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First post, by VirtuaIceMan

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I've posted on here a few times about games which seem to crash for me, but they work for other people running Win8.1 64bit or Win7 64bit with different lesser Geforce cards (for example). I tried some of the games on my work PC (running Win7 64bit with ATI Radeon HD 4600 and they worked fine!).

Very rarely the games work for a brief while, then crash back to the desktop. The Event Viewer usually says they've crashed ntdll.dll (most often) or DINPUT.dll (or, rarer, KERNELBASE.dll), all of these dlls being in the SYSTEM32 folder.

I decided that as so many games are affected I'd heavily debug this, to see if I could find a cause (and therefore fix them all in one go!). I'll run through the hilariously long list of things I've tried in a moment, but first of all, here's a list of (some) of the games affected (I believe these are all affected by the same issue, but one or two might have a different issue). I've linked each to the original thread I posted about the games, if I posted a thread on here.

Note: NFS Hot Pursuit 2 is my main game I test; a few times I got into the intro video then the main menu, but the game froze some time after (when loading a race, for example), but usually it crashes just after resizing the screen, before the intro video plays. I also tried the NFSHP2 demo and tried a no-CD exe for the game. Supercar Street Challenge also behaves the same (though I get to see the opening videos and loading bar before it crashes back to desktop...

NOTE: demos are available on page 3 of this thread...

Breakneck (NICE2) - fixed, see page 5
Carmageddon TDR2000 - fixed, see page 5
Extreme Sprint 3010 - crashes randomly; not down to the issue that caused other crashes
F1 2000 & F1 Championship Season 2000 - fixed, using dgVoodoo 2.45 with latest WIP version (run fullscreen)
F1 Racing Championship & Racing Simulation 3 - fixed
F1 World Grand Prix & WARM UP! - fixed, see page 5
Grand Touring - fixed, needed Win95 mode applying!
Mercedes-Benz Truck Racing - fixed, see page 5, I had to rename the .exe to get audio in-game too, due to some sort of compatibility setting Windows imposed
Rally Masters - fixed, see page 5
Need For Speed Porsche 2000 - fixed, see page 5
Need For Speed Hot Pursuit 2 - fixed, see page 5
Sega Rally 2 - fixed, see page 5, though it's quite crash happy (especially with _inmm.dll applied for music playback)
South Park Rally - fixed, see page 5
Superbike 2001 - more issues with this one
Supercar Street Challenge - fixed, see page 5

So what have I tried to get these to work? Deep breath... after each change the crashes still happened...

  • 1. Tried installing older DirectX versions - but DirectX tells me that I have newer installed.
    2. Tried reducing sound quality down to CD quality (as I heard needs to b 48khz or lower to stop some crashes).
    3. Tried disabling sound cards (both onboard integrated and Soundblaster ZXr) = proves it's not sound hardware related.
    4. Tried disabling GTX 980, unplugged its cables and ran from Intel 4600 HD integrated graphics = proves it's not graphics card/Geforce driver related.
    5. Tried a Clean Boot = proves it's not something running in the background related.
    6. Tried limiting number of processors to 1 and maximum memory to 4GB in msconfig/Boot/Advanced options = proves it's not CPU/high memory related.
    7. Tried removing one 8GB RAM stick and tried each of my two RAM sticks independently = proves it's not RAM related.
    8. Tried a fresh install of Win8.1 64bit on a spare hard drive, with nothing except latest Geforce drivers = proves it's not something I've installed related.
    9. Tried a fresh install of Win7 64bit on a spare hard drive, with nothing added except latest Geforce drivers = proves it's not Win8.1 related.

So I'm pretty much out of ideas now!

Could it be some part of my motherboard causing the crash? Or the processor? Or something in the UEFI BIOS? When I was fiddling I tried letting it auto-setup the BIOS for a gain in speed, but it kept making the PC restart several times on boot up, which confused my graphics card into showing nothing, so I had to reset the BIOS using the jumpers on the motherboard, so you can assume the BIOS is probably pretty much default settings now.

My final fix for this would be to run a VMWare Player virtual WinXP machine, but that feels like cheating, when other people get many of these games running fine on Win8.1 64bit.

If anyone wants me to post anything from Event Viewer, or run any more tests, or run any other programs to check anything, just ask. Over to you guys for ideas...!

