Ace wrote:

Now, you did make mention of the DOS Collector's CD-ROM edition and SVGA. It does not support SVGA at all. It's 320x200 just like the floppy disk edition. Speed matching is non-existent as well. Pressing the Enter key like in TIE Fighter fires your weapons instead just like in the floppy disk edition of X-Wing. It does not match your speed with the ship you've targeted.

Good to know... I'll have to add that to the corrections. I'm almost positive the 1998 version of X-Wing has speed matching, and when I learned that Tie Fighter ALSO had speed matching I just assumed the 1994 version of X-Wing would have it too. *shrugs*

I'm not a big fan of the way George Lucas' companies approach updating their older materials. It makes it really difficult to know what's in what unless you have EVERY iteration of a particular movie or game. x_x;

Gemini000 wrote:

I'm almost positive the 1998 version of X-Wing has speed matching

I fired up the Windows 95 version of X-Wing to make sure, and yes, it's the ONLY version with speed matching.

Gemini000 wrote:

I'm not a big fan of the way George Lucas' companies approach updating their older materials

I'm especially not a fan of what LucasArts did with the Windows 95 versions of X-Wing and TIE Fighter. They look a hell of a lot nicer, but they run at a LOWER FRAMERATE than the DOS versions(seriously, the Windows 95 versions look like they're running at 30FPS) and the dynamic music is GONE! There's no more OPL2, OPL3, MT-32 support or General MIDI. Instead, it's been replaced by the same long mishmash of various pieces of the actual Star Wars soundtrack as X-Wing vs. TIE Fighter that streams off the disc. The latter is what I hate most about the Windows 95 versions of both X-Wing and TIE Fighter(and I'm a sucker for any form of FM Synthesis). From what I can tell looking the files on each disc, though, while you can't get the dynamic music back, since all the music in the game is stored as various WAV files on the disc, it could be replaced with the original music from the DOS versions, but it won't dynamically change like it would in the DOS versions.

I mostly enjoyed x-wing for the fancy intro, not having a good joystick pretty much meant it was unplayable.

Gemini000: lovely episode 😀

The Windows versions of X-Wing and Tie Fighter are indeed terrible, and should be avoided at all costs. LucasArts was so proud of iMUSE, which was their system for dynamically segueing into different sections of music based on what is happening in the game, and it's depressing to see them throw that all out due to the technical limitations of using pre-recorded music (something all games now do). It basically signaled the end of the mighty MIDI games music era for me.

Also, Gemini mentioned in the video not being able to use the joystick to roll. I find this confusing because even X-Wing's 2-button joystick support uses one of the buttons for activating roll mode when held down. I spent a lot of time playing the floppy version of X-Wing using an old 2-button QuickShot joystick that I had jury-rigged to keep working:

• The stick was a stub, with the handle being detached after the buttons stopped working.
• The buttons were ridiculously small, uncomfortable things salvaged from a broken answering machine. They were attached to a long, thin slice of wire-wrap board that was double-stick-taped to the top of the base of the joystick so that it jutted off to the left side.

The only good thing about it was that it offered a lot better resistance than the average cheap analog joystick, due to the fact that the stick was so short that you couldn't get much leverage.

I played the CD-ROM versions long after beating the floppy one (including the addons), so I had probably forgotten the difficulty to the point where I wasn't able to notice a difference. Mostly I noticed that the DOS CD-ROM version had speech in the mission briefings, instead of just in the major cutscenes.

I also played a little with a fan-made mission editor on the floppy version. It was ridiculously complex, though, so I never got too into it like I did with Wolfenstein 3-D and Doom editors.

HunterZ wrote:

Also, Gemini mentioned in the video not being able to use the joystick to roll. I find this confusing because even X-Wing's 2-button joystick support uses one of the buttons for activating roll mode when held down.

True, but I didn't say there was no generic roll key, I said there were "no roll left or right" keys, meaning to roll you have to hold down the second joystick button first. While you could use DOSBox's keymapper to set it up so that twisting the stick will push down both a direction and the second joystick button, there's a small delay after pressing the button down during which it's waiting for you to release the button in which case it will target what you're pointing at. This means mapping the twist function of the joystick this way would result in a lot of turning before finally rolling instead, which would be aggravating considering you're usually already pointing at what you want to keep pointing at when you do a roll. x_x;

HunterZ wrote:

The Windows versions of X-Wing and Tie Fighter are indeed terrible, and should be avoided at all costs. LucasArts was so proud of iMUSE, which was their system for dynamically segueing into different sections of music based on what is happening in the game, and it's depressing to see them throw that all out due to the technical limitations of using pre-recorded music (something all games now do). It basically signaled the end of the mighty MIDI games music era for me.

This is especially strange considering that Full Throttle, The Dig (both from 1995) and The Curse of Monkey Island (from 1997, same as X-Wing vs. TIE Fighter) all use iMUSE with prerecorded music; there shouldn't have been any major technical or licensing issues preventing the use of iMUSE in the X-Wing vs. TIE Fighter engine.

I can think of two reasons to use CD audio instead: lower CPU usage (playing without 3D acceleration was still supported back then) and saving development time (XvT was apparently rushed).

It wasn't until around the turn of the century that wavetable sound cards started becoming the norm. Up to that point, most sound cards were still using synthesizer chips for MIDI music, and none of them sounded alike, so MIDI music would never sound the way it was originally supposed to. I imagine LucasArts wanted the music to sound as close to the actual music from the movie as possible, so just decided to go with digital recordings.

