VOGONS


Reply 900 of 1049, by sharangad

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Also I think I can eliminate the spurious mem writes which cause rectangular blocks to appear all over the place.
V1000 doesn't seem to have those issues, probably because it's slower.

ICR2 seems to write random stuff to the frame buffer. It appears as a rectangular block with rready, a horizontal line with V2000 and not at all with V1000.

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Reply 901 of 1049, by sharangad

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All OK, full 30 fps. Not with MSAA instead of blur filtering:

https://youtu.be/3o5LeUp8F8Q

Probably can run as fast the hardware can now.

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Reply 902 of 1049, by sharangad

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Almost got the menus up and running. So hopefully tomorrow there'll be something to see.

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Reply 903 of 1049, by RaVeN-05

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Good to know)

I found at vogons there is ssutil an analog of renutil.

And doc that reveals that speedy3d I actually v1. 0
https://web.archive.org/web/20060107115930/ht … 96/96160501.htm

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Reply 904 of 1049, by sharangad

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Actually Speedy3D, rredline 1.0 and rredline 2.0 share the same internal structures. The command buffers are 100% compatible.

So you're absolutely correct.

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Reply 905 of 1049, by RaVeN-05

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detailed explanation on how vQuake works https://groups.google.com/g/comp.sys.ibm.pc.h … fHh_nnE0J?hl=en

useful for indycar2 info Re: Disabling Vsync: Rendition Verite DOS Mode?

also rr.exe and spverite.exe which unpatched Scorched Planet expose some partial source code inside of it.

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Reply 906 of 1049, by sharangad

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RaVeN-05 wrote on 2024-04-04, 17:44:

detailed explanation on how vQuake works https://groups.google.com/g/comp.sys.ibm.pc.h … fHh_nnE0J?hl=en

useful for indycar2 info Re: Disabling Vsync: Rendition Verite DOS Mode?

also rr.exe and spverite.exe which unpatched Scorched Planet expose some partial source code inside of it.

That's very useful. The icr2 stuff is going to be pretty handy tomorrow, once I get the menus up and running I'm going to find out whether the game is playable.

The source to Rr.exe needs looking at as we. It appears to alternate between using vsync and not.

I can easily make vsync app controlled from dos. With Windows also it's doable, but needs a bit of work. With windows I flush the command buffer and swap as soon as the commands given. So it'll have to make a lot of changes.

When I started out I didn't really fully understand how everything worked, which is why it's messy to add vsync for rredline. With speedy3d I can delay the swap to see if the next command is a wait for vsync.

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Reply 907 of 1049, by sharangad

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@Raven-05 are the menus bilinear filtered in ICR2? I don't think they should be.

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Reply 908 of 1049, by sharangad

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Functional(and slow) menus in ICR2:

https://youtu.be/jxfRYr4rod4

Vey very laggy with RReady.

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Reply 909 of 1049, by RaVeN-05

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Can't check now, no electricity, check please my past live streams on youtube

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Reply 910 of 1049, by sharangad

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In your video the menu seems to be filtered. But the images they're using are filtered to some extent. Even without filtering they look a bit filtered.

The end credits do lag a bit in your video in one part.

When I get the races actually going I should be able to tell whether it's the input or just the menus.

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Reply 911 of 1049, by sharangad

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Got the filtering in the menus working. WIll post a video when the game is playable.

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Reply 912 of 1049, by RaVeN-05

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https://www.filfre.net/2023/05/the-next-gener … meets-hardware/

Sarah Walker May 19, 2023 I’ve just had a quick scan over the V1000 microcode for both the generic Speedy3D API and the custom Q […]
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Sarah Walker
May 19, 2023
I’ve just had a quick scan over the V1000 microcode for both the generic Speedy3D API and the custom Quake port. Quake doesn’t touch the pixel engine’s Z buffer related registers other than to turn them off, matching Stefan Podell’s testimony that vQuake doesn’t use any hardware Z buffering. Speedy3D on the other hand does have code to write to the Z buffer registers, suggesting that using hardware Z buffering is supported (if slow) and therefore that it is in fact supported by hardware.

