🤣

If You look carefully at the instructions presented at that site i would say that the author of that site read this forum very well.

It's basicly what everybody on this forum allready knows.

Maybe the author should credit Vogons for it as the text on the website matches this forum in more than one way

I know, so what?

He did what nobody else took the time to do:

A compreensive tutorial for people who know nothing about DOS

I think it is quite good
😉

And BTW, even with this forum I wasn't able to make Blood run in XP, even though I asked too many ppl...
No one answered!

Originally posted by Col.J.P. Just found out an incredible work from Matt Bovett that makes both Blood, Shadow Warrior and Duke 3D working great under Windows XP at 640x480 with only software render!

Hrmmm...

Its the original games working like a dream in Windows XP with new hardware like an Audigy 2 and a Geforce FX

Good sound and the original atmosphere from Blood and Duke 3D is untouched

How much in-depth testing have you done? CLI2NOP inherently reduces game stability.

You wont be disapointed,

I am. Like QBix said, this info has been available for quite some time.

Originally posted by Col.J.P. I know, so what? He did what nobody else took the time to do: A compreensive tutorial for people […]
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Originally posted by Col.J.P. I know, so what?

He did what nobody else took the time to do:

A compreensive tutorial for people who know nothing about DOS

Excuse me?

showthread.php?threadid=726

It's almost a clone of the BUILD games post in the Problem Children thread.

Of greater concern are some definite errors and inaccuracies:

Apparently, some people think CLI2NOP is only required under Windows NT 4.0 and Windows 2000, but not Windows XP. VDMSound also has something like CLI2NOP built into it. If I were you, I'd use CLI2NOP just in case. It won't harm anything.

Did he not read up on what CLI2NOP does? If you use it at a minimal level, you might increase performance without crashing too much, but CLI2NOP should only be used when you have to...

Running this file in a DOS window before you run a game will let you use the 640x480 resolution in VESA mode. ... I've found that 800x600 doesn't work in any of the games (I get a "Out of scan range" error on my monitor when I try to use that resolution). You can try it, but I think all of the games look and play just fine in 640x480.

This presumes that everyone has a hardware configuration like his. Some cards (like the GF4) won't go beyond 640x480, others (like my GF3) will go all the way up to 1600x1200. Some cards don't even need NOLFB (like some ATI models) and may actually interfere with video.

Use of NOLFB shouldn't be presumed.

uncheck Enable CD digital audio for this device. This will enable analog CD audio which means you will only be able to hear CD audio through headphones plugged directly into the CD-ROM.

Again, this is on his setup. If there is an analog audio cable hooked up to the CD, and the soundcard properly supports it...the CD audio should still play through the soundcard.

<Referring to the SMK video files in BLOOD>

they should work since you will be using NOLFB which
enables 640x480 VESA mode (which the videos use).

He's mistaken here. The smacker videos are 320x200. Odds are, it's a compatibility issue between the game's built-in video player and the video card. That would be hard to troubleshoot...

Also, I don't know why he recommended these methods for Duke3D when the Windows-native source ports were already available.

I'm guessing that he's running something slower than 1.7GHz, because the Cryptic Passages add-on is speed-sensitive. Somewhere before that speed, it's executable will start breaking with runtime errors. These can be fixed with CTBPPAT.

To be fair, I haven't added that data to the BUILD games post yet...then again, I wasn't giving advice on "Cryptic Passages" either.

And BTW, even with this forum I wasn't able to make Blood run in XP, even though I asked too many ppl...
No one answered!

At the risk of sounding rude (and younger than I actually am..)...

Dude, what kind of crack are you smoking? We've discussed it at length:
search.php?action=showresults&searchid=44323& … rder=descending

I've had it running in XP for some time now. It's just that it's performance has always been inferior to that of Win98. Since I had Win98, there was no point in me hacking it up to get it running in XP.

Sure, you may be right or wrong about all this, I could care less since I don't understand a word of what you said...

But this post of yours explain very well what I meant with all this...
A bunch of technicalities that no one NOT familiar with DOS will understand.

What really matters is that I just finish the original Blood in XP, WITHOUT a single crash and I'm playing the third episode of Duke3D WITHOUT any problem of any kind.

Now if his tutorial works and nothing else did, I'm the one who's smoking here?

Col.J.P. wrote:

Sure, you may be right or wrong about all this, I could care less since I don't understand a word of what you said...

Unfortunately, I'm afraid they key words here are that you "couldn't care less". Your not even considering what I'm saying.

