VOGONS


First post, by keropi

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wf192xg_box.jpg

Ah, the WF192-XG... A card that I bought in an instant when it appeared in the Greek market , after being a satisfied SW20-PC user 😁 I was passing by a computer store , and in the display they had it! The familiar name drawn my attention, and bought it the next day. Up until then I had no real intention to change my ISA SW20-PC , I knew little of the internet and frankly I was not aware of the PCI advantages in windows or the WF-192XG's existence...
I did enjoy it, and I also noticed that it had better sound output quality than the SBLive! I was forced to buy some years later due to EAX...

wf192xg_card.jpg

So what's the deal with this card? is it just another simple PCI sound card? No. It has some nice features coupled with Yamaha quality:

Digital Audio: 16 Bit DAC, 16 Bit ADC, Full Duplex
Wavetable Synthesis: 128 software channels + 64 hardware ones (hence the 192 in it's name)
Wavetable size: 4MB (2MB in hardware, 2MB in software)
Physical Modeling: 1 Voice (S-VA)
Effects: 8 Types Reverb; 8 Types Chorus, 36 Types Variation, Echo for MIC-in
MIDI Modes: General MIDI, TG 300B (GS Emulation), XG
Software Compatibility: DirectX 5 or later, DirectSound, DirectSound 3D

The card couples as a nice windows midi card (for it's price that is), supporting the well-known XG midi extensions , Sondius-XG (an algorithm developed by Yamaha and Standford University to allow realistic replication of acoustic wind instruments) and finally is DLS compatible.

It is also compatible to SoundBlaster Pro in Windows DOS box while it supports real DOS mode thru PCPO and DDMA. (I still have the PC-PCI connector cable, though I never tested this function...)

So back then , for a nice price you were getting a PCI soundcard with hardware DirectSound3D support, Sensaura technology for pseudo-3D positional audio and a descent half-software midi solution (if you had the cpu power to enable the extra nice features that is - a PentiumII/266 was necessary for the Sondius-XG extensions and a pentium/166mhz for the extra 128 midi channels). Not bad! 😊

So after the SBLive! failures in my VIA Apollo133 mobo, I thought: let's plug the WF-192XG once again!!! I had to find drivers for it, so in a Yamaha sub-site (they have TONS of sites!!!) found the latest WDM ones for Win98SE that I am using. Installed OK, sound is OK! But wait.... Some stuff missing??? Where is the DirectSound3D support? (installed DX8.1b , tried dxdiag got a message that this card DOES NOT have a hardware 3D sound buffer...!) I was puzzled for a second there, and I downloaded POWERYMF , a 3rd party configuration program for that kind of Yamaha cards (now FREE , http://www.yohng.com/powerymf ) only to find out that DirectSound3D option was greyed out.

None of the Yamaha sites had the old 1040 driver version that I was remembering , I *assume* that due to copyrights or other legal issues, they just replaced their drivers with working ones BUT WITHOUT the sensaura/3D extensions. The only solution was to get an old copy of the drivers.

That proved quite a task, to actually get a WORKING copy of said drivers. Finally after downloading with 6kb/sec from a Japanese university ftp server, I got them!
I have mirrored them for anyone interested , those are the WF192-XG drivers , I cannot really guarantee they will work fine in other models/makes cards that use the same chipset: RS DOWNLOAD LINK or MU DOWNLOAD LINK

So what you get with those drivers? Only these many tabs and hardware DirectSound3D support:

wf192xg_1.png wf192xg_2.png wf192xg_3.png

wf192xg_4.png wf192xg_5.png wf192xg_6.png

wf192xg_7.png wf192xg_8.png wf192xg_9.png

* So does it worth it?
IMHO yes, as it is not plagued with SBLive! bugs that lead to problems with older mobos.

* Is it better than Aureal-based cards?
Don't know, I assume Aureal cards would have better 3D positioning and in hardware too, the WF192-XG supports A3D and EAX in software mode AFAIK/AFAIR ...

here are some in-game benchmarks (taken from www.firingsquad.com)

bencmarks.jpg

also some winbench benchmarks (from dearhoney.idv.tw)

au8830_emu10k1_ymf724_AWB99.gif

SBLive! is the best option it appears when it comes to cpu utilization... 😏

More on the matter as I slowly progress 😊

Last edited by keropi on 2010-03-11, 10:00. Edited 1 time in total.

🎵 🎧 PCMIDI MPU , OrpheusII , Action Rewind , Megacard and 🎶GoldLib soundcard website

Reply 1 of 23, by retro games 100

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Keropi, nice post! Your card reminds me of this card I bought -

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewIt … em=160412108352 (Quantity remaining 7, seller ships worldwide)

I notice in your photo, the main chip has YMF724E-V written on it. The card above in the ebay link also has the number 724 associated with it. Also, the pics you provide in your post about the hardware configuration look similar to the ebay card's hardware configuration screens.

Reply 2 of 23, by keropi

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That ebay card is not an original Yamaha one... but it appears that it also has digital-out (like the wf192-digital model) , my card is exactly like the one it the photo I posted 😀
Did you try that card with the driver I posted? Does hardware 3d sound buffer work in dxdiag?

🎵 🎧 PCMIDI MPU , OrpheusII , Action Rewind , Megacard and 🎶GoldLib soundcard website

Reply 3 of 23, by retro games 100

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keropi wrote:

Did you try that card with the driver I posted? Does hardware 3d sound buffer work in dxdiag?

