VOGONS


First post, by j^aws

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Not sure if this is the right forum ; please move if required.

So, as the heading mentions, what was the last game that supported any version of Aureal, and/ or the most demanding game for it?

I understand its drivers work best with Win98. Considering the above game(s), I'm looking at a cut-off point for an appropriate GPU and corresponding API (Glide, D3D, OpengGL). This is for a future build.

Thanks in advance.

Reply 1 of 21, by archsan

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Cutoff was about 2000 to maybe 2002 (as you know, they went dodo in late 2000, making support for newer games largely irrelevant for developers then). So building a maxed up Win9x rig will take care of all these A3D games too.

As boring as it sounds you'll come to the same oft-repeated late win9x specs again... You know the drill... GeForce 6800/FX 5900 or Quadro counterparts, 7900/7800 tops, or Radeon 9800/9700. Tualatin/P4 or go Core/Conroe/derivative with LGA775/865 combo if you're feeling a bit adventurous. Athlon XP, 64 or AM2 K8 derivative may also be an option if you're okay with VIA / non-Intel chipsets.

"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."—Arthur C. Clarke
"No way. Installing the drivers on these things always gives me a headache."—Guybrush Threepwood (on cutting-edge voodoo technology)

Reply 2 of 21, by j^aws

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Hmm, chipsets I have in mind are:

Intel: i845, i865, i875
Nvidia: Nforce 3
VIA: PT880

I presume Intel should be solid, but what about Nforce?

I also here bad things about VIA chipsets and Aureal, e.g. sound crackling. Any real truths to this? Or just some BIOS/ driver tweaking required?

Regarding GPU, did any Vortex compatible game use DX8-class features? Or was DX7-class the latest?

Reply 3 of 21, by firage

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I think Neverwinter Nights supports A3D, and must be one of few outliers past the year 2001.

My big-red-switch 486

Reply 4 of 21, by j^aws

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^^ Is this an unadvertised feature for Neverwinter Nights? According to Mobygames, only EAX and DS3D are listed, and no mention of A3D. It does state that a minimum of DX8.1 is required, and also uses OpengGL for its API...

Reply 5 of 21, by tincup

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archsan wrote:

Cutoff was about 2000 to maybe 2002 (as you know, they went dodo in late 2000, making support for newer games largely irrelevant for developers then). So building a maxed up Win9x rig will take care of all these A3D games too.

As boring as it sounds you'll come to the same oft-repeated late win9x specs again... You know the drill... GeForce 6800/FX 5900 or Quadro counterparts, 7900/7800 tops, or Radeon 9800/9700. Tualatin/P4 or go Core/Conroe/derivative with LGA775/865 combo if you're feeling a bit adventurous. Athlon XP, 64 or AM2 K8 derivative may also be an option if you're okay with VIA / non-Intel chipsets.

There you go - in a nutshell...

Reply 6 of 21, by SRQ

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That's hardware, not games.
In any case yes NWN has an /insane/ amount of supported sound stuff. The list is absolutely huge, I think it covers everything from EAX 1-4 (maybe just 3) and A3D 1 and 2. As well as software based stuff.

Reply 7 of 21, by ZanQuance

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As far as I know Star Trek: Elite Force was one of the last games to use A3D.
It supports A3D 3.0 with A3DVerb and can make use of the SQ3500's daughterboard to process the effects with the 2050 drivers.

Neverwinter Nights was released in 02, but only supports A3D 2.0.

Reply 8 of 21, by j^aws

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Okay, I've got an idea on what kind of CPU/ GPU I'll need. Thanks a bunch.

BTW, anyone try A3D 3.0 with the daughterboard in Elite Forces? Any impressions? Can't the same be achieved by routing SPDIF output to an external DSP?

Reply 9 of 21, by archsan

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I saw many A3D lists out there that I have not personally confirmed. For example MDK 2 (which is another BioWare game, like the above mentioned Neverwinter Nights) is claimed by some lists to support A3D 3.0, while this says only EAX.

Some of the misinformation may have come from development news/rumors that didn't make it to the final game later on, or the feature was dropped/unsupported in later patches. Or the game needs a certain patch that didn't come with the original release. In any case, it would be great to compile a list with detailed information (such as how to run a game with said A3D/EAX support, and _if possible_ confirmation of what version is supported, or if not possible maybe just how good the support/result is).

ZanQuance wrote:

As far as I know Star Trek: Elite Force was one of the last games to use A3D.
It supports A3D 3.0 with A3DVerb and can make use of the SQ3500's daughterboard to process the effects with the 2050 drivers.

