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First post, by retro games 100

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Set up: 3dfx Voodoo5 + 1.04.00 driver. I am running Unreal in GLide mode, 800x600 with 4x AA. When I begin Unreal, I walk right, over to the other side of the corridor. It takes 1 - 2 seconds to get there. If I turn around, and then look up, and then move the mouse a tiny bit, I can see the upper floor area, but it looks odd. The graphics look weird. Here's a way to explain this weirdness -

if you stand in front of a mirror, and you are also holding a small hand mirror, and this small hand mirror is pointing at the larger mirror, when you look at the reflection of this small hand mirror within the larger mirror, you can see a kind of "infinite recursive image" inside the image of the small hand mirror. I see this same "infinite recursive image" on the upper floor area in Unreal. Anyone else notice this phenomonen playing Unreal in GLide mode, using the same hardware and driver version?

Reply 1 of 18, by Tetrium

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Sorry, but the closest I've come to playing Unreal in Glide is using a Voodoo 2 and a Voodoo 3. Can't remember what drivers I "exactly" used but I never noticed anything like you're describing.
Is your version of Unreal 2.26?
And have you tried changing settings for your V5? Like disabling AA etc to see if it makes any difference?
And, are there any other strange occurrences?

Edit: How about a screenshot? ;D

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Reply 2 of 18, by keropi

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yeah a screenshot would be nice, I have a v5 setup and unreal runs OK

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Reply 3 of 18, by retro games 100

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OK! Please can you tell me what keyboard command I need to enter, to make a screenshot? Thanks. Also, I am using the Unreal Anthology DVD-ROM version. I have tried switching off AA, but that does not fix this problem.

Can you record a video within Unreal? That would be even better than screenshots.

Reply 4 of 18, by batracio

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That bug you found is called HOM or "Hall of Mirrors" effect, and it's usually due to an error in the level design, because the map creator forgot to close the inner space with some entity, or a missing texture over a visible surface, or even a transparent texture that allows the player to see beyond the map limits.

If it's not a design error and it can't be seen with other drivers or 3D cards, then it could be the V5 that fails at rendering some texture, allowing the uncleared framebuffer to show the contents of the previous rendered frame. This can be fixed by forcing a frame buffer clear (can't remember if there's an option for this in Unreal, but in Quake engines you have to set r_clear to 1).

It could also be a too aggressive rendering optimization. I think that Z-culling, Guard-Band clipping and Hidden Surface Removal are the usual suspects for this kind of bug. See if disabling them in 3dfx tools fixes the glitch.

Reply 5 of 18, by retro games 100

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I found the screenshot key, it's F9. I took some pics. I also tried various settings, but they all failed to fix the problem. I tried:

AA = on, off
VIA Chipset = Performance, Compatibility, BIOS defaults
Refresh Optimization = Disabled, Enabled
OpenGL/GLide Vertical Sync = Disabled, Enabled

Notes: I am using a VIA KT133A mobo. I also flashed this V5 AGP card's BIOS from version 1.06 to 1.18.

If I move the mouse a tiny bit, the graphics go weird.
Shot0005.jpg

If I move the mouse a tiny bit more, the graphics are OK, but then they go weird again, if I move the mouse again.
Shot0001.jpg

Reply 6 of 18, by retro games 100

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batracio, thanks a lot for your detailed explanation. We posted at the same time, so initially I didn't see your reply. I tried:

r_clear 1 at the console, but Unreal reports this as being an "unrecognised command". I tried ticking and unticking these 2 options inside V-Control 1.82 Beta: Glide/OpenGL: OpenGL guardband clipping, and also enable OpenGL z-culling. Unfortunately, I can still see the "HOM" effect when I look upwards, towards the monitor in that beginning level area.

I'm not sure where to disable/enabled the Hidden surface removal option. I can't see this option inside V-Control.

Reply 7 of 18, by DonutKing

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Wow, that's weird. Can't offer much assistance but you can see the same bug in Doom and Bulld engine games when using the noclip cheat. I've never seen it in anything newer though.
I'd suggest it is a driver issue, perhaps one of the custom drivers from this page might help: http://www.3dfxzone.it/dir/3dfx/voodoo5/drive … oo45/windows9x/

They are win9x drivers but there are drivers for later OS's on that site if you look around.