Last edited by VirtuaIceMan on 2015-12-13, 01:40. Edited 17 times in total.

My PC spec: Win10 64bit, i7-4970K (not overclocked), KFA2 GeForce RTX 2070 SUPER, Creative Soundblaster ZXr, 16GB RAM, Asus Z97-A motherboard, NZXT 410 case, ROG Swift GSYNC monitor

Reply 1 of 96, by tincup

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Can't give a detailed report but no luck here with Superbike 2001 on W7-64bit [freezes at the main menu loading screen] which I just tested, and Racing Simulation 3. But I also have them parked on the trusty old XP 'bridge retro' box so that at the first sign of trouble I can bail to a less modern modern rig... sorry I can't offer much help other than to confirm the issue...

Reply 2 of 96, by SpeedySPCFan

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Some general ideas:

Try both dgVoodoo's D3D components and WineD3D 1.1.14 (http://nongnu.askapache.com/wined3d/1.1.14/wined3d.exe MAKE SURE YOU DO NOT INSTALL IT, JUST EXTRACT THE DLL FILES FROM THE INSTALLER USING 7ZIP).

DXWnd may also work too, but I'm not familiar with getting it to work. I've heard about a lot of success with it though.

Musician & music gear/game reviewer.

MIDI hardware: JD-990, SC-55, SC-880, SD-90, VL70-m, Motif ES, Trinity, TS-10, Proteus 2000, XK-6, E6400U

Reply 6 of 96, by VirtuaIceMan

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I have tried dgVoodoo and that crashed (NFS2HP at least), but will try the other options above.

My PC spec: Win10 64bit, i7-4970K (not overclocked), KFA2 GeForce RTX 2070 SUPER, Creative Soundblaster ZXr, 16GB RAM, Asus Z97-A motherboard, NZXT 410 case, ROG Swift GSYNC monitor

Reply 7 of 96, by VirtuaIceMan

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Can anyone else with a Win7 64bit or Win8.1 64bit with a set up similar to mine try the NFS Hot Pursuit 2 demo (which crashes the same way for me)? See what happens? http://www.gamershell.com/download_110.shtml

My PC spec: Win10 64bit, i7-4970K (not overclocked), KFA2 GeForce RTX 2070 SUPER, Creative Soundblaster ZXr, 16GB RAM, Asus Z97-A motherboard, NZXT 410 case, ROG Swift GSYNC monitor

Reply 8 of 96, by tincup

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Davros wrote:

Superbike 2001 you need to set your desktop to 16bit colour

One of the old tricks... I'll re-install and give it another shot. SBK-2001 is a fine simulation.

A few other 'tricks' are coming back to me now:

Reduce Direct X acceleration and/or Audio hardware acceleration a notch or two
Turn AA and/or AF off
Reduce CPU affinity to 1 core after initially starting game
Disable SLI or CrossFre

Reply 9 of 96, by VirtuaIceMan

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The ability to reduce acceleration levels in DirectX isn't really there in DirectX11+ 😒

My PC spec: Win10 64bit, i7-4970K (not overclocked), KFA2 GeForce RTX 2070 SUPER, Creative Soundblaster ZXr, 16GB RAM, Asus Z97-A motherboard, NZXT 410 case, ROG Swift GSYNC monitor

Reply 10 of 96, by Jorpho

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VirtuaIceMan wrote:

Could it be some part of my motherboard causing the crash?

Maybe? I once had a faulty PC Chips board (bad caps) that would crash unpredictably, and it could even run memtest for days on end. I even managed to destabilize a system once just by using a bad PSU.

Are you using some kind of joypad, or some kind of fancy mouse or keyboard? (That's what DINPUT.dll crashes bring to mind.)

Reply 11 of 96, by VirtuaIceMan

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I only had USB mouse connected, keyboard is old style connector. Even disconnecting mouse didn't help.

It's odd that NFSHP2 and SSC both sometimes let me into the game menu menus, but very very rarely.

My PC spec: Win10 64bit, i7-4970K (not overclocked), KFA2 GeForce RTX 2070 SUPER, Creative Soundblaster ZXr, 16GB RAM, Asus Z97-A motherboard, NZXT 410 case, ROG Swift GSYNC monitor

Reply 13 of 96, by VirtuaIceMan

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SpeedySPCFan wrote:

Some general ideas:

Try both dgVoodoo's D3D components and WineD3D 1.1.14 (http://nongnu.askapache.com/wined3d/1.1.14/wined3d.exe MAKE SURE YOU DO NOT INSTALL IT, JUST EXTRACT THE DLL FILES FROM THE INSTALLER USING 7ZIP).

