was using DirectX 8 initially, so it didn't even occur to me that he was using it on a P MMX build.

1 x PLCC-68 / 2 x PGA132 / 5 x Skt 3 / 9 x Skt 7 / 12 x SS7 / 1 x Skt 8 / 14 x Slot 1 / 5 x Slot A
5 x Skt 370 / 8 x Skt A / 2 x Skt 478 / 2 x Skt 754 / 3 x Skt 939 / 7 x LGA775 / 1 x LGA1155
Current PC: Ryzen 7 5800X3D
Backup PC: Core i7 7700k