Unfortunately, the card I bought is somewhere in one of my retro boxes, and is not immediately available to retest. I'm going to plough through my retro boxes ASAP, and when I stumble upon this Yamaha clone, I'll check it out with your driver download. Also regarding this ebay Yamaha clone card, it came boxed with a driver CD.

Reply 4 of 23, by keropi

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clone as not assembled by Yamaha, it appears to be fine though 😀

🎵 🎧 PCMIDI MPU , OrpheusII , Action Rewind , Megacard and 🎶GoldLib soundcard website

Reply 6 of 23, by WolverineDK

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Varka wrote:

I have an original, working driver CD for the 192XG, which also includes (as I recall) the Yamaha XG soft-synth...

It's around 270 megs of data.

I can upload it somewhere if you'd like.

I actually think you would be appreciated about that here, you could mega upload it, and then you could put it in your signature afterwards with a title like "get the drivers for the soundcard here" or something along those lines.

Reply 8 of 23, by swaaye

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Coolness. 😁

BTW, I think that you can get the fancy MIDI capabilities coimpletely in software with the mysterious, hard-to-find Yamaha S-YXG100 soft synth that only works in 9x. It has that Sondius stuff ( waveguide synthesis or some such).

Reply 9 of 23, by WolverineDK

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Varka wrote:

www.roleplayga.org/download/waveforce192xg.iso

Megaupload only allows up to 200mb download.

This DOES have the SYXG50 software, which is the software midi synthesizer.

Sorry for necro bumping this thread , but it seems to me. That Varka clearly has no idea what he is talking about, and to prove my point, then I have uploaded his iso file to megaupload and now also multi upload.

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=IVA7CBPI (no I do not take the credit away from the original uploader, I am just providing a mirror)

http://www.multiupload.com/787FNHX5YW

Reply 10 of 23, by hifidelitygaming

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Just fyi, there was also a commercially released SYXG-100 midi soft synth which I used at the time (might even have buried somewhere), it was never bundled with any card, but it could also be used to replace the MIDI playback of other software. (I had mine set up to play FF7 on an SW20 card) The sound was even sweeter on the 100, I forget exactly what was different but I remember trying both the -50 and the -100 and the 100 had even nicer sound for a softsynth...

Reply 11 of 23, by feipoa

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I just installed a Yamaha 192XG into my Cyrix MII box after pulling out the Creative Live! card. My chip is marked 724F though, not 724E as yours is. I have the 1040 drivers, same as you, but do not have the Misc or WaveOut options in the configuration box. I noticed that your WaveOut tab has a HiFiMode option. What effect does this have? Could you live without it? Thanks.

Plan your life wisely, you'll be dead before you know it.

Reply 12 of 23, by keropi

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Hi feipoa , is it a "real" 192XG? maybe it is a later model and they cut out on features, like the mic2 or "hifi mode" (that I don't remember making a difference btw, so don't really miss anything)
Both missing features are not anything to to cripple the card , the problems start with newer drivers that do cripple the secondary buffer.

🎵 🎧 PCMIDI MPU , OrpheusII , Action Rewind , Megacard and 🎶GoldLib soundcard website

Reply 13 of 23, by feipoa

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I'm not sure if the one in the socket 7 is a "real" Yamaha card or not. I have three 192XG cards in total, all are in use and one I bought boxed, like in your photo, back in the 90's. I tend to use the Yamaha 192XG cards over newer Creative cards because I find the 192XG cards tend to be more agreeable with other system hardware.

Plan your life wisely, you'll be dead before you know it.

Reply 14 of 23, by boxpressed

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Apologies for the second necrobump, but this thread does seem to be the appropriate one in which to ask this question.

If you use this card (even better if you also use its PC-PCI connector), can you verify whether the hardware wavetable allows you to use GM music in real DOS? I've even read the manual for this card, but there is no information.

I'm talking about the Yamaha Waveforce 192XG, not the many cards that also use the YMF-724 chipset. Apparently, the Waveforce has a 64-voice 2MB ROM set onboard.

Reply 15 of 23, by keropi

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I have never used the PC-PCI feature and I am afraid I no longer have a motherboard to test this... tbh I never used the card in DOS

🎵 🎧 PCMIDI MPU , OrpheusII , Action Rewind , Megacard and 🎶GoldLib soundcard website

Reply 16 of 23, by boxpressed

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keropi wrote:

I have never used the PC-PCI feature and I am afraid I no longer have a motherboard to test this... tbh I never used the card in DOS

Thanks anyway, keropi. If I manage to grab one of these cards, I can test its PC-PCI functionality with GM in real DOS.

Reply 17 of 23, by keropi

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I'll see if I can do a quick test in DOS mode with my p4 build , what game is a tricky one to test?

🎵 🎧 PCMIDI MPU , OrpheusII , Action Rewind , Megacard and 🎶GoldLib soundcard website

Reply 18 of 23, by boxpressed

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I'm hoping that someone else can answer that question. Since I'm guessing that using the Waveforce as a DOS card will require EMM386 anyway, I'd be happy just knowing if GM works with later DOS games (which work fine in a Windows DOS box, I know).

Reply 19 of 23, by Anonymous Coward

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I ran an XG192 back in the day, but mine somehow ended up dying on me. Unfortunately many of the cards with the YMF-724 chipset are budget cards with poor quality control. I heard that Yamaha actually put out their own version of the card, so that would be the card to go for if you can actually find one.

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