VOGONS


First post, by feipoa

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I am in the mist of setting up my first computer newer than a PIII Tualatin. It is the SuperMicro H8SSL-R10, shown here http://www.supermicro.com/Aplus/motherboard/O … 0/H8SSL-R10.cfm

It contains an AMD Opteron 180 (2.4 GHz dual core), 4 GB of dual channel DDR400 memory, dual gigabit ethernet, and 4 SATA ports.

For expansion slots, there is only one 64-bit / 133 MHz PCI-X slot, and two 32-bit / 33 MHz conventional PCI slots. There is also an IPMI slot, which looks like a backwards PCI Express slot. I am not sure what this is for.

I was pretty bummed when my Matrox Parhelia 256 PCI card did not function in the PCI-X slot. There is a jumper which allows for the PCI-X slot to run at 133 MHz / 64-bit, 66 Mhz / 64-bit, or 66 MHz / 32-bit. The Parhelia card did not function with any of these settings, nor did my [conventional] PCI GeForce 6200 cards. I would have at least liked to run a conventional PCI graphics card at 66 MHz, however it is possible that the PCI-X slot on this motherboard will not support graphics cards.

If I was to use this motherboard for modern computing, what would be the most ideal conventional PCI graphics card for it? I've seen the following options on newegg.ca,

Zotac GeForce GT610 512MB 64-bit DDR3 - $64.99
VisionTek Radeon HD 3450 512MB 64-bit DDR2 - $95.63
VisionTek Radeon X1300 256MB 128-Bit GDDR2 - $136.99
JATON Radeon HD 5450 1GB 64-Bit DDR3 - $104.99

but there may be more.

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Reply 1 of 12, by ODwilly

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The GT610 would make a good web browser card. I have a friend who uses a HD5450 card to great effect for HD video playback on a full 1080p TV in a Core2Quad web browser/media center 😀 AFAIK the GT610 at least matches or beats the HD5450 in performance. So even as a 64bit card (such as his) I think the 610 would be a good/cost effective option. Heck my local school district PC's use GMA 4500x graphics which suck and web browse/flash game just fine!

Main pc: AsRock x370 Killer SLI a/c, Ryzen 5 2600, 1tb WD black nvme ssd, 24g ddr4 2400 @2933mhz, rx 480 8gb reference card, 2tb Hitachi Deskstar.
Retro PC: Soyo P4S Dragon, 3gb ddr 266, 120gb Maxtor, Geforce Fx 5950 Ultra, SB Live! 5.1

Reply 2 of 12, by matze79

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Don't forget about these:

http://www.sintech.cn/riser%20card/ST8010%20P … ser%20card.html

https://dosreloaded.de - The German Retro DOS PC Community
https://www.retroianer.de - under constructing since ever

Co2 - for a endless Summer

Reply 3 of 12, by feipoa

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Any reports of success using that adapter with a graphics card? Seems like I've seen a similar PCI-X to PCIe adapter as well.

Ultimate 486 Benchmark | Ultimate 686 Benchmark | Cyrix 5x86 Enhancements | 486 Overkill Graphics | Worlds Fastest 486

Reply 4 of 12, by udam_u

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feipoa wrote:

I was pretty bummed when my Matrox Parhelia 256 PCI card did not function in the PCI-X slot. There is a jumper which allows for the PCI-X slot to run at 133 MHz / 64-bit, 66 Mhz / 64-bit, or 66 MHz / 32-bit. The Parhelia card did not function with any of these settings, nor did my [conventional] PCI GeForce 6200 cards. I would have at least liked to run a conventional PCI graphics card at 66 MHz, however it is possible that the PCI-X slot on this motherboard will not support graphics cards.

Hello feipoa,

I used to use Parhelia 256 PCI on MSI K7d Master - L (64bit 66MHz PCI, AMD 760MPX chipset) and my friend used it on Tyan dual opteron motherboard based on AMD 8000 series chipset - both without any flaws.

Have you tried to disable onboard graphics card (jumper on motherboard)? Do you have installed the latest bios?

feipoa wrote:
If I was to use this motherboard for modern computing, what would be the most ideal conventional PCI graphics card for it? I've […]
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If I was to use this motherboard for modern computing, what would be the most ideal conventional PCI graphics card for it? I've seen the following options on newegg.ca,

Zotac GeForce GT610 512MB 64-bit DDR3 - $64.99
VisionTek Radeon HD 3450 512MB 64-bit DDR2 - $95.63
VisionTek Radeon X1300 256MB 128-Bit GDDR2 - $136.99
JATON Radeon HD 5450 1GB 64-Bit DDR3 - $104.99

but there may be more.