Reply 8 of 18, by Svenne

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I've noticed a similar problem in a game called 'Blockland'. This happens if you have your draw distance set too low, and you're inside an interior. In this case it's maybe a game design flaw.

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Reply 9 of 18, by retro games 100

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One thing that stops me from using a custom driver is that I have read on Vogons that many people are using the same driver that I am using, that is the "plain vanilla" 1.04.00 reference driver.

Also, to compound this weirdness, the test rig I am using is a refresh W98SE install. I am using VIA's 4-in-1 driver, version 4.43. I know there are one or two fans of VIA on this website. Hehe, the "sarcasm mode" checkbox was "ticked" just then.

Reply 10 of 18, by batracio

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I'm also testing my Voodoo5 these days. Will try to take a look at it.

About the Hidden Surface Removal, I think it appeared later than 1.04 driver.

EDIT: Hidden Surface Removal is called "OpenGL HSR" in V. Control.

Last edited by batracio on 2011-04-19, 15:32. Edited 1 time in total.

Reply 11 of 18, by Tetrium

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Hey GR, did you patch Unreal? It "might" fix the problem. Also, does changing texture detail change anything?
How does it run when not using Glide (No wait!! Don't throw that kettle of hot tar just yet AAHHH!!1 😜).

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Reply 12 of 18, by batracio

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It's a classic HOM effect due to a mapping error. It can also be seen with the software renderer (run Unreal safe mode). I had already noticed the glitch when I played the game, but completely forgot it over the years.

Reply 14 of 18, by Tetrium

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batracio wrote:

It's a classic HOM effect due to a mapping error. It can also be seen with the software renderer (run Unreal safe mode). I had already noticed the glitch when I played the game, but completely forgot it over the years.

And this was never fixed with any consequent patches for Unreal?

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Reply 15 of 18, by retro games 100

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Tetrium wrote:
batracio wrote:

It's a classic HOM effect due to a mapping error. It can also be seen with the software renderer (run Unreal safe mode). I had already noticed the glitch when I played the game, but completely forgot it over the years.

And this was never fixed with any consequent patches for Unreal?

I think Unreal on the Unreal Anthology DVD-ROM version is patched.

Reply 16 of 18, by batracio

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Tetrium wrote:

And this was never fixed with any consequent patches for Unreal?

Apparently no. I have just installed 2.26f patch and the glitch is still there. Note that Epic would have needed to include an updated version of vortex2.unr map in every patch, and it's a 3.63 mb file, not a minor download 13 years ago. They may have thought it wasn't worth the bandwidth waste for such a small glitch.

Reply 17 of 18, by Tetrium

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retro games 100 wrote:
Tetrium wrote:
batracio wrote:

It's a classic HOM effect due to a mapping error. It can also be seen with the software renderer (run Unreal safe mode). I had already noticed the glitch when I played the game, but completely forgot it over the years.

And this was never fixed with any consequent patches for Unreal?

I think Unreal on the Unreal Anthology DVD-ROM version is patched.

Ah, I see. I thought you were using the cdrom version, like I do 😜

Still strange as to what is causing this though.

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Reply 18 of 18, by RogueTrip2012

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Installed this game over the weekend. Today I see your post so thought I'd give it a shoot.

I get the same deal, the image goes into a repeating loop that will move with the mouse movement for a short time. Also have more missing textures as I go on.

CD-ROM of original Unreal (no Return to Napali edition) patched to unofficial 2.27g.
Voodoo 5 5500 Bios 1.06. Last Evolution driver for windows 98SE.
Render mode (unknown, advanced options keeps crashing all the sudden)
Resolution:1024x768 no/AA
Latest drivers available for system.

Specs:
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2x 256MB Crucial CL2 PC133MHz SDRAM
Voodoo 5 5500 AGP Bios 1.06
Western Digital 160GB HDD @ATA-100
Corsair CX430 Watt PSU
Sony FDD
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