VOGONS


First post, by MMaximus

User metadata
Rank Oldbie
Rank
Oldbie

I'm trying to enable networking under windows 3.11 on my Socket 7 PC, just for kicks 😀. I have Dos 6.22 + Windows 3.11 on a CF card, the network card is a D-Link DFE-530TX that works fine under DOS with mTCP and also under Windows 98 (when I boot from a different hard drive).

I have installed the correct NIC drivers in Windows 3.11, and also the TCP/IP stack (tcp32b.exe).

IFSHLP.SYS is correctly loaded in CONFIG.SYS.

Windows 3.11 loads fine (apart from an error message saying the network is not correctly configured.

To enable networking I understand I'm supposed to execute the "NET START" command under DOS before starting Windows. However when I do this, Windows refuses to load and gives an error message about not enough extended memory being available.

it happens wether I execute the NET START command in conventional memory or upper memory. If I remove all other drivers (CD-Rom, SB-16 etc.) it still happens, despite having freed lots of upper memory.

Any ideas? 😕

Hard Disk Sounds

Reply 1 of 6, by Jo22

User metadata
Rank l33t++
Rank
l33t++
MMaximus wrote:

To enable networking I understand I'm supposed to execute the "NET START" command under DOS before starting Windows.
However when I do this, Windows refuses to load and gives an error message about not enough extended memory being available:

Yes, NET START seems right. If it really is a memory issue, try another version of Himem.sys. Maybe the version from DOS 7 or DR/Novell DOS.

You can also try to reserve some memory for the old Extended Memory interface (pre XMS).
There`s an "INT15=" switch that can be used to reserve some memory for that (can't remember exact syntax now).
It was used by some games from Sierra On-Line that had VGA graphis or came on CD-ROM, too.

Good luck! 😀

"Time, it seems, doesn't flow. For some it's fast, for some it's slow.
In what to one race is no time at all, another race can rise and fall..." - The Minstrel

//My video channel//

Reply 2 of 6, by MMaximus

User metadata
Rank Oldbie
Rank
Oldbie
Jo22 wrote:
Yes, NET START seems right. If it really is a memory issue, try another version of Himem.sys. Maybe the version from DOS 7 or DR […]
Show full quote

Yes, NET START seems right. If it really is a memory issue, try another version of Himem.sys. Maybe the version from DOS 7 or DR/Novell DOS.

You can also try to reserve some memory for the old Extended Memory interface (pre XMS).
There`s an "INT15=" switch that can be used to reserve some memory for that (can't remember exact syntax now).
It was used by some games from Sierra On-Line that had VGA graphis or came on CD-ROM, too.

Good luck! 😀

Thanks - I found some info online about the INT15 switch and added the parameter after HIMEM.SYS with a value of 1024 but it's not having any effect. I've tried loading the minimum lines in CONFIG.SYS and skipping AUTOEXEC.BAT altogether but there's no way to load windows if the NET START command is executed beforehand. I guess I'll put this on hold for now... 😵

Hard Disk Sounds

Reply 3 of 6, by Jo22

User metadata
Rank l33t++
Rank
l33t++

Oh, okay. Sorry that it didn't work.

Changing the v86 memory manager may help.
I recall using EMM386 and MemMaker in a VM, though.

Also got WfW 3.11 on a 386DX40 to work once with these.
I used an Etherlink III card and the default drivers that come with 3.11.
As fars a I remember, the Win 3.11 network setup also auto-installed the NET START commands.

Edit: I've found an older VM of WfW 3.11 on my backup HDD..
Here's the autoexec.bat and config.sys, respectively. 😀
After MemMaker did his work. Perhaps there's something useful within.
(If it was me, I would have left BUFFERS=30 and FILES=20..)

@ECHO OFF
PROMPT $p$g
PATH=C:\MSIE50;C:\;C:\WINDOWS;C:\DOS;
SET TEMP=C:\TEMP
REM MODE CON CODEPAGE PREPARE=((437) C:\DOS\EGA.CPI)
REM MODE CON CODEPAGE SELECT=437

SET SOUND=C:\SB16
SET BLASTER=A220 I5 D1 H5 P330 T6
REM SET MIDI=SYNTH:1 MAP:E
REM C:\SB16\DIAGNOSE /S
REM C:\SB16\MIXERSET /P /Q

set ieppp=C:\MSIE50
set pctcp=C:\MSIE50\pctcp.shv
LH /L:0;3,80688;1,400 /S C:\WINDOWS\net start

REM C:\DOS\KEYB GR,,C:\DOS\KEYBOARD.SYS
LH /L:1,912 C:\DOS\KEYB2

SET DOSVMADD13=INSTALLED
LH c:\vmadd\fshare.exe
LH c:\DOS\MSCDEX.EXE /D:MSCD001
c:\vmadd\idle.com
REM c:\vmadd\mouse.com