Agree that none of this really changes the narrative!

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That's why at long distances we could see objects on top of walls, while they should be after walls.

Another glitches is walls textures can be distorted if you look on them at very low degree, almost zero, parallel to wall.

And if there is nothing to draw (gray clear color used, we never spot hall of mirrors), clearing mechanism will remove in game own model, the weapons you currently carrying in your hands (r_drawwievmodel).

If you try to be tied to water surface, you will got random pixel noise, or too many copies of that water surface in water surface, like recursively draw to texture, hall effect.

Using zero as value for d_wamp or D_wfreq will give funny blue shades over all screen.

Dying at sky texture will expose connections of two spheres to be distorted, never happens when you alive

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Reply 913 of 1049, by RaVeN-05

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I spot that
vid_nopageflip 1
cvar, both for quake and hexen2 gives more fps on original hardware, and it's not works in RReady, setting to 1 makes black screen, game not hangs, you can blindly set it back to 0, and everything works again.
No sense, just little difference I spot accidentally.

Quake2 same v1k_nopageflip acts like described above.

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Reply 915 of 1049, by sharangad

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RaVeN-05 wrote on 2024-04-05, 23:09:
Sarah Walker May 19, 2023 I’ve just had a quick scan over the V1000 microcode for both the generic Speedy3D API and the custom Q […]
Show full quote

Sarah Walker
May 19, 2023
I’ve just had a quick scan over the V1000 microcode for both the generic Speedy3D API and the custom Quake port. Quake doesn’t touch the pixel engine’s Z buffer related registers other than to turn them off, matching Stefan Podell’s testimony that vQuake doesn’t use any hardware Z buffering. Speedy3D on the other hand does have code to write to the Z buffer registers, suggesting that using hardware Z buffering is supported (if slow) and therefore that it is in fact supported by hardware.

Agree that none of this really changes the narrative!

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I agree with this 100%.

In RRedline the zbuffer is the final buffer in the primary surface/buffer group. So if you're double buffering with z buffer buffer 2 is z. With triple buffering z is 3. Buffers [0,2] are front and back buffers.

But you can create a buffer group without an z buffer. It's just a flag in vl_createsurfsce, V_CreateBufferGroup.

The zbuffer is just an array of 16 bit values representing the depth values of the screen.

Last edited by sharangad on 2024-04-06, 07:27. Edited 2 times in total.

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Reply 916 of 1049, by sharangad

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RaVeN-05 wrote on 2024-04-06, 05:13:

vid_nopageflip 1

@Raven-05 is this for vsync?

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Reply 917 of 1049, by RaVeN-05

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sharangad wrote on 2024-04-06, 07:25:
RaVeN-05 wrote on 2024-04-06, 05:13:

vid_nopageflip 1

@Raven-05 is this for vsync?

vid_nopageflip (T)
Syntax: vid_nopageflip <0/1>

Default: 0

Toggles whether page flipping is disabled.
From techinfo.txt:

If a given VESA mode can support page flipping, then it defaults to page-
flipped operation. A VESA mode can be forced to non-page-flipped operation
by setting the vid_nopageflip console variable to 1, then setting the mode
(note that vid_nopageflip takes operation on the next, not the current, mode
set, and note that it then stays in effect permanently, even when Quake is
exited and restarted, unless it is manually set back to 0.)

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Reply 918 of 1049, by sharangad

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It has no effect on my installation of quake 2 with RReady.

set vid_nopageflip 0
set vid_nopageflip 1

does nothing at a WMR hacked resolution. I'll try the standard res to see if it wroks there.

[EDIT] Nope. The setting has no effect.

[EDIT2] V1k_nopageflip. Aaargh. My bad!

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Reply 919 of 1049, by sharangad

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I see the problem. It doesn't issue a buffer swap but just freezes.

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