DirectX 9 will install on plain non-updated Windows 98 just fine.

Also note there's currently nothing more than a S3 Virge for a host video card that supports Direct3D (DX3-level) and upgrading DirectX won't make the currently-emulated DX3-DX5-class 3d hardware be a DX9-capable card.

leileilol wrote:

DirectX 9 will install on plain non-updated Windows 98 just fine.

Also note there's currently nothing more than a S3 Virge for a host video card that supports Direct3D (DX3-level) and upgrading DirectX won't make the currently-emulated DX3-DX5-class 3d hardware be a DX9-capable card.

Well that’s good!

Ah darn. So there’s no way to use, say, the GeForce 6600 to utilize 3D with DX9 in PCem? Or how does the S3 Virge compare to the GeForce 6600?

The S3 Virge is a first-generation 3d card that's not even capable of proper blending or fog, made from back when 3d acceleration was a very new concept in the consumer PC market. The Geforce6 is built upon years of technology advancements upon many more years of API maturity. They just don't compare.

The best 3d hardware that's emulated in PCem currently (as of v13.1) is the 3dfx Voodoo2, and even that doesn't work with everything mainly because of its design as a strictly secondary video device.

Emulating the Geforce6 would need nVidia to open up their docs and info on their cards to the public (Which are often confidental material and this is unlikely to happen) - or probably decades worth of hobbyist reverse engineering.
The reason why 3dfx emulation's everywhere is that 3dfx opened up nearly around their closure in 2000 (and there was also a time when 3dfx support was a priority in 96-99, so emulating 3dfx, like it or not, is the most logical thing to do for any gaming-centric PC emulator)

leileilol wrote:

The S3 Virge is a first-generation 3d card that's not even capable of proper blending or fog, made from back when 3d acceleratio […]
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The S3 Virge is a first-generation 3d card that's not even capable of proper blending or fog, made from back when 3d acceleration was a very new concept in the consumer PC market. The Geforce6 is built upon years of technology advancements upon many more years of API maturity. They just don't compare.

The best 3d hardware that's emulated in PCem currently (as of v13.1) is the 3dfx Voodoo2, and even that doesn't work with everything mainly because of its design as a strictly secondary video device.

Emulating the Geforce6 would need nVidia to open up their docs and info on their cards to the public (Which are often confidental material and this is unlikely to happen) - or probably decades worth of hobbyist reverse engineering.
The reason why 3dfx emulation's everywhere is that 3dfx opened up nearly around their closure in 2000 (and there was also a time when 3dfx support was a priority in 96-99, so emulating 3dfx, like it or not, is the most logical thing to do for any gaming-centric PC emulator)

Ah, gotcha. Thank you very very much for explaining the history of this to me. Yeah, that makes complete sense. They would never do that. It’s pretty great and amazing 3dfx chose to open up upon their closure. For Voodoo2 you just install a driver right? So if you tried using a BIOS ROM of a newer GPU like GeForce 5/6 series PCem just wouldn’t allow it to boot?

You seem extremely knowledgeable on all of this and have been so much help so maybe you wouldn’t mind telling me if what I’m wanting is possible to achieve in either PCem or VirtualBox? I know that no matter what it might not run or work well at all but I was just wanting to try at least. I’m wanting to use DgVoodoo (Win 98/DX7/9) to wrap to DX9 to work in SweetFX. It supports Windows 2000 and up (was going to test if the certain games will even get past the first step of working with DgVoodoo since some won’t before creating a Windows 2000 machine). It supports cards that use shader 2. However, obviously still before the S3 Virge. So do you think VirtualBox would pose a possibility?

VirtualBox is a possibility if you're planning to use Windows XP because that's the minimum it supports its 3d acceleration for. It uses WineD3D to translate calls to OpenGL, in which its custom virtualbox video card's video driver will pass to the host's video card also via OpenGL.
It won't do this for Windows 2000 or 98.

However I don't use Reshade/SweetFX and I cannot tell you how usable those may be within VirtualBox or outside of it on the host's virtualbox folder.

leileilol wrote:

VirtualBox is a possibility if you're planning to use Windows XP because that's the minimum it supports its 3d acceleration for. It uses WineD3D to translate calls to OpenGL, in which its custom virtualbox video card's video driver will pass to the host's video card also via OpenGL.
It won't do this for Windows 2000 or 98.

However I don't use Reshade/SweetFX and I cannot tell you how usable those may be within VirtualBox or outside of it on the host's virtualbox folder.

DgVoodoo should work in 98 though as long as DirectX 7 is installed I’m pretty sure. So with PCem there are only certain cards that can be emulated even if the rom is there? Just making sure I’m understanding correctly. (:

Alrighty, thanks so much. SweetFX stated some of the effects will still work with older cards so I’m wondering if maybe some of the effects would work without 3D acceleration or if they all require that. They probably all require that maybe for the app itself to run or something would you think?

I understand. I appreciate you answering my many questions and explaining things to me more than you know! I’m extremely new to past the basics so it takes me hours to try and implement new VM’s and get everything all set up correctly and stuff. So this saves me a lot of time instead of trying it all out myself when it wouldn’t even work. I wish SO badly there was a simpler way to test if a game will run in a certain OS without having to create a machine and install that OS.