The CT2230 and CT2290 are free of the hanging note bug .

James-F wrote:

The CT2230 and CT2290 are free of the hanging note bug .

I don't think that's true.

http://www.vogonswiki.com/index.php/Hanging_note_bug

I have a CT2230, and it is a good card if you're just using the OPL3 for midi, but any SB16 aside from an extremely early models (CT1730, or CT17xx models with a DSP version of 4.05 or earlier) will have at least one of the types of hanging note bugs.

If someone's going to be using a fairly expensive (as far as retro hardware goes) Roland module like the SC55 MKII, I'd recommend investing in a setup that will allow it to work as smoothly as possible. I hate to say it (since this thread is about Soundblasters) but most around here would probably recommend using a different card all together if you're going to use a MIDI module. A Yamaha YMF-718\719 of some sort or one of the other popular SBPro2 compatible alternatives would probably be best. You could probably use both if you want to maintain SB16 compatibility (though I'm unsure if anyone has found any tangible benefit over SBPro for DOS games at this point). You'd hook your MIDI device up to the other card, then set up the two cards to work independently (different IRQ, DMA IO address etc), and in each game select the card that works best for the game.

It is true and tested.
SB16 with the CT1747 Bus interface is free of the hanging note bug.
The so called "Type 2 Legitimate" hanging note bug happens with all midi interfaces and has nothing to do with the SB16.
Sound Blaster 16 Bugs and Deficiencies Summary

I too suggested the Audician 32 (YMF71x) right away but the OP insisted on a SB16.

I have a YMF718 but I'll give the 2230 a go see if I encounter the bug.

kanecvr, I strongly suggest you read, understand and listen to the samples on the linked thread about SB16 deficiencies.
Get familiar with the chips, their CTxxx numbers and what they are responsible for.
The SB16 has a lot of revisions and a LOT of deficiencies and bugs, so please take the time and study the SB16 to make a wiser decision.

James-F wrote:

kanecvr, I strongly suggest you read, understand and listen to the samples on the linked thread about SB16 deficiencies.
Get familiar with the chips, their CTxxx numbers and what they are responsible for.
The SB16 has a lot of revisions and a LOT of deficiencies and bugs, so please take the time and study the SB16 to make a wiser decision.

I really apreciate you taking the time to tell me all this - but consider this machine will be used for OPL3 compatible games mostly - I will only occasionally run sierra games with the SC55mk2 attached. If the hanging note bug warrants swapping audio cards, I'll probably switch to the audician or an ISA Aztec card (witch has real OPL3). This is what makes it hard to decide on one of these.... If I could find my CT1600 this would be so so much easyer, but alas...

What bugs me about the Aztec card is the shitty drivers. It's hard to set up and get working properly - and it seems to mess with my lan card (a lot). As for my YMF718 (Genius Soundmaker Value) I'm saving this for recreating my childhood 586, and it's currently in use in another build.

kanecvr wrote:

I really apreciate you taking the time to tell me all this - but consider this machine will be used for OPL3 compatible games mostly - I will only occasionally run sierra games with the SC55mk2 attached. If the hanging note bug warrants swapping audio cards, I'll probably switch to the audician or an ISA Aztec card (witch has real OPL3). This is what makes it hard to decide on one of these.... If I could find my CT1600 this would be so so much easyer, but alas...

What bugs me about the Aztec card is the shitty drivers. It's hard to set up and get working properly - and it seems to mess with my lan card (a lot). As for my YMF718 (Genius Soundmaker Value) I'm saving this for recreating my childhood 586, and it's currently in use in another build.

As James-F has also stated, any Sound Blaster card with the CT-1747 chip does not suffer from the MIDI hanging note bug. So, the CT2230 shouldn't give you problems if you do connect your SC-55 MK2 or any MIDI daughterboard.

However, the "clicking" bug (what James-F referred to as the "Single-Cycle DMA Clicking" bug) is an irritation, which I could also clearly hear (both under DOS & Windows) on my AWE32 (CT3980) - this one also has the CT-1747 chip (unfortunately, I don't have a CT2230). It sounded exactly like the samples that I listened to on the Nerdly Pleasures blog (for easy reference: http://nerdlypleasures.blogspot.co.il/2015/05 … t-playback.html)

This might just be my configuration, but when I disabled the high DMA channel (default is DMA 5) and only used the low DMA channel (default is DMA 1), the problem seems to have largely disappeared.
However, this might break functionality with games like Duke Nukem 3D, since it won't playback any digitized voices if the high DMA channel is not available and you select Sound Blaster 16 or AWE32 as your sound card. However, one can just edit the duke3d.cfg file to overcome this problem and it will then work with the low DMA channel.

