For convenience you could use Youtube for the recordings, like say playing Eradicator using AWE64.

retro games 100 wrote:

In DOS, if the jumper is closed, it routes real mode DOS game FM music to the AWE chip, and this provides effects like reverb and chorus. I think you need aweutil running for it to work.

Nope, the MFBEN jumper doesn't have anything to do with the FM-sound. Think of it as a bridge between the card and the AWEUTIL program. When this jumper is left open, you can not use the AWEUTIL TSR to reroute General MIDI from the MIDI port (3x0H) to the EMU8000 synth (6x0H) any more.

Thanks a lot for the info. Somewhere, I have got the notion that you can enhance DOS FM game music with added effects such as reverb and chorus, using an AWE64 card. I vaguelly recall that I also tried to get this working using an AWE32. I guess this can achieved using the DOS AWEUTIL utility with appropriate command line parameters, and without the need to worry about what open or closed "state" the MFBEN jumper is in. Thanks.

leileilol wrote:

For convenience you could use Youtube for the recordings, like say playing Eradicator using AWE64.

That's an interesting idea. What's the sound quality like on YT? Is it as good as mp3, which is the format I've used for my recordings.

PM malik or wolverineDK... they will happily arrange with you to get that ISO up

malik's thread has a very new multi-language AWE64 ISO... I noticed the difference between it and yours is the lack of TextAssist and VoiceAssist. Not sure why they're missing, but it's no big deal to me since I have them. 😀

Anyway, it'll be nice to have your contribution to the collection 😀

Do you have Eradicator and Magic Carpet 2 with the AWE64 also?

Actually FM sound on my AWE64 cards sound very strange if I do not load AWEUTIL, I also believe that chorurs/reverb settings are being applied to FM.

Will check it soon.

€dit: just checked, chorus and reverb settings are definitely applied to FM music in DOS

Unfortunately, I didn't get those games. I think that gold CD-ROM came with a "loose" card bought from ebay, ie not boxed/etc.

BTW, Re: link number 3 above, for "WaveSynth/WG drivers update for Windows 95" (wswg95up.exe). If you use the gold ISO, I'm not sure you need it. The wswg95up.exe readme file mentions something that's already available - a checkbox for WaveSynth/WG CD quality.

Yeah, AWEUTIL /S is also needed for initializing the FM chip. With AWEUTIL /C:xx and /R:xx you can set the amount of chorus/reverb.

If you want to make out the most of this feature, there is an utility to change the chorus/reverb parameters and save them into presets (AWE32FXWorkshop), and a mixer app which can load these (Master Mixer). Both programs are bundled in a file called mm5_11.zip, it can still be found floating on the net.

if somebody has those games that came with their awe64, let me know!

I've finished installing all of the DOS and Windows 3.x software. I ran the file "install.exe" found on the root of the gold CD-ROM. This installs all DOS and Windows 3.x drivers and applications. The following DOS software is installed:

C:\CTCM

C:\SB16

The CTCM software shown above in the first picture can be upgraded. You can download an updated package here; the file name is called ctcmbbs.exe. Creative call this package "Creative PnP Configuration Manager (Rev 4)". You can simply manually overwrite/upgrade two files found in your C:\CTCM sub folder called: CTCM.exe and CTCU.exe. After doing this, you have:

C:\CTCM (after manual upgrade. Please check the date column.)

Here's a special message to all of you AWE64 Vogoners, including user "TheMAN". Please can you do me a favour, to double-check that all of these files mentioned in this post are correct? It'll ensure that everyone out there can very easily get/verify that they have the latest software. Can you examine all of my screenshots and other datestamp related information in this post, and see if your versions are any newer? If they are newer, please can you tell me? Thanks very much for your time! 😀

Please also note that these Creative downloads are also available on TheMAN's Creative software CD-ROM .ISO file, which is mentioned in Malik's Creative software thread here, and can be downloaded here.

It is likely that during this DOS/Win 3.x installation process, it "calls" the install.exe file found inside the gold CD-ROM's \WIN31 sub directory. I used a Pentium 3 @450 MHz machine to launch this installation. It appeared to work, except for one problem which I'll mention later. I read the readme.txt file found in Creative's "speed patch" (here), file name is called awe64pat.exe. Creative call this patch "Patch Disk for AWE64 CDs for installation onto Intel Pentium Pro 200 and faster systems ". It says that you can experience problems installing Windows 3.x software if you are using a Pentium Pro (200 or faster) machine. I wonder if the install.exe file found on the gold CD-ROM has been patched to fix this issue, because I did not experience any problems except for one problem which I'll mention a bit later. I examined the date structures of these two install.exe files, the one on the gold CD-ROM, and the one in this Creative speed patch.

install.exe file on the gold CD-ROM, found inside the \WIN31 sub directory = 13/01/1997 datestamp
install.exe file in the Creative speed patch = 16/01/1997 datestamp

There's only 3 days difference in these two datestamps. A hex editor reveals that the files are different, but that's all I can tell. My guess is that the gold CD-ROM's install.exe works OK. But this is definitely odd: the Wavesynth/WG Win 3.x software fails to install correctly. Everything else works, however. That's all DOS software (drivers and applications), and all other Windows 3.x software (drivers and applications) installs and works OK.