But this post of yours explain very well what I meant with all this...
A bunch of technicalities that no one NOT familiar with DOS will understand.

So any explanation given must be spelled out point-by-point without explaining why NOLFB is being used, or why they MUST install the games in C:\GAMES, etc...?

What really matters is that I just finish the original Blood in XP, WITHOUT a single crash and I'm playing the third episode of Duke3D WITHOUT any problem of any kind.

IOW, if it works you, you don't care if it doesn't work for others. If you had paid any attention to what I said you would have seen the potential problems for other people.

If these people know nothing about DOS (your primary reason for recommending his site), just imagine the confusion and frustration they will experience when the game locks up or drops to the desktop without explanation, or when they get runtime errors trying to start "Cryptic Passages".

Now if his tutorial works and nothing else did, I'm the one who's smoking here?

Who knows? maybe there's something unique about your hardware configuration, maybe you missed a step of instructions previously...

I haven't gotten crashes from casual CLi2Nop use, but others have. Some have experienced much better audio after using Cli2Nop, I have NOT. As a test, I followed his guide. It was mostly Deja Vu, except for some premade shortcuts that he made (which he why he insists on specific directories). As expected, audio was still terrible. Even if I dropped to the most basic SoundBlaster settings, it still has a constant stutter reminiscent of using XP's SoundBlaster emulation.

You made the claim that when you asked about running Blood in XP:

wasn't able to make Blood run in XP, even though I asked too many ppl...

No one answered!

I went back and double-checked on this, the closest thing I found was that nobody responded to your last post on this thread thread discussing running BLOOD through GliDOS. Even then you were already part of the discussion for the first four pages of this thread.

The great difficulty I had getting it run within GliDOS is why I recommended to Paul that he not place it on his GliDOS games list. It's difficult enough "as is" to get it running on 2000/XP. The one time you asked about running it in XP here, we recommended you do a Quick Search.You responded with

Sorry, I´m pretty sure I cannot do it...
Spent weeks trying to figure it out, no luck...
Not in Windows XP, compatibility mode or not, they do not work!

When Stiletto said how to use it, you responded with

I did it before, I found a lot of stuff that does´nt work... Like the Ken´s NOLFB VESA fix... DOS Games just don´t work with me. […]
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I did it before, I found a lot of stuff that does´nt work...
Like the Ken´s NOLFB VESA fix...
DOS Games just don´t work with me...

Forget it

Honestly? It sounds like you gave up without really trying. Look at his guide and our own. The two major differences:

1) He has pre-made VLP files for configuration. That's why he requires the games be located in C:\GAMES
2) He recommends CLI2NOP for XP, whereas we don't.

Even accounting for those differences, BLOOD should've worked for you either way.

Lets stop this thing, its pointless...

I'm sorry if I hurt someone with my topic, it was not my intention.
I just got quite happy to finally play Blood and Duke3D after 3 years trying without success.

Do you know that I was never able to play neither one of these before?

Yes, its the first time I played Blood (was only able to play the first map and very badly) and Duke 3D too!

"Unfortunately, I'm afraid they key words here are that you "couldn't care less". Your not even considering what I'm saying"

Sorry but, I'm not a native english, so sometimes its quite hard not to make simple mistakes like this one...
And how can I consider what you're saying if I don't understand it?

"So any explanation given must be spelled out point-by-point without explaining why NOLFB is being used, or why they MUST install the games in C:\GAMES, etc...?"

Yes, since I don't understand it, I want to use it right, not understand what it does ( I have no idea what is the diference between DOS drivers and Windows drivers) I am a gamer and a news poster, I'm not a programmer or an engineer!

To finish, I have no idea why it works so well with me in this system:

PIII 1Ghz
Geforce 3 Ti 500
512SDRAM
Intel815 mobo
SB Audigy
WinXP Home Edition

But it does, and I was able to finish Blood for the first time, and I'm in the last episode of Duke3D and having a blast:D

Now if Matt's tutorial works this good with me, why not tell about it to other ppl?
I was NOT provoking you or anyone in this forum...

Originally posted by Col.J.P. Lets stop this thing, its pointless...

Ok.

I'm sorry if I hurt someone with my topic, it was not my intention.

Understood.

I just got quite happy to finally play Blood and Duke3D after 3 years trying without success.

Col, I'm glad for you, really. It's just that I'm trying to make some sense of all this. We've seen people come up with guides before that were actually horribly flawed and tended to cause even more frustration. Matt seems to have his "head on straight". I've emailed him for clarification on some the issues that I brought up.

