64bit Vanilla Dosbox?

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Re: 64bit Vanilla Dosbox?

Postby Dominus » 2015-8-07 @ 16:49

Glad when one turns off autocorrection and has too big thumbs.
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Re: 64bit Vanilla Dosbox?

Postby Tiger433 » 2015-8-07 @ 16:56

64bit Dosbox is good, but use of more cores is better, in Ubuntu x64 Dosbox is also 64bit?
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Re: 64bit Vanilla Dosbox?

Postby Dominus » 2015-8-07 @ 17:00

By default, yes.
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Re: 64bit Vanilla Dosbox?

Postby Serious Callers Only » 2015-8-10 @ 19:11

Tiger433 wrote:64bit Dosbox is good, but use of more cores is better, in Ubuntu x64 Dosbox is also 64bit?

You can install the 32 bits version by appending :i386 like so:
sudo apt-get install dosbox:i386

That risks uninstalling other things depending on what uses SDL though. So be careful to read the output and cancel if you can't live without something it's trying to install (that has no 32 bits version at least).
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Re: 64bit Vanilla Dosbox?

Postby Jorpho » 2015-8-10 @ 20:19

Tiger433 wrote:64bit Dosbox is good, but use of more cores is better
Not necessarily. DOSBox is not multithreaded and there is no reason that can be expected to help speed-wise.
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Re: 64bit Vanilla Dosbox?

Postby Kerr Avon » 2015-8-11 @ 18:14

Tertz wrote:
Darklord42 wrote:Should we not prepare?


For Windows drop of 32 bit support will not happen during 5 next years, at least. More possible - 10 years.


When Windows drops 32bit support, it will upset a lot of people, especially gamers. Alright, so by then virtual machines might be easier and more convenient to install/set up/use, but Windows gamers won't be pleased that they can't just run Half-Life 1 and 2, the Unreal Tournament games, etc, 'native' in Windows.
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Re: 64bit Vanilla Dosbox?

Postby Darklord42 » 2015-8-11 @ 18:48

No one is worried about windows, they have a long history of backwards compatibility even to the detriment of security. Apple is the main worry, because they have no such qualms (no installed business userbase) so they can drop stuff at the drop of a hat, and there will be some grumbling while we all scramble to make things work again. As dominus said, they haven't done it yet. But I'll bet it's on the horizon.
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Re: 64bit Vanilla Dosbox?

Postby ovvldc » 2015-8-14 @ 13:21

Kerr Avon wrote:Alright, so by then virtual machines might be easier and more convenient to install/set up/use, but Windows gamers won't be pleased that they can't just run Half-Life 1 and 2, the Unreal Tournament games, etc, 'native' in Windows.


I could be wrong, but I thought Windows already uses a virtual machine to make XP software work. Windows on Windows is the unimaginative name IIRC. It is all theoretically transparent to the user, but lots of stuff going on under the hood ;).
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Re: 64bit Vanilla Dosbox?

Postby Jorpho » 2015-8-14 @ 15:35

ovvldc wrote:I could be wrong, but I thought Windows already uses a virtual machine to make XP software work. Windows on Windows is the unimaginative name IIRC.
I don't think anyone would call it a virtual machine.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WoW64
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Re: 64bit Vanilla Dosbox?

Postby Kerr Avon » 2015-10-06 @ 19:58

ovvldc wrote:
Kerr Avon wrote:Alright, so by then virtual machines might be easier and more convenient to install/set up/use, but Windows gamers won't be pleased that they can't just run Half-Life 1 and 2, the Unreal Tournament games, etc, 'native' in Windows.


I could be wrong, but I thought Windows already uses a virtual machine to make XP software work. Windows on Windows is the unimaginative name IIRC. It is all theoretically transparent to the user, but lots of stuff going on under the hood ;).


Yes, but that's not an option for all gamers, as the Home Premium version of Windows 7, which is the one installed on many pre-built desktops, and laptops, doesn't support XP mode, as Microsoft want you to pay for a more advanced version of Windows 7, even though to most English speaking people, a product with the word 'premium' in it's name would tend to imply that that product was pretty much the top of the range anyway...