I examined the contents of the Windows 3.x Wavesynth/WG upgrade package. It's here; file name is called WSWG31UP.EXE. The contents of this package (including its drivers and .lib libary files) were simply not found on my HDD! That was unexpected. No wonder the Wavesynth/WG Win 3.x control panel did not work when I tried it. I got dumped out of Windows to the C:\ DOS prompt! But the good news is that running this upgrade package solves all problems. It installs the Wavesynth/WG Win 3.x software, and it works.

I suppose it's possible that the Wavesynth Win 3.x installation segment failed because of the speed of the machine. I examined the gold CD-ROM's \WIN31 sub folder, and there's an installation related file there called WSWG.PVL. But somehow it didn't get properly installed when I initially launched the DOS + Win 3.x installation from the gold's CD-ROM.

After the initial DOS and Windows 3.x installation had completed, I was keen on updating all of this software. I think you only have to run one upgrade, to update all DOS and Windows 3.x drivers and applications. It's called S64BASIC.EXE, and can be found here. Creative call this package "AWE64 Basic Disk for DOS/Windows 3.1". After this upgrade, I wanted to examine some of the version numbers associated with my DOS and Windows 3.x software. For the DOS files, I found the version number information by running each .exe using the /? parameter. Eg c:\sb16\diagnose.exe /?

diagnose.exe version 4.04 -> now 4.05
mixerset.exe version 2.12 -> now 2.18
aweutil.exe version 1.35 -> now 1.36
ct3dse.exe 2.01 -> 2.01 (no change)

As requested earlier in this thread, please can someone check these version numbers, to see if any of you have anything newer? Thanks a lot! I noticed after this S64BASIC upgrade, it made a new sub folder called backup. The full path to this is C:\SB16\BACKUP. The *old* files found inside this back up folder are:

Hunting about on my HDD, the newer upgraded files are as follows. Important note - these dates are in DAY first, then month, then year format.

(File Location, date)
AUXDRV.DRV C:\SB16\DRV, 11/07/1997
AWECP16.EXE C:\SB16\WINAPPL, 17/03/1997
AWECP.HLP C:\SB16\WINAPPL, 10/12/1996
AWEMAN.DLL C:\WINDOWS, 03/07/1997
AWEUTIL.COM C:\SB16, 11/06/1997
CTCCW.DLL C:\WINDOWS, 08/05/1997
CTMIXER.EXE C:\SB16\WINAPPL, 12/06/1997
CTMIXER.HLP C:\SB16\WINAPPL, 09/05/1997
CTSB16.SYS C:\SB16\DRV, 20/02/1997
CTVMD.DRV C:\SB16\WINAPPL, 24/01/1997
DIAGNOSE.EXE C:\SB16, 21/10/1996
MIXERSET.EXE C:\SB16, 23/06/1997
OEMSETUP.INF C:\WINDOWS (date check not required)
SB16SND.DRV C:\WINDOWS\SYSTEM, 13/06/1997
SBAWE32.DRV C:\WINDOWS\SYSTEM, 13/01/1997
VSBPD.386 C:\WINDOWS\SYSTEM, 01/12/1997

I appreciate that it may be a bit tedious, but if someone can please double-check these datestamps, that would be really useful. Thanks a lot! The upgraded DOS and Windows 3.x sub folders looks like this:

C:\SB16\DRV

C:\SB16\WINAPPL

C:\SB16\WINDRV

Now I will look at the Windows 3.x installation. After running the initial DOS + Win 3.x installation found on the gold CD-ROM, and then running the s64basic.exe DOS + Win 3.x upgrade mentioned earlier, this is what is installed:

I then ran each Windows 3.x application, to find out the version numbers. You can easily get this information by looking at the Help/About section for each application.

Midi 1.27

Wave 1.27

CD 1.26

Remote 1.24

Mixer 4.51.0

Soundo'LE 2.52.0

AWE control 2.07.0

Wave Studio 2.0

Voice Assist 1.10

WaveSynth 1.04.11.0

Midi instrument mapper 1.01.14.0

Text Assist 1.30

Dictionary reader 1.30

That's probably all for now. I could rummage about inside the C:\WINDOWS and SYSTEM folders looking for other files. I will if you want me to check file versions! For example, in my C:\WINDOWS\SYSTEM sub folder, I have a file called MIDIMAP.CFG with a datestamp of 08/01/1997. (That's day first, btw.)

Lastly, the version of Vienna installed is only 2.1. I appreciate there are later versions. I will upgrade it to version 2.3, as I understand 2.4 isn't so good.