CD WINDOWS
WIN

----

DEVICE=C:\VMADD\VMADD386.SYS
DEVICE=C:\DOS\HIMEM.SYS
DEVICE=C:\DOS\EMM386.EXE NOEMS I=B000-B7FF WIN=B300-B7FF
BUFFERS=30,0
FILES=8
DOS=UMB
LASTDRIVE=F
FCBS=4,0
DEVICE=C:\VMADD\CDROM.SYS /D:MSCD001
DEVICE=C:\WINDOWS\MOUSE.SYS

DOS=HIGH
STACKS=18,512
COUNTRY=049,437,C:\DOS\COUNTRY.SYS

DEVICEHIGH /L:1,4560 =C:\WINDOWS\IFSHLP.SYS

"Time, it seems, doesn't flow. For some it's fast, for some it's slow.
In what to one race is no time at all, another race can rise and fall..." - The Minstrel

//My video channel//

Reply 4 of 6, by OMORES

User metadata
Rank Member
Rank
Member

EMM386 might the first problem, my Intel NDIS DOS drivers do not work along EMM386.

Microsoft TCP/IP 32b package might be another problem. TCP/IP from Microsoft worked perfectly on a i7/3770 HP workstation - but not a Pentium 4 machine - using the same network card/drivers. On another config, Windows couldn't load after installing MS TCP/IP even if there was no network activity. (no drivers installed)

Plan B is to use Trumpet Winsock TCP/IP. Trumpet... is not as plug and play as Microsoft TCP/IP. You have to deal with packet drivers, vectors, no DHCP, but once you're done... it performs pretty consistent.

Attachments

  • win311_net.png
    Filename
    win311_net.png
    File size
    53.18 KiB
    Views
    1134 views
    File license
    Public domain
  • trumpet_winsock.png
    Filename
    trumpet_winsock.png
    File size
    28.52 KiB
    Views
    1134 views
    File license
    Public domain

Reply 5 of 6, by Jo22

User metadata
Rank l33t++
Rank
l33t++

Thank you for this tip and sharing your experience ! 😀👍

Indeed, some of the 32-Bit Windows extensions from that time frame seem to have their issues with modern setups.

I assume, that's because they were coded for 386/486 era environments that differed from those of the 2000s (pre-ATX, no APIC, no USB, etc).

Generally speaking, some unofficial/undocumented instructions may have changed a bit in behavior, the timings, too.
Some of the loops may execute too fast on Pentium IV or recent systems, too.

Win32s is also a bit unstable on modern systems.
Years ago, I had to enable AMD-V in Virtual PC 200x, in order to get it working.

Best regards, Jo22

"Time, it seems, doesn't flow. For some it's fast, for some it's slow.
In what to one race is no time at all, another race can rise and fall..." - The Minstrel

//My video channel//

Reply 6 of 6, by asdf53

User metadata
Rank Member
Rank
Member

I had the same problem with DOS and Microsoft Network Client 3.0 (using TCP/IP). I got the following error on running 'net start':

"Error 8: There is not enough memory available"

Even after all the other network components have been loaded, "net start" needs a ton of free conventional memory to launch, around 440 KB. Type "mem /c | more" before running "net start" to see how much free memory you have and which drivers are using the most.

To free up some memory, add the following lines to config.sys:

device=c:\dos\himem.sys
dos=high

This will load DOS into high memory and free up around 60 KB. In most cases, this is enough. If you need more memory, add to config.sys:

device=c:\dos\emm386.exe noems

and use 'LH' to load some of the network client components in autoexec.bat, example:

LH C:\net\tcptsr.exe

Not all components can be loaded high, tinyrfc.exe will not work if I remember correctly.

DriveSpace

One particular memory hog is DBLSPACE (DriveSpace/DoubleSpace) which uses around 100 KB of memory. One annoying thing is that if you have DriveSpace installed on C: and "C:\drvspace.ini" exists, DOS will automatically load it at boot. This even happens when you boot from a floppy - it will look for DriveSpace on C: and load it from there, even if you delete drvspace.bin from the floppy. To disable it, rename "C:\drvspace.ini" to "C:\drvspace.bak" or add "DrvSpace=0" and "DblSpace=0" to [Options] in msdos.sys (the one on A:\ or C:\, depending on your boot method).

If you need DriveSpace, you can at least load it to upper memory in config.sys:

devicehigh=C:\dos\drvspace.sys /move

Note: drvspace.bin is the actual driver, it gets loaded before config.sys. Drvspace.sys is an optional helper driver that moves it into upper memory.