Your motherboard is very interesting from the point of view of the collector (rare Serverworks chipset used only on high end motherboards) but it can be very frustrating to use it for modern computing (the worst thing is lack of PCI-E). New graphics chips forced to work with old bus (like PCI) have always poor drivers that can cause compatibility and stability problems on some platforms.

If I were you I would focus on another motherboard (it has PCI-E so you can install any modern graphics card, old 32bit PCI and works with plain DDR3 memory):
http://www.supermicro.nl/Aplus/motherboard/Op … 6x0/H8SGL-F.cfm
In my opinion this is great motherboard for Vogons user who is looking for something extraordinary in good price.
CPUs for G34 platform are very cheap these days. For example you can buy 12 core Opteron 6164 (TDP only 85W) for ~50$! ^^

What doesn't kill you makes you stronger.
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Reply 5 of 12, by feipoa

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udam_u, it has been a very long time since I've seen you on. Welcome back!

Why did you stop using the Parhelia 256 PCI on your MSI K7d Master board? What did you end up doing with the card and motherboard? Do you have any benchmark results for this combination?

I showed in another thread, Matrox Parhelia 256 PCI-X Performance , that using the Parhelia in a conventional PCI slot, as opposed to a PCI-X slot, actually increased the performance results in 3DMark2001SE. Excerpt: "With the Parhelia in the PCI-X slot, the score was 3854. With the Parhelia in the conventional PCI slot, the score was 4580." I am not sure if this incident was specific to that system or not.

Yes, I tried to disable the onboard graphics using the motherboard's jumper. Yes, latest BIOS was installed. I sent a complaint e-mail to SuperMicro requesting a possible BIOS update, however I doubt they will return my inquiry.

I have the board, CPU, and RAM so I didn't really want to consider buying another motherboard. I am not ready to transition away from my dual Tualatin to something newer yet, but am in the process of setting up the said system for fun and to see how well I will tolerate the transition. The possible lack of compatibility for newer graphics cards on conventional PCI cards is a concern small concern. If it doesn't work, I can return the card.

The SuperMicro board that you refernece is interesting in that it contains a Matrox G200 as the integrated graphics choice. While there may be several other examples, this is the first such example of an integrated G200 I have seen. I am surprised considering the new age of the motherboard.

Ultimate 486 Benchmark | Ultimate 686 Benchmark | Cyrix 5x86 Enhancements | 486 Overkill Graphics | Worlds Fastest 486

Reply 6 of 12, by udam_u

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feipoa wrote:

udam_u, it has been a very long time since I've seen you on. Welcome back!

Thank you! I am very happy that you are still active on this forum. (:

feipoa wrote:

Why did you stop using the Parhelia 256 PCI on your MSI K7d Master board? What did you end up doing with the card and motherboard? Do you have any benchmark results for this combination?

I showed in another thread, Matrox Parhelia 256 PCI-X Performance , that using the Parhelia in a conventional PCI slot, as opposed to a PCI-X slot, actually increased the performance results in 3DMark2001SE. Excerpt: "With the Parhelia in the PCI-X slot, the score was 3854. With the Parhelia in the conventional PCI slot, the score was 4580." I am not sure if this incident was specific to that system or not.

I still have K7d Master-L rig (2x Athlon MP2800, 3GB RAM, LSI SCSI 320 controller with 256MB cache, 2x Seagate 15k 300GB HDD, Quadro 4000 graphics card) but don't use it as my primary rig.
I had to replace it in 2013 after I had bought digital camera and needed faster machine for smoother work with RAW photos.

Parhelia was my favourite video card for long time...It has excellent video output quality (thanks to Matrox ultimate filters and 10 bit per channel color processing).
What a pity its great spec wasn't correlated with real world application performance.
I did a lot of Parhelia tests because I always wondered why this great card wasn't as fast as it should be - some part of graphics pipeline must be a bootleneck (I read some articles indicating slow triangle setup engine).
I stopped using Parhelia after I had broken up one small smd capacitor during vacuuming of PC
After cleaning the card has never shown any image (I tried replacing missing capacitor).
This reminds me the story I read on Polish forum few years ago.
Young man want to replace thermal paste and scratched graphics card PCB while trying to remove cooler.Graphics card refused to work and boy went to bed in hope that this is only bad dream and when he wake up everything will be ok.
I felt the same... [: Happily my brother few months ago acquired new Parhelia 256 PCI on flea market, but I haven't tested it yet.I am going to check card till end of next week (I am currently not home) and if everything will be ok I'm also going to perform 32 vs 64bit PCI performance test on K7D master-L. (:

feipoa wrote:

Yes, I tried to disable the onboard graphics using the motherboard's jumper. Yes, latest BIOS was installed. I sent a complaint e-mail to SuperMicro requesting a possible BIOS update, however I doubt they will return my inquiry.

