VOGONS


First post, by iVirtualZero

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Thinking about recapping my old motherboard with Polymer capacitors. Say for example it has a electrolytic 1000uf 50v cap. Can the Polymer cap also be 1000uf 50v?

I’m not much of expert on capacitors but i hear polymer caps from a reputable brand are just better all around caps since they last longer, do not leak, nor dry up. And would love to replace the electrolytic caps on my Motherboard, Soundcard and gpu’s with polymer ones, mostly through holes.

Reply 1 of 11, by chregu

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You won't find any polymer 1000uf 50V caps. Did you mean 1uf?
It should work fine if they get replaced with the same capacitance and at least the same voltage rating.

Reply 2 of 11, by luckybob

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its not worth the cost.

Replace the caps on your motherboard with the physical size, uF and voltage.

It is a mistake to think you can solve any major problems just with potatoes.

Reply 3 of 11, by iVirtualZero

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luckybob wrote on 2021-03-22, 15:38:

its not worth the cost.

Replace the caps on your motherboard with the physical size, uF and voltage.

Shall i just go with electrolytics with some polymers? Or go all electrolytic?

Reply 4 of 11, by TheMobRules

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Just use replacements of the same type, no point in going with polymers unless you have specific needs (extremely low ESR on mid-00's boards for example). Even if you use electrolytics at this point they will probably outlive other hardware components, just think about how long the caps you want to replace have lasted so far. And their properties will be much closer to what the original design intended.

Also, ask yourself is there any reason for replacing the caps: do they have visible leaks/bulges, are they from series/brands known to fail early and most importantly... is your hardware exhibiting symptoms of cap failure?

If the answer to all of those is NO, I wouldn't even touch the caps, it seems many people go overboard with the "future-proofing" nowadays. The only case where it makes sense doing that is on older power supplies (clean power is always a good thing) and components that use caps almost guaranteed to leak in the short term (SMD caps from the early 90's, plague-era stuff, and so on). Otherwise, if it's working fine I'd just leave it be.

Reply 5 of 11, by iVirtualZero

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TheMobRules wrote on 2021-03-22, 16:40:

Just use replacements of the same type, no point in going with polymers unless you have specific needs (extremely low ESR on mid-00's boards for example). Even if you use electrolytics at this point they will probably outlive other hardware components, just think about how long the caps you want to replace have lasted so far. And their properties will be much closer to what the original design intended.

Also, ask yourself is there any reason for replacing the caps: do they have visible leaks/bulges, are they from series/brands known to fail early and most importantly... is your hardware exhibiting symptoms of cap failure?

If the answer to all of those is NO, I wouldn't even touch the caps, it seems many people go overboard with the "future-proofing" nowadays. The only case where it makes sense doing that is on older power supplies (clean power is always a good thing) and components that use caps almost guaranteed to leak in the short term (SMD caps from the early 90's, plague-era stuff, and so on). Otherwise, if it's working fine I'd just leave it be.

It’s from the plague era and some caps are bulging. Guess polymer caps are just going to make things more complicated.

Reply 6 of 11, by SpectriaForce

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iVirtualZero wrote on 2021-03-22, 12:00:

Thinking about recapping my old motherboard with Polymer capacitors. Say for example it has a electrolytic 1000uf 50v cap. Can the Polymer cap also be 1000uf 50v?

I’m not much of expert on capacitors but i hear polymer caps from a reputable brand are just better all around caps since they last longer, do not leak, nor dry up. And would love to replace the electrolytic caps on my Motherboard, Soundcard and gpu’s with polymer ones, mostly through holes.

A general rule of thumb I use: capacitor needs to have same or slightly lower ESR, at least same voltage rating (but not too high), capacitance may be higher (but not too high) and it needs to have (almost) the same dimensions. If you first select on these characteristics, then usually the ripple current is also right. You can find datasheets of most A and B grade capacitor series (e.g. from brands like Nichicon, Chemi-Con, OST, Teapo) online. I would always try to find a capacitor which is as close as possible to the original characteristics.

More recent motherboards (from the late nineties) often have very low ESR electrolytic capacitors around the CPU socket. Often you can't find electrolytic replacements for those anymore, so you'll have to replace them with polymer ones.

Another rule of thumb: if you're looking at an AOpen, Asus, Intel, Supermicro or Tyan motherboard, then it's less likely that it needs replacement of capacitors, unless it's one from the plague era (2000-2006). My experience is that those brands have in general equipped their hardware with better capacitors.

Last edited by SpectriaForce on 2021-03-23, 19:10. Edited 2 times in total.

Reply 7 of 11, by B24Fox

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My 2 cents (very close to what SpectriaForce said) :

For Sound Cards - Polymer caps might sound a lot worse, and are usually not recommended for sound. Electrolytics are usually the way to go. And a good all-around cap is the "Panasonic FC- series".

For motherboards and anything else, you have to be very mindful of the specific task each cap is doing.
For high performance stuff like around the CPU, you need to have top-of-the-line caps with low ESR, for example.. You can't go replacing all caps with just one model for everything, unless you have a lot of money to spend on THE BEST model.. (and that can also backfire in some situations, where high ESR is actually part of the design)
So if you want to do this smart, there's kind of a lot of work involved in getting to know WHAT caps are on that board in order to find a proper polymer replacement.