Hopefully, you'll see changes in both guides in the near future.

Do you know that I was never able to play neither one of these before?

Yes, I pulled up your old posts. Just understand, I made one reference to making a quick search on the subject. The next thing I knew, you had given up.

"Unfortunately, I'm afraid they key words here are that you "couldn't care less". Sorry but, I'm not a native English, so somet […]
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"Unfortunately, I'm afraid they key words here are that you "couldn't care less".

Sorry but, I'm not a native English, so sometimes its quite hard not to make simple mistakes like this one...
And how can I consider what you're saying if I don't understand it?

Ok, Col. Just so you know "I couldn't care less" is almost always used as a form of dislike or disrespect for what someone else is saying. I'm guessing this was just a language translation problem.

I have to admit, I find it bewildering that you were not understanding me. We had spoken with each other numerous times and I sensed no confusion from you before.

If all else fails, try the language translator at Google. It's not always accurate, but it might help.

Yes, since I don't understand it, I want to use it right, not understand what it does ( I have no idea what is the difference between DOS drivers and Windows drivers) I am a gamer and a news poster, I'm not a programmer or an engineer!

Col, I sympathize; but honestly if you don't learn at least some DOS basics, you will run into problems almost every time you try to run a DOS program in XP. By knowing what each step is doing, it helps when something goes wrong.

PIII 1Ghz Geforce 3 Ti 500 512SDRAM Intel815 mobo SB Audigy WinXP Home Edition […]
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PIII 1Ghz
Geforce 3 Ti 500
512SDRAM
Intel815 mobo
SB Audigy
WinXP Home Edition

Quite a capable system. BLOOD should have run for you long ago...

But it does, and I was able to finish Blood for the first time, and I'm in the last episode of Duke3D and having a blast

Well then you'll love JonoF's Duke3D port for Windows at:
http://jonof.edgenetwk.com/buildport/duke3d/

It runs natively in Windows and loads in custom maps easily. Only downside I can think of is that it needs v1.5 of Duke3D.

Now if Matt's tutorial works this good with me, why not tell about it to other ppl?

It's just that when you first posted, it sounded like a dramatic breakthrough. It turned out to be the same information that's been available here.

I was really enthusiastic about NOLFB when it came out, declaring it to be the fix for all our VESA problems in XP. I had to eat those words because it turned out to be a great tool, but NOT the universal fix that I thought it was. When you declare something to be "fixed" or that it "runs great", or "runs flawlessly", you had better be 100% correct or you will upset a lot of people when they find out that it doesn't work for them.

I was NOT provoking you or anyone in this forum...

Agreed. Just a communication problem.

Now this is begining to upset me deeply, I'm truly sorry if I gave you the impression I was confronting you, it was all a big misunderstanding.

🙁

"Ok, Col. Just so you know "I couldn't care less" is almost always used as a form of dislike or disrespect for what someone else is saying. I'm guessing this was just a language translation problem."

This is obvious a cultural diference, since I had no idea of the meaning of the sentence to you.
I apologise, it was my fault, I should have known better than this...

"I have to admit, I find it bewildering that you were not understanding me. We had spoken with each other numerous times and I sensed no confusion from you before."

Yes, of course, let me try to clarify this particular subject. When you say to help run game X I need to run aplication Y in DOS, it simply doesn't say a thing to me...cause I can't do it 🙁
Try to put yourself in my place, I don't even know how to open a DOS window in XP and of course runing applications, even batch files in DOS is out of the question...
So, your guide that says to use a lot of DOS stuff was useless to me, since I didn't knew how to do it.
I got into a lot of trouble runing Glidos for the first time because of this particular issue (the sound emulator, I think)
Then Matt made his tutorial, eliminating all the need to write a single DOS comand, the only one he asks for is to patch the exe files, but he gives step by step instructions...

See what I mean? When I say I don't understand your guide?

"Col, I sympathize; but honestly if you don't learn at least some DOS basics, you will run into problems almost every time you try to run a DOS program in XP. By knowing what each step is doing, it helps when something goes wrong."

Yes, of course, I thought about it several times, if I could find someone who could teach me, you see, when I bought my first computer, Windows 98SE was already out...
So I started around 1999/2000 in this line of work.
I'm a 43 years old clinical psychologist without much time for all this, but I manage to do it.
I learn to deal with win98 by myself and got into the gaming world, but I played all the old DOS classics always through source ports, Doomsday was already out, so I played all Doom series in jDoom, and the Serpent Riders series in jHexen and jHeretic.
Quake in GLQuake and TomazQuake and so on...