I wonder how rare these DBs are... 😵

"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."—Arthur C. Clarke
"No way. Installing the drivers on these things always gives me a headache."—Guybrush Threepwood (on cutting-edge voodoo technology)

Reply 10 of 21, by leileilol

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Q3A supports A3D but only before v1.25 where it's dropped.

apsosig.png
long live PCem

Reply 11 of 21, by tincup

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SRQ wrote:

That's hardware, not games.
In any case yes NWN has an /insane/ amount of supported sound stuff. The list is absolutely huge, I think it covers everything from EAX 1-4 (maybe just 3) and A3D 1 and 2. As well as software based stuff.

Ah yes you're right - but the hardware recommendations are a nice synopsis given the end aim.

Reply 12 of 21, by lagonauta

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I just tried NWN Diamond from GOG and A3D 2.0 on my Window 98 PC but all 3D sound seems to com from the right... DirectSound3D hardware has the best positioning.
Anyone else has this problem? Maybe NWN is not really A3D compatible...
Also, it does not require DX 8.1 as it works fine on my GeForce 4 MX440 AGP 8x, but I will probably end up playing in my FX5200.

Reply 13 of 21, by j^aws

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^^ Thanks for the update. I've yet to pick up NWN and try it out. Maybe the GOG release modified the sound options and you would need to patch it for proper Aureal support? Or you might need a different sound driver?

Reply 14 of 21, by firage

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lagonauta wrote:

I just tried NWN Diamond from GOG and A3D 2.0 on my Window 98 PC but all 3D sound seems to com from the right... DirectSound3D hardware has the best positioning.
Anyone else has this problem? Maybe NWN is not really A3D compatible...
Also, it does not require DX 8.1 as it works fine on my GeForce 4 MX440 AGP 8x, but I will probably end up playing in my FX5200.

The DX7 featured GeForces would run DX8 stuff, just leaving out new visual effects.

Was the card you tested your Turtle Beach Montego II? Those TB's had some custom designs as I recall, so might be a card or driver specific incompatibility.

My big-red-switch 486

Reply 15 of 21, by swaaye

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Miles Sound System has A3D plugins that might show up in newer games. For example, I have a feeling Painkiller might show you the option if it detects A3D support.

Reply 16 of 21, by lagonauta

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firage wrote:
lagonauta wrote:

I just tried NWN Diamond from GOG and A3D 2.0 on my Window 98 PC but all 3D sound seems to com from the right... DirectSound3D hardware has the best positioning.
Anyone else has this problem? Maybe NWN is not really A3D compatible...
Also, it does not require DX 8.1 as it works fine on my GeForce 4 MX440 AGP 8x, but I will probably end up playing in my FX5200.

The DX7 featured GeForces would run DX8 stuff, just leaving out new visual effects.

Was the card you tested your Turtle Beach Montego II? Those TB's had some custom designs as I recall, so might be a card or driver specific incompatibility.

Yes, it was on my Montego II with driver 2041. I might test it with the drivers from Turtle Beach, but it would be nice if someone with a SQ2500 could test it.

Reply 17 of 21, by Doppler

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Sorry for my ignorance, but do You try to run NWN on Windows 98?

Reply 18 of 21, by j^aws

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^^ Are you asking me or lagonauta? I haven't gotten around to testing yet; my Win98 focused build is quite far away. But lagonauta mantioned above that it was on Win98.

Reply 19 of 21, by Doppler

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lagonauta wrote:

I just tried NWN Diamond from GOG and A3D 2.0 on my Window 98 PC but all 3D sound seems to com from the right... DirectSound3D hardware has the best positioning.
Anyone else has this problem? Maybe NWN is not really A3D compatible...
Also, it does not require DX 8.1 as it works fine on my GeForce 4 MX440 AGP 8x, but I will probably end up playing in my FX5200.

I did a short test and I have the same issue. All sounds come from the right speaker when A3D 2.0 is selected. Used v2050 driver on Windows 98 SE with Directx 8.1. The cards chip is AU8830A2.

BTW tried to use EAX 2.0 wrapper from VortexTuner (http://release.radeon.ru/2048.htm) and no game sees EAX 2.0 support. I'm sure its properly installed and registry path are ok to the eax.dll file. Is there any app where I could test EAX versions? ...anyway, ughhhhhh... EAX on Vortex2 is so awful ;0 omg. Never heard such crap reverbs!

BTW2. I have a question - did anyone here heard EAX reverbs in "Severance: Blade of Darkness" on v2048 or v2050 drivers?