My advice is, don't bother unless it's broken or it's acting strange.
And also Electrolytics aren't all that bad, if you buy good quality ones. Panasonic FM-series for example have very low ESR, and should last you at least 20 years if they're not overheated. Just an FYI.

Also, as a rule, you could also go with higher voltage caps to get better ESR. Only side effect is that the higher the voltage, the bigger the cap's physical size.

---------

For testing caps & ESR, i strongly recommend you at least get "The TransistorTester". It's a relatively cheap device usually found on AliExpress or Banggood, based on an open source project, that (among others) measures capacitance, voltage drop, & ESR quite accurately! It has many forms and revisions, so do a little research first.
Just be sure to ALWAYS discharge EVERY cap before testing it... And don't test caps that are soldered in a circuit.

Reply 8 of 11, by iVirtualZero

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Thank you so much for the informative replies. So audio grade electrolytics for the soundcard. And the electrolytics and polymers for the the other parts as close to the original specifications. Likely will contact customer service for more info as i am no capacitor expert. Phils Computer Lab also has a video on him using polymer caps on a Pentium 4 motherboard. I will look into it. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=0vY3DgUbtSM

Reply 9 of 11, by B24Fox

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iVirtualZero wrote on 2021-03-23, 01:20:

Thank you so much for the informative replies. So audio grade electrolytics for the soundcard. And the electrolytics and polymers for the the other parts as close to the original specifications. Likely will contact customer service for more info as i am no capacitor expert. Phils Computer Lab also has a video on him using polymer caps on a Pentium 4 motherboard. I will look into it. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=0vY3DgUbtSM

I actually recapped an entire X-Fi Elite Pro a few years back. It took 2 identical cards, so i could work in parallel for step by step comparison, and about 2 years of research, working and learning, in order to tune it to my liking.
I have used Elna Silmic II (sounds like a dream if placed correctly, but very expensive, and extremely hard to come by -- beware of fakes) , Panasonic FC , Panasonic FK, Murata ceramic, WIMA PP-Film, (and Panasonic FM, but it sucked really bad for audio, although it has one the lowest ESR values among electrolytics. Could be great for CPUs and PSUs ).
Thing is that each had their place so much so, that for the DACs, nothing came even close to the $hitty G-LUXON that were already on the board. so i just put them back.

If you don't want to devote your life to a project like this, you can just use Panasonic FC for almost everything. It was by far the best all-around cap (sound good, cheap-ish, easy to find). FK might beat it by a little, but they are only SMD, so they're a b*tch to work with. Also, i've seen other people reaching the same conclusion about the FC.. so there's that 😀

I would definitely use the FC for recaping an old amplifier, or an old sound blaster, if necessary. Not to mention power supplies and other stuff..!
It's like, if you're to lazy to research anything, just put in a Panasonic FC and it will work fine, and/or sound better 😀

Reply 10 of 11, by iVirtualZero

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B24Fox wrote on 2021-03-23, 02:05:
I actually recapped an entire X-Fi Elite Pro a few years back. It took 2 identical cards, so i could work in parallel for step b […]
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iVirtualZero wrote on 2021-03-23, 01:20:

Thank you so much for the informative replies. So audio grade electrolytics for the soundcard. And the electrolytics and polymers for the the other parts as close to the original specifications. Likely will contact customer service for more info as i am no capacitor expert. Phils Computer Lab also has a video on him using polymer caps on a Pentium 4 motherboard. I will look into it. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=0vY3DgUbtSM

I actually recapped an entire X-Fi Elite Pro a few years back. It took 2 identical cards, so i could work in parallel for step by step comparison, and about 2 years of research, working and learning, in order to tune it to my liking.
I have used Elna Silmic II (sounds like a dream if placed correctly, but very expensive, and extremely hard to come by -- beware of fakes) , Panasonic FC , Panasonic FK, Murata ceramic, WIMA PP-Film, (and Panasonic FM, but it sucked really bad for audio, although it has one the lowest ESR values among electrolytics. Could be great for CPUs and PSUs ).
Thing is that each had their place so much so, that for the DACs, nothing came even close to the $hitty G-LUXON that were already on the board. so i just put them back.

If you don't want to devote your life to a project like this, you can just use Panasonic FC for almost everything. It was by far the best all-around cap (sound good, cheap-ish, easy to find). FK might beat it by a little, but they are only SMD, so they're a b*tch to work with. Also, i've seen other people reaching the same conclusion about the FC.. so there's that 😀

I would definitely use the FC for recaping an old amplifier, or an old sound blaster, if necessary. Not to mention power supplies and other stuff..!
It's like, if you're to lazy to research anything, just put in a Panasonic FC and it will work fine, and/or sound better 😀

Thanks will see if it’s on Digikey or Mouser.

Reply 11 of 11, by shamino

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I've used lower valued (but very low ESR) polymer caps for the Vcore circuit next to the CPU on several motherboards from P2-P4 and one Athlon64 and it has always worked out well. I've also done the same with RAM and GPUs.
To know which caps are on Vcore you have to measure the connections with a meter though, don't just assume that all the caps near the CPU are on Vcore. Some of them might not be.

A practical problem with polymer caps is that they typically have thick and inflexible leads. *If* the lead spacing matches (which it will if cap diameter is the same) then they will fit in the holes but it's tight. If you don't have good tools and a lot of soldering experience you'll probably get frustrated trying to put them in.