VOGONS


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First post, by CENTRAL

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Hello everyone, it’s nice being here – first post!!!

I was recently asked to “clean” an old pc out of some relatives house, as it was only “taking up space”…

This machine was built by me some 20 years ago and then given away, to give space to a new build.

Not even remembering the details, initially my thought was to take it apart and sell anything of value.

Upon opening the case however I realized some things in there were quite special and worth the effort to bring back to life.

The mainboard was an ASUS P3B-F (the one and only) with a Katmai Pentium iii @600MHz occupying the slot 1 socket. The soundcard, memory, and GPU were much less impressive and upgrades are needed.

The case is also a wonderful midi tower ATX case with 3 x 5.25” and another 2 floppy drive bays, very well built and pretty functional for that time period. Since the computer had been neglected, the case is also worn (not damaged though in any way).

My idea as of now is to build a Windows 98 SE machine, keeping the board, processor along with 512Mb of RAM.

Thankfully I do keep some stuff around from my old pc builds and I managed to find the following pieces, so here are my thoughts:

- A Yamaha CD recorder – perfectly matching the original build’s date (1999)
- An LG DVD recorder – later piece (2003) but I think it will get a ticket for this ride
- A Creative Soundblaster Live 1024 (but maybe an 1st Gen Audigy would be better, but I need to source one)
- A Hercules 3D Prophet Geforce 3 200ti (looks beautiful but here again I think I will opt for an Nvidia FX series card)
- A Sony floppy drive (found in this build)
- An 80GB Western Digital HDD from 2007 (found in this build)

I also have some PC-133 C2 256Mb SD-RAM sticks on order.

So, if I am not missing anything here, I still miss a GPU (to be sourced) and a better sound card – music reproduction is high priority for me.

PSU consideration:

I do not intend to power up the old PSU. It has been sleeping for more than 15 years, better leave it like that…

I am quite usure if a new PSU will be a fit at all. The Case is an ATX, the mobo has a 20 pin power socket and of course there is a need to power the old CD/DVD & Floppy devices.

Given the above, would you be kind enough to give me some feedback on this build?

I am certain I will be adding to the considerations further, as there are several issues to be dealt with and my memories from this era are faint…

Thank you for any contribution!

Reply 1 of 27, by Babasha

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- A Yamaha CD recorder – perfectly matching the original build’s date (1999) - YAMAHA 2200E is the best, F1 models are rare and price impressive

- An LG DVD recorder – later piece (2003) but I think it will get a ticket for this ride - nice but not period correct((( CREATIVE MATSHITA DRX2 or old IDE TOSHIBA series is OK

- A Creative Soundblaster Live 1024 (but maybe an 1st Gen Audigy would be better, but I need to source one) - nice choice, especially with AWE64 digital-mod in pair

Need help? Begin with photo and model of your hardware 😉

Reply 2 of 27, by CENTRAL

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I can't remember the exact model of the Yamaha cd right now, but I will get back on this.

I REALLY liked the fact that it has a headphone output with volume control right on the front side!!!

Thanks for the input!!!

Reply 3 of 27, by CENTRAL

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Well, I think that the PSU problem is not that easy to solve...

I am reading that currents PSUs are weak on the 5V rail while strong on the 12V, which is the opposite from old ones.

Do you guys think this is an issue with the P3B-F?

Any recommendations?

Reply 4 of 27, by Munx

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It's not much of a problem on SLot-1 systems, even with a Katmai, though if you plan on going with a Geforce3 (which is one of the more 5V hungry AGP cards), it wouldn't hurt to get something that can do 120 Watts or more total for the 5-3.3V rail.

My builds!
The FireStarter 2.0 - The wooden K5
The Underdog - The budget K6
The Voodoo powerhouse - The power-hungry K7
The troll PC - The Socket 423 Pentium 4

Reply 5 of 27, by CENTRAL

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Munx wrote on 2023-03-09, 15:30:

It's not much of a problem on SLot-1 systems, even with a Katmai, though if you plan on going with a Geforce3 (which is one of the more 5V hungry AGP cards), it wouldn't hurt to get something that can do 120 Watts or more total for the 5-3.3V rail.

Thank you for your advice. Much appreciated!

Reply 6 of 27, by CENTRAL

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So, this Kolink is a somewhat typical current PSU in the mid-price range.

Would you say it is ok to use it?

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Reply 8 of 27, by Munx

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When you pick a model, look for reviews that show how well it deals with cross-loads (when one rail is being used heavily and the other is not).

My builds!
The FireStarter 2.0 - The wooden K5
The Underdog - The budget K6
The Voodoo powerhouse - The power-hungry K7
The troll PC - The Socket 423 Pentium 4

Reply 9 of 27, by chinny22

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These days with networking and large hard drives virtual CD drive are so much better then physical media. You still need something but it doesn't really matter if its CD or DVD as it'll probably rarely get used. If your including both drives to show off the technology then that's a different matter.

You could also get a Audigy 2 ZS, the final card with Win98 support but if you already have the Live! I'd just stick with that as personally I don't find the difference that great.

I wouldn't be so quick to write off the GF3. My dual Katmai 600 only has a GF2 MX and it holds up pretty well but it does have a couple of Voodoo 2 cards as well so will admit some of my games are using glide.