DXWnd may also work too, but I'm not familiar with getting it to work. I've heard about a lot of success with it though.

Tried dgVoodoo again, crashes as well. Tried the dlls from WineD3D, the game swaps to low res, but then the blue loading spiral goes on forever.

Not sure DXWnd will help, as I tried it with the Limit System Resources (or whatever the option is called to limit RAM etc) and it too didn't work!

I also tried swapping back to Intel graphics and running solely on my old 1024x768 LCD screen (instead of fancy ROG Swift, in case it's high number of resolutions/refresh rates were causing an issue... again it still crashed!

My PC spec: Win10 64bit, i7-4970K (not overclocked), KFA2 GeForce RTX 2070 SUPER, Creative Soundblaster ZXr, 16GB RAM, Asus Z97-A motherboard, NZXT 410 case, ROG Swift GSYNC monitor

Reply 14 of 96, by VirtuaIceMan

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Using Need For Speed Hot Pursuit 2, here's the errors I see in Event Viewer, in order, when the game crashes:

Error - Application Error - Event ID 1000 - Task Category (100):

Faulting application name: NFSHP2.exe, version: 0.0.0.0, time stamp: 0x3ddd5a2c
Faulting module name: ntdll.dll, version: 6.3.9600.17668, time stamp: 0x54c846bb
Exception code: 0xc0000005
Fault offset: 0x00041a78
Faulting process ID: 0x62c
Faulting application start time: 0x01d065029e6d73f3
Faulting application path: D:\Games\nfs6\NFSHP2.exe
Faulting module path: C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\ntdll.dll
Report ID: e40c85a5-d0f5-11e4-832f-7824af8a9e0a
Faulting package full name:
Faulting package-relative application ID:

Information - Windows Error Reporting - Event ID 1001 - Task Category None:

Fault bucket 73934883335, type 1
Event Name: APPCRASH
Response: Not available
Cab Id: 0

Problem signature:
P1: NFSHP2.exe
P2: 0.0.0.0
P3: 3ddd5a2c
P4: ntdll.dll
P5: 6.3.9600.17668
P6: 54c846bb
P7: c0000005
P8: 00041a78
P9:
P10:

Attached files:
d:\Windows\TEMP\WER7E5F.tmp.WERInternalMetadata.xml

These files may be available here:
C:\Users\VirtuaIceMan\AppData\Local\Microsoft\Windows\WER\ReportArchive\AppCrash_NFSHP2.exe_a797fb54904ab8bb7f24c27609ac41b5f2abf9_a523d4f4_16e18208

Analysis symbol:
Rechecking for solution: 0
Report ID: e40c85a5-d0f5-11e4-832f-7824af8a9e0a
Report Status: 1
Hashed bucket: ec50353d77762f0e8ccb2b68fd4293e4

1/3: Error - no source/Event ID/Task Category:

The description for Event ID 0 from source   cannot be found. Either the component that raises this event is not installed on your local computer or the installation is corrupted. You can install or repair the component on the local computer.

If the event originated on another computer, the display information had to be saved with the event.

The following information was included with the event:

3

2/3: Error - no source/Event ID/Task Category:

The description for Event ID 0 from source   cannot be found. Either the component that raises this event is not installed on your local computer or the installation is corrupted. You can install or repair the component on the local computer.

If the event originated on another computer, the display information had to be saved with the event.

The following information was included with the event:

6

3/3: Error - no source/Event ID/Task Category:

The description for Event ID 0 from source   cannot be found. Either the component that raises this event is not installed on your local computer or the installation is corrupted. You can install or repair the component on the local computer.

If the event originated on another computer, the display information had to be saved with the event.

The following information was included with the event:

7

And that's it!