No contact with DOS needed until I tried to run the Build Engine...
And you already know the rest...

I dunno what else to say...🙁

Originally posted by Col.J.P. Now this is begining to upset me deeply, I'm truly sorry if I gave you the impression I was confronting you,

Ok, everything is Ok. I was actually going to give another example of such a phrase to clarify my reaction, but I've realized that might cause even more grief.

...it was my fault, I should have known better than this...

Actually, I think you were just "caught up" in joy at being able to run older titles again... It happens to most all of us at one point or another...

I'm a 43 years old clinical psychologist without much time for all this, but I manage to do it.

*blink*
*blink*
You are kidding me. *heh* What are the odds? I guess I should've gotten use to this. Have a friend who was originally from India and only recently found that he used to be a mainframe operator/programmer. I never guessed because he was part of the "monitoring group" when I met him. Monitoring requires little skill, but a lot of patience. Apparently there was a fight between him and his former boss and he paid a heavy price for it.

I learn to deal with win98 by myself and got into the gaming world, but I played all the old DOS classics always through source […]
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I learn to deal with win98 by myself and got into the gaming world, but I played all the old DOS classics always through source ports, Doomsday was already out, so I played all Doom series in jDoom, and the Serpent Riders series in jHexen and jHeretic.
Quake in GLQuake and TomazQuake and so on...

No contact with DOS needed until I tried to run the Build Engine...

*heh* Col, you underestimate yourself. If you can understand things like source ports and custom configurations in GliDOS, you will find basic DOS operation easy. The primary thing to understand is the control method: typing instead of pointing-and-clicking.

I had the same kind of reaction when I went from a Commodore64 to an Amiga. The graphic interface actually confused me because I was already comfortable with using a command line to control the computer.

I've been pondering the creation of a DOS guide for 2000/XP users, but I never seem to have the time. I might be able to find one already available and provide the link here. It will probably be in English, but you can always use Google to translate most of the page to make it easier to read.

Originally posted by Col.J.P.
I'm a 43 years old clinical psychologist without much time for all this, but I manage to do it.

Hm, should a clinical psychologist be playing violent video games? Haven't you read the research on this stuff, man? 😁

OR - are you DOING research when playing the games? 😮

originally posted by Nicht Sehr Gut *blink* *blink* You are kidding me. *heh* What are the odds? I guess I should've gotten use […]
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originally posted by Nicht Sehr Gut
*blink*
*blink*
You are kidding me. *heh* What are the odds? I guess I should've gotten use to this. Have a friend who was originally from India and only recently found that he used to be a mainframe operator/programmer.

You mean your friend - is now a clinical psychologist instead? 😕

*heh* Col, you underestimate yourself. If you can understand things like source ports and custom configurations in GliDOS, you will find basic DOS operation easy. The primary thing to understand is the control method: typing instead of pointing-and-clicking.

It's probably more a lack of wanting to learn. But I agree, Col. could probably handle it without too much trouble, from the posts of his I've read.

Originally posted by Schadenfreude You mean your friend - is now a clinical psychologist instead?

No, I mean that should used to knowing people from far-away places with interesting/unusual jobs by now... I had thought my friend was a lot younger and not really well-educated.

Once met a fellow who had been in the Pakistan Air Force. I presumed he was maintenance guy like myself (the majority of any Air Force will be maintenance, unless you don't care about safety). I was explaining how I worked on IFF Receiver/Transmitters slowly and in a simplistic fashion so he could understand me. Then he started asking me detailed questions about the system, which surprised me. Turned out he was a fighter pilot with plenty of combat experience including getting shot down twice and surviving a helicopter crash! A humbling experience for me.

Like I said, I should be used to this by now...

It's probably more a lack of wanting to learn. But I agree, Col. could probably handle it without too much trouble, from the posts of his I've read.

Anyone able to tangle with GliDOS configs for BLOOD can handle it, certainly.

It's funny to find a conversation about you between people you don't know 6 years after it happened. 😀

JFDuke3D should deliver the feel of untouched duke3d if you choose the software renderer. Blood runs reasonably well under DOSBox at maximum resolution.

mattbovett wrote:

It's funny to find a conversation about you between people you don't know 6 years after it happened. 😀

As a public person you should have already got used to it.