I've a number of both new and old systems using modern Corsair modular PSU's and so far so good even with the weak 5v rail
My thinking was you can remove the useless PCI-E and SATA connectors, and if needed grab the unused 4 pin molex cables from PSU's in newer builds.
Unfortunately Corsair no longer have the 20+4 ATX style connector so will probably start looking at another brand of modular PSU's when I need to start replacing a few PSU's.

Maybe hold off till you have completed the windows side of the build but if your into dos games an ISA sound card of some type would be desirable for dos gaming if that interests you.

Reply 10 of 27, by CENTRAL

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Nice points here, thank you!

I will be posting more on the components as I move forward, that's for sure...

I will be using 4 drives tbh. A CD recorder, a DVD writer, a Zip drive and a floppy drive.

Of course not all of them will be working at the same time, but I would like to have them available. I have quite a few zips for example and I want to review my old files.

Dos is not a consideration atm, but I will not rule it out. There is no ISA sound card in my inventory however.

As of now, I need to sort the PSU issue out. Without this nothing will ever work, no progress will happen.

Reply 11 of 27, by cyclone3d

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For PSUs, even in retro builds, I make sure to use ones that are at least 80+ Bronze rated.

Seasonic is my brand of choice, but other top-tier brand are fine as well.

The Cheiftec you show doesn't show 80+ of any kind unless that pic is not showing all the specs.

I am not familiar with Kolinc but if it is really 80+ Gold rated (not just a sticker put on there to fool people), then it is probably fine.

Quality modern PSUs are also usually rated for continuous load unlike PSUs from times of yor, when they were rated for temporary maximum load and were also most likely to be rated about twice as much as they could actually deliver at all.

Yamaha modified setupds and drivers
Yamaha XG repository
YMF7x4 Guide
Aopen AW744L II SB-LINK

Reply 12 of 27, by CENTRAL

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Seasonic is a solid choice!

But they as well have significantly lowered the performance of 3.3 & 5.5 volt rails...

Here is a summary of the Focus PSUs

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Reply 13 of 27, by Munx

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From what I recall Corsair has quite a few models that still have some good 5V rails, so I'd look into those. The CX650M in my home office PC has quite a beefy 25A 5V rail.

My builds!
The FireStarter 2.0 - The wooden K5
The Underdog - The budget K6
The Voodoo powerhouse - The power-hungry K7
The troll PC - The Socket 423 Pentium 4

Reply 14 of 27, by CENTRAL

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Munx wrote on 2023-03-10, 15:18:

From what I recall Corsair has quite a few models that still have some good 5V rails, so I'd look into those. The CX650M in my home office PC has quite a beefy 25A 5V rail.

I will certainly look into it as well. Thanx a million!

Reply 15 of 27, by swaaye

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Years ago I bought an ancient, used Enermax 465W with 44 amps on 5v to power old Athlons with excess. You can still easily find them. 😁 Well, at least around the USA.

PIII CPUs are so much lower power that almost anything of quality build is adequate. 20a should be plenty.

Reply 16 of 27, by CENTRAL

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swaaye wrote on 2023-03-13, 16:01:

Years ago I bought an ancient, used Enermax 465W with 44 amps on 5v to power old Athlons with excess. You can still easily find them. 😁 Well, at least around the USA.

PIII CPUs are so much lower power that almost anything of quality build is adequate. 20a should be plenty.

20-22 amps are quite easy to find in decent prices and still pretty good quality power supplies...

Reply 17 of 27, by CENTRAL

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Stalled project report:

Well, as eager as I am to move forward, I have been forced to wait before things can move...

The case has been handed for a repaint to a neighboring car paint shop, but being a (very) low priority paint job, I have to wait...

I also have two PCI adapters (a PCI to USB2 and a PCI Lan adapter) on order from China. These can take several weeks to arrive.

As far as the PSU goes, I think I will get the Chieftek Polaris, which is a good price/ performance unit, but it has not been purchased yet.

One more decision that is not easy to make is which soundcard to use...

I now have an Audigy 2 and the Soundblaster live 1024/ value to choose from. Reading the forum however I can see that the Audigy is not supported by windows 98, so maybe I'm asking for trouble here... I need to get this clear too...

Last edited by CENTRAL on 2023-03-17, 10:16. Edited 1 time in total.

Reply 18 of 27, by Munx

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CENTRAL wrote on 2023-03-17, 09:29:

I now have an Audigy 2 and the Soundblaster live 1024/ value to chose from. Reading the forum however I can see that the Audigy is not supported by windows 98

It is. You can use it with Windows 98 just fine.

My builds!
The FireStarter 2.0 - The wooden K5
The Underdog - The budget K6
The Voodoo powerhouse - The power-hungry K7
The troll PC - The Socket 423 Pentium 4

Reply 19 of 27, by CENTRAL

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Munx wrote on 2023-03-17, 10:13:
CENTRAL wrote on 2023-03-17, 09:29:

I now have an Audigy 2 and the Soundblaster live 1024/ value to chose from. Reading the forum however I can see that the Audigy is not supported by windows 98

It is. You can use it with Windows 98 just fine.

That's good to know. Thank you!