And also Microsoft say "Windows XP Mode was primarily designed to help businesses move from Windows XP to Windows 7. It isn't optimized for graphic-intensive programs such as 3D games, nor is it well suited for programs with hardware requirements such as TV tuners." (my emphasis), source: http://windows.microsoft.com/en-GB/wind ... -windows-7

Not that this is too important, as there's a free virtual machine that Windows users, including Home Premium users, can install on their PCs, called VMWare. I've put it on a few PCs a while back to run older software and it worked great, but none of the programs used 3D hardware acceleration, and I don't know if VMWare supports this.
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Re: 64bit Vanilla Dosbox?

Postby DosFreak » 2015-10-06 @ 20:30

He was referring to WoW https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_on_Windows.
The average user isn't aware of this since their software just works (usually).

Virtual PC was a good product back in the day until DOSBox far surpassed it for DOS games and Microsoft butchered it via XP Mode and then discontinued it for HyperV which is tied to the OS.

3D acceleration works in Vmware for Windows 2000 guests and above for D3D9. D3D10 support is in version 12.
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Re: 64bit Vanilla Dosbox?

Postby Myg » 2018-6-10 @ 01:26

Looks like the apple prediction came true:

https://www.overclock3d.net/news/softwa ... in_macos/1

Windows following in time as well?
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Re: 64bit Vanilla Dosbox?

Postby zirkoni » 2018-6-10 @ 08:56

Myg wrote:Windows following in time as well?

Yeah, maybe in 2050.
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Re: 64bit Vanilla Dosbox?

Postby Myg » 2018-6-10 @ 17:21

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Re: 64bit Vanilla Dosbox?

Postby kjliew » 2018-6-10 @ 20:42

Check out viewtopic.php?f=32&t=47286

I am trying the get DOSBox devs to look into WIN64 issues. Hopefully, it will help to get their attention.
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Re: 64bit Vanilla Dosbox?

Postby Myg » 2018-6-10 @ 23:20

DosFreak wrote:That's for the OS.


Ah yes, that is correct.

There is a youtube video which describes MS's intentions to remove 32bit app support in the seeable future. The same way they removed 16bit app support previously. I cant seem to find the video again so lets just say its a rumour.
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Re: 64bit Vanilla Dosbox?

Postby Falcosoft » 2018-6-11 @ 19:19

The same way they removed 16bit app support previously. I cant seem to find the video again so lets just say its a rumour.

It cannot be 'the same way' since 16-bit support is only missing from 64-bit OS versions (from the beginning). MS never removed 16-bit support form its 32-bit OS versions. So the 'same way' would be if 32 bit support will be missing from future 128-bit OS versions. It can happen :)
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Re: 64bit Vanilla Dosbox?

Postby Myg » 2018-6-11 @ 21:20

This is the closest I could come to any evidence of moves away from native win32 app compat for windows:

https://www.windowscentral.com/understa ... nd-polaris

There are alot of breadcrumbs about the movement of supplanting native with another system or/and locking it into Windows Store apps or some other system.

It shows the movement towards the direction at the least and it might be sooner then later.
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Re: 64bit Vanilla Dosbox?

Postby Falcosoft » 2018-6-11 @ 21:37

This is the closest I could come to any evidence of moves away from native win32 app compat for windows:

Maybe the article was not clear in this respect for you, but it's about a different possibility: namely removing the 'native' Win32/Win64 support. This move would not only affect 32-bit native applications but also 64-bit native Win64 applications. Actually this kind of platform (Windows without native Win32/Win64 support) is almost already exists in the form of Windows 10 S.
In this case the support barrier is not 32-bit vs 64-bit, but applications using the native/legacy Win32 API (notice: the 64-bit version of this legacy API is used also by 64-bit native Win32/64 applications!) and Metro/Modern/WinRT/UWP/Core/Store etc. apps. So on such an OS the 64-bit version of DosBox would not run either since it's also a native/legacy application. In the article's context 'Win32 API' is a generic term. This also includes native 64-bit applications:
https://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/lib ... 96995.aspx
Note: The Windows API was formerly called the Win32 API. The name Windows API more accurately reflects its roots in 16-bit Windows and its support on 64-bit Windows. The name Windows API is used in this volume except when comparing 32-bit Windows programming with 64-bit Windows programming. They are then referred to as Win32 and Win64 APIs, respectively.

I think completely removing the whole Win32/64 legacy subsystem without options would be a suicide move by MS. But making some Windows versions without legacy compatibility is not without sense.
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