I have the board, CPU, and RAM so I didn't really want to consider buying another motherboard. I am not ready to transition away from my dual Tualatin to something newer yet, but am in the process of setting up the said system for fun and to see how well I will tolerate the transition. The possible lack of compatibility for newer graphics cards on conventional PCI cards is a concern small concern. If it doesn't work, I can return the card.

Parhelia 256 PCI utilise PLX chip to bridge AGP interface to PCI (I guess GF 6200 uses similar chip).
I have very bad experience with graphics cards (Radeon X800XL, X800GTO, HD3850) that use PCI-E to AGP bridge on motherboards with AMD 760MPX chipset (MSI K7d Master, Asus A7M266-D). Graphics cards just refuse to boot to WinXp with dual CPU installed. I don't have this problem when using graphics cards with native AGP support (Radeon 800XT, GF6800).
Maybe you encounter similar problems on your motherboard.

BTW You are the greatest fan of Dual PIII I have ever known. (: I remember story of your computer (it was king of the hill when you bought it). I was also very attached to my Athlon MP rig which was on duty for 10 years so I understand you 100%.

feipoa wrote:

The SuperMicro board that you refernece is interesting in that it contains a Matrox G200 as the integrated graphics choice. While there may be several other examples, this is the first such example of an integrated G200 I have seen. I am surprised considering the new age of the motherboard.

I was also very surprised when I saw this first time but G200 is not placed as a separate chip on motherboard - it is a part of Nuvoton SoC IPMI 2.0 chip which is used to provide remote control of computer (probably Matrox sold G200 as IP core).
It seems that you can add IPMI functionality to your motherboard by installing some extension card. (:

What doesn't kill you makes you stronger.
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Reply 9 of 12, by udam_u

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Matth79 wrote:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/EVGA-8800GTS-512MB-PC … =item2801d428d5#
Is this correct - did they make one in PCI-X ?

This is mistake - GeForce 8800GTS is PCI-E 16x card.

What doesn't kill you makes you stronger.
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Reply 10 of 12, by matze79

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feiopa:
I use a 8400GS 256Mb PCIe in a Dual Coppermine on a PCIe to PCI Adapter,
even a 8800GT 512Mb works 😀

https://dosreloaded.de - The German Retro DOS PC Community
https://www.retroianer.de - under constructing since ever

Co2 - for a endless Summer

Reply 11 of 12, by feipoa

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matze79, what OS and do you have benchmark results which compare it to the regular PCI and AGP cards of a similar era? Do you use that computer for everyday computing? What is its function? Any bugs to note with the adapter? Where did you source it and at what cost? Have you tried any of these modern GPU-accelerated video tests with it on supporting graphic cards?

udamn_u, you are the first user I've seen to actually use a Parhelia PCI-X card in a PCI-X slot for everyday use. Perhaps the vacuuming caused some release of static electricity which fried some other IC's. I'm looking forward to your PCI 64-bit vs. 32-bit for the Parhelia. I'm still chugging away with my dual Tualatin box. I suspect that once Firefox ceases browser updates for this OS and hardware that I'll move onto a more modern computer for everyday use, probably the Operton 180.

Ultimate 486 Benchmark | Ultimate 686 Benchmark | Cyrix 5x86 Enhancements | 486 Overkill Graphics | Worlds Fastest 486

Reply 12 of 12, by ODwilly

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The Opteron 180 is a good chip. Iv got a system setup for my mom with an Opteron 170 and a 8600gt 256mb card combined with 3gb of DDR 333. It web browses like a freaking boss! My one suggestion is to combine it with a good SSD, it will fully saturate SATA 1.5 and you will be pretty dang happy 😀 combine that with the 610 or HD5450 an you have a solid daily driver. Also a good copy of Windows 7 or Linux of course!

Main pc: AsRock x370 Killer SLI a/c, Ryzen 5 2600, 1tb WD black nvme ssd, 24g ddr4 2400 @2933mhz, rx 480 8gb reference card, 2tb Hitachi Deskstar.
Retro PC: Soyo P4S Dragon, 3gb ddr 266, 120gb Maxtor, Geforce Fx 5950 Ultra, SB Live! 5.1