But what really confuses me is why they didn't simply create a digital version of iMUSE. All of the music changes in X-Wing completely override previous music pieces so there's no reason why this couldn't've been done... short of memory limitations or delays in starting streaming music, but even that could've been worked around with some clever coding. :P

There are 2000 and 2001 releases also of X-Wing and TIE Fighter. I'm not entirely sure, but I think they use the X-Wing Alliance engine.

They are called Collectors CD-ROM like the original CD rom versions. Which are not to be confused with Collectors SERIES version from 98 or so. Confusing bunch of releases, 🤣... I have them all and also the floppy versions with expansion packs.

Well, it took over a year and a half, but the total views count of Ancient DOS Games just hit 100,000! :D

So now we just have to multiply that by about 60 and I'll finally catch up to Mr. LGR! ^_^;

Actually, when Clint gave a heads-up to his viewers about my show on his blog roughly a year ago, that was the first major injection of viewership my show got and I can't really thank him enough for that. (Ironically, he did that heads-up not long after his 100th-video questionnaire. If you watch it, you'll understand. ;D )

Another funny thing is that he started LGR after my first attempt to start ADG, but my first attempt to start ADG lasted all of two episodes. I took them down from GameTrailers awhile back but I've been considering uploading them again just for the sake of nostalgia... granted, they're pretty crappy. XD

Still, the fact that hundreds of people watch ADG on a regular basis now is awesome and it's one of the big reasons I keep on doing it, the other big reason being to bring all these old DOS games back to light in a way that isn't just a Let's Play or a comedic rant because a game is old or broken, but rather a collection of details, trivia and information; things to make people interested in a game and to give everyone a reason to get DOSBox going or boot back up one of their old 486's. ;)

Based on the current view numbers, I'm hoping to hit 200,000 before Episode 100 in September. Until then, I hope all you VOGONSers are continuing to enjoy the series! ^_^

EDIT: Actually, after reading over this post, I should probably also give mention to Qbix and the DOSBox staff as well, since they've posted news items on the DOSBox website directly linking to my stuff not just once, but twice, and those links have definitely helped contribute to the view counts too! :)

Gemini000 wrote:

But what really confuses me is why they didn't simply create a digital version of iMUSE.

It's even more confusing; they already had iMUSE working with PCM instead of MIDI in Full Throttle and The Dig before development on X-Wing vs TIE Fighter started, let alone the Windows 95 version of X-Wing!

Congratulations Gemini, I wish you all the best!

Gemini000 wrote:

So now we just have to multiply that by about 60 and I'll finally catch up to Mr. LGR! 😅

easy - start reviewing stuff like The Sims 😉
FWIW, I watch ADG regularly but not LGR. Dig his homepage though, that could inspire me to start...

the other big reason being to bring all these old DOS games back to light in a way that isn't just a Let's Play or a comedic rant because a game is old or broken, but rather a collection of details, trivia and information; things to make people interested in a game and to give everyone a reason to get DOSBox going or boot back up one of their old 486's. 😉

amen to that - the only valid reasons to do a review. Always found "Let's Play" or "lawl blocky pixels" style reviews to be a waste of time.
anyway, congrats, and as they always say before the celebratory line of coke - rock on!

ADG: Congrats on the views! I'm definitely still watching, although sometimes I miss a week and have to catch up :p

iMUSE: When you people talk about iMUSE with non-MIDI music, are you talking about the fact that the games have the "iMUSE" sound setup utility, or that they actually use dynamic music that changes depending on what you're doing? The former is certainly true, but I'm not so sure about the latter.

Ancient DOS Games Episode 72 - Duke Nukem II is online!

...and no one made the connection between this game and the Terminator movies. *shrugs* Ah well. Next week's hint is really easy to make up for it. ;P

Nothing much to say at the moment... though I need to replace the cable for my headphones because it's on the fritz due to a damaged wire. I made a quick fix to them and can still use them, I just doubt they'll last much longer. I have a replacement cable on the way but it's gonna be a week or two before I get it. :/

Yeah, today's young dukes fans probably never seen the Terminator movies yet and probably don't understand how much T2 influenced Duke

I meant to send in a guess for one of the Commander Keen games, as at least one of them had an intro exactly like the opening credits from Terminator 1.

My main memory of DN2 is that my brother got duped by one of those fly-by-night companies that sold shareware versions of games on floppy disks, and he bought it for me as a small xmas present when we were teenagers. It had good graphics for an Apogee/3DRealms game, but I didn't spend as much time playing it as I had with DN1.

nice review Kris

Hehe funny, duke nukem 2 actually seems to use the 16 color mode and changes the palette. It doesn't work in ega mode since you only have 16 colors in ega mode due to it's cga monitor compatibility for lowres modes.

Duke Nukem 2 was one of the first DOS games I played, my parents bought a new PC in 1994 and it came preloaded with a few shareware games, Duke 2 being one of them. I walked into the computer room to see the tech there showing my parents the game 😀

I definitely agree that Apogee games tended to be 'more of the same' beyond episode 1. Halloween Harry is probably the first real exception to this that I can think of.
I remember a few games that tended to have much more boring level design beyond the first episode- like they chose the best levels for shareware. Thankfully I don't think duke's level design gets much worse in later episodes.

I'm surprised that you didn't talk about DN2 stealing graphics from Turrican - http://www.nemmelheim.de/turrican/news/duke/

Hehe funny, duke nukem 2 actually seems to use the 16 color mode and changes the palette. It doesn't work in ega mode since you only have 16 colors in ega mode due to it's cga monitor compatibility for lowres modes.

So is there any point to me trying this on my EGA monitor/vid card? 🤣