I don't see anything wrong with those files. The CTCM list you showed is the latest version.
Vienna 2.1 is the last 16-bit version, so to use 2.3 you will need Win95.

The PPro install.exe patch isn't for \install.exe on the CD, but for \win31\disk1\install.exe
It is meant for you to create install floppies to do the install as it is "impossible" to patch a CD and do a CD-ROM install. 😉

There are TextAssist patches available also. It solves issues with WaveSynth/WG. I don't think you can find them on creative's site anymore. Who cares, screw them... my "super" ISO is a better source! 😁 I don't know if your AWE64 installer already installed the latest version of TextAssist or not. Look in the readme file of the upgrade and it will list the files and dates for you. Compare and report back. 😀

There were no VoiceAssist updates and it was always a 16-bit program during the ISA Sound Blaster days. So even your "very new" AWE64 disc will have version 1.1. There is version 1.2 I believe, and that came with the original Sound Blaster Live, but never in any AWE64 or any 16-bit Sound Blasters

I don't think the rest of the Win3.1 apps really got updated since 1995. What I have on my early SB16 CD is basically the same as what's on the AWE64 CD. Only the 32-bit stuff got updated up until around early 1997 or so when the AWE64 craze started to die down. If you have read my readme file in my ISO, you will know that the SB16 and AWE32 (not included) Win95 installers do NOT work in NT4. It will bitch that you have no drivers installed and quit. The newer AWE64 installer is more forgiving and it will just not check for driver presence during startup and will let you install the apps first, then it will check and tell you to install the drivers at the end of the sequence. This allows for NT4 installation of the apps (no WaveSynth), something that Creative never really cared to support well. The SB16 "WavEffects" CD works the same way as the late AWE64 ones.

Btw, does that creative memory module make a lot of difference?

I noticed there's a TextAssist update (for WaveSynth/WG) on your "super" ISO, inside the MISC sub folder. I'll check it out! The version of TA I have installed is version 1.30. I think it's the latest, although I don't know if the TA WaveSynth/WG specific update modifies it in any way.

I have been examining your ISO file more closely today, because the next card I am going to test is a SB16 model CT2740. I reckon this must be one of the last non PnP cards Creative made. My simple reasoning is that CT2800s were PnP, and 2800-2740=only 60. Hehe.

Re: memory modules. These are used for Windows soundfonts. The larger the capacity, the larger the soundfont you can use. You can use SFs for DOS General Midi music, but it only works inside a "DOS box" in Windows 9x. Pity about that.

the update is already unzipped into \TASSTUPG (or something like that)

you got very lucky with the memory module... not many were sold because they were a rip off... some chinese dude made a SIMM converter years ago, the wikipedia sound blaster page shows it is still being sold but the page hasn't been updated in a few years... I don't know if it's still sold or not, if it is I'd snatch one up myself!

and actually, the highest number non-PnP SB16 is a CT2919... I think it is an OEM card though... the CT28xx/CT29xx series cards no longer use the YMF262 chip and has the crappy FM chip... some of them use vibra chips too

Those SimmConn adapters are good. I would recommend one. I did a quick test of one last year. It's here.

Re: TA upgrade. I see what you are saying now. The readme says - "If you already have TextAssist version 1.3x on your system, then you do not need this upgrade package."

So, it looks like I have the latest version, but I'll check those file dates in the readme anyway. BTW, that readme is from the special WaveSynth version, so it looks like version 1.30 is all I need.

BTW, I am trying to organise that AWE64 Gold ISO upload. I am hoping it will be available for everyone tomorrow.

TheMAN wrote:

. . . "the CT28xx/CT29xx series cards no longer use the YMF262 chip and has the crappy FM chip... some of them use vibra chips t […]
Show full quote

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"the CT28xx/CT29xx series cards no longer use the YMF262 chip and has the crappy FM chip... some of them use vibra chips too"

That is not exactly true. The Creative Labs Sound BLaster model CT-2800 used the Vibra CT2504 ASIC, but did use the Yamaha YMF-262-M OPL3 and the YAC-512-M DAC. No CQM here.

A keeper...

Creative OEM CT-2800 ViBRA-16S

dvwjr

edit: use thumbnail photo to link to larger picture

^ Agree, that was the card I was using in my 486 for quite a while, as it has much better sound quality than standard (non-vibra) SB16's and a real OPL chip. However it is affected by the hanging note bug quite badly so I turned to non-creative cards for a solution.

I also have a CT2900 which seems similar to the CT2800 except it has a mobile version of the OPL chips. I gues they had extra stock of low voltage OPL chips and needed something to use them on v:)v

Tetrium wrote:

Btw, does that creative memory module make a lot of difference?

I can't speak for the creative module, but the simmconn module makes a huge difference. I have no desire to chase a GUS or an MT-32, at least not with how much they cost. Anything that supports GM sounds freaking amazing with 28MB of memory and the right soundfont.

so is the simmconn still available or not? I haven't had any real answers yet 🙁