The full error, which it saved to: C:\Users\VirtuaIceMan\AppData\Local\Microsoft\Windows\WER\ReportArchive\AppCrash_NFSHP2.exe_a797fb54904ab8bb7f24c27609ac41b5f2abf9_a523d4f4_16e18208 looks like this:

Version=1
EventType=APPCRASH
EventTime=130715451249827337
ReportType=2
Consent=1
UploadTime=130715451253538352
ReportIdentifier=e40c85a6-d0f5-11e4-832f-7824af8a9e0a
IntegratorReportIdentifier=e40c85a5-d0f5-11e4-832f-7824af8a9e0a
WOW64=1
NsAppName=NFSHP2.exe
Response.BucketId=ec50353d77762f0e8ccb2b68fd4293e4
Response.BucketTable=1
Response.LegacyBucketId=73934883335
Response.type=4
Sig[0].Name=Application Name
Sig[0].Value=NFSHP2.exe
Sig[1].Name=Application Version
Sig[1].Value=0.0.0.0
Sig[2].Name=Application Timestamp
Sig[2].Value=3ddd5a2c
Sig[3].Name=Fault Module Name
Sig[3].Value=ntdll.dll
Sig[4].Name=Fault Module Version
Sig[4].Value=6.3.9600.17668
Sig[5].Name=Fault Module Timestamp
Sig[5].Value=54c846bb
Sig[6].Name=Exception Code
Sig[6].Value=c0000005
Sig[7].Name=Exception Offset
Sig[7].Value=00041a78
DynamicSig[1].Name=OS Version
DynamicSig[1].Value=6.3.9600.2.0.0.768.101
DynamicSig[2].Name=Locale ID
DynamicSig[2].Value=2057
DynamicSig[22].Name=Additional Information 1
DynamicSig[22].Value=c83b
DynamicSig[23].Name=Additional Information 2
DynamicSig[23].Value=c83bc503990c339334242925e8345ae6
DynamicSig[24].Name=Additional Information 3
DynamicSig[24].Value=fa23
DynamicSig[25].Name=Additional Information 4
DynamicSig[25].Value=fa2342993d3fe86a4e1188c7c5abee98
UI[2]=D:\Games\nfs6\NFSHP2.exe
UI[3]=NFSHP2.exe has stopped working
UI[4]=Windows can check online for a solution to the problem.
UI[5]=Check online for a solution and close the program
UI[6]=Check online for a solution later and close the program
UI[7]=Close the program
LoadedModule[0]=D:\Games\nfs6\NFSHP2.exe
LoadedModule[1]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\ntdll.dll
LoadedModule[2]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\KERNEL32.DLL
LoadedModule[3]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\KERNELBASE.dll
LoadedModule[4]=C:\Windows\system32\apphelp.dll
LoadedModule[5]=C:\Windows\AppPatch\AcGenral.DLL
LoadedModule[6]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\msvcrt.dll
LoadedModule[7]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\sechost.dll
LoadedModule[8]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\SspiCli.dll
LoadedModule[9]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\SHLWAPI.dll
LoadedModule[10]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\UxTheme.dll
LoadedModule[11]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\USER32.dll
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LoadedModule[12]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\GDI32.dll
LoadedModule[13]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\WINMM.dll
LoadedModule[14]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\samcli.dll
LoadedModule[15]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\ole32.dll
LoadedModule[16]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\OLEAUT32.dll
LoadedModule[17]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\MSACM32.dll
LoadedModule[18]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\VERSION.dll
LoadedModule[19]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\SHELL32.dll
LoadedModule[20]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\USERENV.dll
LoadedModule[21]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\dwmapi.dll
LoadedModule[22]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\urlmon.dll
LoadedModule[23]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\ADVAPI32.dll
LoadedModule[24]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\WINSPOOL.DRV
LoadedModule[25]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\MPR.dll
LoadedModule[26]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\RPCRT4.dll
LoadedModule[27]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\CRYPTBASE.dll
LoadedModule[28]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\combase.dll
LoadedModule[29]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\WINMMBASE.dll
LoadedModule[30]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\profapi.dll
LoadedModule[31]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\iertutil.dll
LoadedModule[32]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\WININET.dll
LoadedModule[33]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\bcryptPrimitives.dll
LoadedModule[34]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\cfgmgr32.dll
LoadedModule[35]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\DEVOBJ.dll
LoadedModule[36]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\SHCORE.DLL
LoadedModule[37]=C:\Windows\system32\IMM32.DLL
LoadedModule[38]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\MSCTF.dll
LoadedModule[39]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\d3d8.dll
LoadedModule[40]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\DINPUT.dll
LoadedModule[41]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\DSOUND.dll
LoadedModule[42]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\WS2_32.dll
LoadedModule[43]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\d3d8thk.dll
LoadedModule[44]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\POWRPROF.dll
LoadedModule[45]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\NSI.dll
LoadedModule[46]=C:\Program Files (x86)\AVG\AVG2015\avghookx.dll
LoadedModule[47]=d:\Windows\TEMP\~ef48e7\~df394b.tmp
LoadedModule[48]=d:\Windows\TEMP\~ef48e7\~dee373.tmp
LoadedModule[49]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\kernel.appcore.dll
LoadedModule[50]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\ntmarta.dll
LoadedModule[51]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\PSAPI.DLL
LoadedModule[52]=C:\Windows\system32\nvspcap.dll
LoadedModule[53]=C:\Program Files (x86)\NVIDIA Corporation\3D Vision\nvSCPAPI.dll
LoadedModule[54]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\SETUPAPI.dll
LoadedModule[55]=C:\Windows\system32\nvapi.dll
LoadedModule[56]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\WINTRUST.dll
LoadedModule[57]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\CRYPT32.dll
LoadedModule[58]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\MSASN1.dll
LoadedModule[59]=C:\Windows\system32\dxgi.dll
LoadedModule[60]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\nvd3dum.dll
LoadedModule[61]=D:\Games\nfs6\Win2kHook.dll
LoadedModule[62]=C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\HID.DLL
State[0].Key=Transport.DoneStage1
State[0].Value=1
FriendlyEventName=Stopped working
ConsentKey=APPCRASH
AppName=NFSHP2.exe
AppPath=D:\Games\nfs6\NFSHP2.exe
NsPartner=windows
NsGroup=windows8
ApplicationIdentity=7DF33899699FB3CC06FD7B0FE645D3FF