Another alternative is to just use your CT2940 for digital voices and the CT2230 as your FM synthesis and MPU-401 MIDI interface device.

What Aztech cards do you have that is giving you problems? One of the models that has an AZT-2320 chipset? Those are the PnP models and can be tricky to set up.
If you have one of those, then I suggest you rather obtain one that has an AZT-2316 based chipset. Drivers are readily available (up to Windows 95) and they are very easy to set up, since they are not PnP and are configured in software (I've test a number of these cards).

Weirdly enough my card doesn't exhibit this "clicking" bug. Also I hooked up the roland to it for SQ and it seem to run perfectly.

My aztec card has the AZT2316r chip. It only seems to work on some machines - usually pentium class. I haven't been able to get it going on my 386, and it acts up on some 486 machines (works fine when you start a game, but after you quit that and launch it again or another game the sound card won't work).

kanecvr wrote:

Weirdly enough my card doesn't exhibit this "clicking" bug. Also I hooked up the roland to it for SQ and it seem to run perfectly.

That is expected, if you're referring to the CT2230, since it doesn't suffer from the hanging note bug. The clicking bug is only something that I've come across myself on my CT3980. However, I've only had (from that era) a Sound Galaxy Basic 16 and then an AWE64. It was only later on, when I acquired more cards, that I came across this anomaly. I also have a CT2950, but I cannot recall every hearing the clicking bug on that one, but I didn't play with it that much, since that one does suffer from the hanging note bug.

kanecvr wrote:

My aztec card has the AZT2316r chip. It only seems to work on some machines - usually pentium class. I haven't been able to get it going on my 386, and it acts up on some 486 machines (works fine when you start a game, but after you quit that and launch it again or another game the sound card won't work).

What's the model number of your card (starts with I38-xxxxxx) and what settings (IRQ & DMA) are you using? It's possible that there could be an incompatibility or perhaps a hardware conflict.

Use the one with a CT1747 bus chip. Less vulnerable to hanging note.

James-F wrote:

The so called "Type 2 Legitimate" hanging note bug happens with all midi interfaces and has nothing to do with the SB16.

Are you sure? This is the first I've heard of this. I've had several recommendations to just plain avoid using digital+MPU401 on any SB16 "just in case" the hanging note bug happens.

If you can find any threads where this has been tested extensively and proven, then someone should certainly edit that wiki and explain that the "type 2" problem is not related to Soundblasters.

jesolo wrote:

This might just be my configuration, but when I disabled the high DMA channel (default is DMA 5) and only used the low DMA channel (default is DMA 1), the problem seems to have largely disappeared.

Are you sure of this jesolo? When did you test this lately?
Not on the SB16 according to my tests. The clicking is absolutely the same as with or without high DMA. It is DSP related.

Ozzuneoj wrote:

Are you sure? This is the first I've heard of this. I've had several recommendations to just plain avoid using digital+MPU401 on any SB16 "just in case" the hanging note bug happens.
If you can find any threads where this has been tested extensively and proven, then someone should certainly edit that wiki and explain that the "type 2" problem is not related to Soundblasters.

What proof do you need? I extensively tested several models of SB16 and gathered a lot of information. It's well known and tested that a SB16 card with the CT1747 Bus Interface is free of the hanging note bug.
Well you shouldn't avoid a SB16 with a CT1747 for it's hanging note bug, but for its single-cycle DMA mode clicking bug, which older SB1/2 games typically use.

kanecvr, you say it's a 386 build?
You'll be hearing the single-cycle DMA clicking bug a lot because you probably are not going to run Doom, Heretic, Hexen, Duke3D, Blood, Quake, Carmageddon, etc.. but much older games which probably used the SB1/2.
Great Hierophant of Nerdly Pleasures discovered this bug a long time a go but did not spread its significance on Vogons as vigorously as I do.

Here is my review of the SB16 CT2230:
My Sound Blaster 16 CT2230 Review
Please take the time and read this review thread, you'll understand much better what the SB16 is all about.
From this review thread derived the SB16 Deficiencies thread which also should be common knowledge by now.