My PC spec: Win10 64bit, i7-4970K (not overclocked), KFA2 GeForce RTX 2070 SUPER, Creative Soundblaster ZXr, 16GB RAM, Asus Z97-A motherboard, NZXT 410 case, ROG Swift GSYNC monitor

Reply 15 of 96, by Jorpho

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If not the motherboard, there is probably some horribly obscure thingamajig that has not occurred to you or anyone else that is at fault.

Perhaps you'd like to try HWmonitor and verify that nothing's running hot?

I tried Googling the motherboard and found this review. Perhaps you've accidentally flipped the TPU switch?

Reply 16 of 96, by tincup

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Besides not getting Superbike 2001 & Racing Sim 3 to run I can test these others - but they're out at the storage unit now so I won't be able to get to them for a while:

F1 Racing Championship
Racing Simulation 3
F1 World Grand Prix
Le Mans 24 Hours (2002 edition)

It would interesting if others here could test some of the games in question on their own W7/8 rigs to see if we are dealing with more generalized issues. I'm beginning to suspect that it's just 'retro game creep' and not necessarily an obscure hardware issue. On the other hand the TPU switch Jorpho mentions would be a coup if it were the culprit...

Reply 17 of 96, by VirtuaIceMan

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I've checked those switches and all are set to disabled.

However I'm going to see if I can upgrade the BIOS, so there's a newer version out...

My PC spec: Win10 64bit, i7-4970K (not overclocked), KFA2 GeForce RTX 2070 SUPER, Creative Soundblaster ZXr, 16GB RAM, Asus Z97-A motherboard, NZXT 410 case, ROG Swift GSYNC monitor

Reply 18 of 96, by VirtuaIceMan

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Bah, updated BIOS to latest, and installed the ASUS AI Suite 3, then ensured TPU and EPU were both unticked in there too, and once again, game crashes the same.

I think I'll run memtest next...

My PC spec: Win10 64bit, i7-4970K (not overclocked), KFA2 GeForce RTX 2070 SUPER, Creative Soundblaster ZXr, 16GB RAM, Asus Z97-A motherboard, NZXT 410 case, ROG Swift GSYNC monitor

Reply 19 of 96, by VirtuaIceMan

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And Memtest reported no errors, sigh...

My PC spec: Win10 64bit, i7-4970K (not overclocked), KFA2 GeForce RTX 2070 SUPER, Creative Soundblaster ZXr, 16GB RAM, Asus Z97-A motherboard, NZXT 410 case, ROG Swift GSYNC monitor