I played around with the card trying to get the clicking noise you guys mentioned - no dice.. I'm currently using the CT2230 with the DOS+win311 drivers + the CSP driver off the CSP disk. So far I tried:

- keen6
- In search of Dr. Riptide
- Dune 2 + GM patch + SC55mk2
- Space Quest 5 + SC55mk2 in MT32 mode
- historik
- supaplex
- jazz jackrabbit

No clicking noise in any of them. What games specifically exhibit this behavior?

James-F wrote:

jesolo wrote:

This might just be my configuration, but when I disabled the high DMA channel (default is DMA 5) and only used the low DMA channel (default is DMA 1), the problem seems to have largely disappeared.

Are you sure of this jesolo? When did you test this lately?
Not on the SB16 according to my tests. The clicking is absolutely the same as with or without high DMA. It is DSP related.

Yes, I tested this about a year ago, but I can only speak on what I experienced with my AWE32 (CT3980). It was clearly noticeable with the high DMA channel enabled and wasn't noticeable anymore with the high DMA channel disabled (I tested this on a Gigabyte GA-6VXC7-4X Socket 370 motherboard and an Intel Celeron 900 MHz CPU, with my main graphics card being an ATI Radeon 8500 64 MB AGP 8x and an Apac 3dfx Voodoo2 12 MB as my secondary one). I remember that I had to rebuilt the entire PC into a different case, since the AWE32 didn't fit in the other ATX case that I previously used.
This is also the reason why I haven't tried this card in another PC, but I might just do to see if this problem also exists on another motherboard/hardware configuration.

Please note, I'm not disputing the existence of the "Single-Cycle DMA Clicking bug", since the sound samples from Nerdly Pleasures clearly proves its there and my CT3980 also exhibits this behaviour.
Is it perhaps possible that this is only linked to certain motherboards (with certain chipsets) or certain types of hardware configurations (for example, if you have another graphics card in your PC that might cause a conflict)?

However, I will, as time allows, test both my CT2950 & CT3980 again with a totally different hardware configuration (maybe my AMD386DX-40) to see what I find (both are PnP cards).

jesolo wrote:

However, I will, as time allows, test both my CT2950 & CT3980 again with a totally different hardware configuration (maybe my AMD386DX-40) to see what I find (both are PnP cards).

Please, that would be great.
If you can please post the results in this thread: Sound Blaster 16 Bugs and Deficiencies Summary

Use Day of the Tentacle intro as reference.
It is especially noticeable when the tentacles/people speak.

James-F wrote:

Please, that would be great. If you can please post the results in this thread: Sound Blaster 16 Bugs and Deficiencies Summary […]
Show full quote

jesolo wrote:

However, I will, as time allows, test both my CT2950 & CT3980 again with a totally different hardware configuration (maybe my AMD386DX-40) to see what I find (both are PnP cards).

Please, that would be great.
If you can please post the results in this thread: Sound Blaster 16 Bugs and Deficiencies Summary

Use Day of the Tentacle intro as reference.
It is especially noticeable when the tentacles/people speak.

The card is configured to a220 / irq 5 / low dma 1 / high dma 5. I tried DOTT (talkie) and there's no clicks there either. I'll also try Duke 2 and Biomenace.

You set with DIAGNOSE.EXE /S right?
Do you have any means to record that and post it as MP3?

Try - Alien Carnage / Halloween Harry, it clicks like crazy in the apogee intro.

If it is not SB16 related but more the Motherboard or Processor, this will help me find the cause and make some progress to find the real cause.

James-F wrote:

You set with DIAGNOSE.EXE /S right? Do you have any means to record that and post it as MP3? […]
Show full quote

You set with DIAGNOSE.EXE /S right?
Do you have any means to record that and post it as MP3?

Try - Alien Carnage / Halloween Harry, it clicks like crazy in the apogee intro.

If it is not SB16 related but more the Motherboard or Processor, this will help me find the cause and make some progress to find the real cause.

Diagnose /s is in autoexec.bat yes. I let the installer do it's magic, I haven't messed with anything. I could probably do a recording but not with alien carnage. For some reason I can't find a working copy anywhere - and will it run well on a 386?

Alien Carnage is freeware: http://www.dosgamesarchive.com/download/alien-carnage/

James-F wrote:

Alien Carnage is freeware: http://www.dosgamesarchive.com/download/alien-carnage/

Verification by primary source:
http://legacy.3drealms.com/news/2007/05/alien … e_freeware.html