VOGONS


First post, by jforrest1980

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I have an old 98se rig I built from a converted xp machine a few years back. It was my first legacy build/conversion, hence it's not that great.

Basically I want to start anew. Problem is when looking on eBay for old pentium III boards im not exactly sure how to know what the good boards are. Most of them are old Dell boards, which I hear won't mount in anything but a Dell case. Are Dells the only ones with custom mounting holes? How do you tell the crap Dell etc.. boards from the ones people would have purchased new to build a gaming rig?

Maybe I'm worrying too much because I bought a Soundblaster Live! On accident that was not labeled as a Dell, but was a dell. I don't want to be in that boat again with a motherboard purchase. I want something I can locate drivers, or the install disc for easily online.

I'm just looking for something with an ISA slot I can throw a Pentium 3 in, a good sound card, and 1 or 2 Voodoo 2's.

So popular motherboards easily found on ebay, or basic ebay search tips would be much appreciated.

Thank You.

Reply 1 of 13, by dexvx

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IMO, most abundant and compatible solution would probably be 440BX. Asus or Intel are good quality. You'd have to search the reviews of yesteryear (e.g. '440BX roundup'), where reviewers would review dozens of 440BX boards and you get the low down of each one. Then go to eBay and search for those model numbers.

Like this one Intel SE440BX new.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/INTEL-SE440BX-2-MOTHE … B-/391696981003

Or this Asus P3B-F combo
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Asus-P3B-F-MOTHERBOAR … I-/262889817319

Reply 2 of 13, by Rhuwyn

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Search ebay is more of an art then a science. There are people that describe things well, and people that describe things poorly. Some people make sure the item is in all the correct categories some times you have a video card that someone things is a motherboard. Some descriptions are nothing more then "bunch of old parts".

One of the great features of ebay is the ability to follow searches. IF there are some very specific parts you are interested in that aren't listed all the time you can setup a search to notify you when something matches your keywords. I find this is great for find things very specific things from sellers that actually describe their auctions well.

After that here are some other things I do.
*Search entire component categories without any key words sort by price+shipping lowest and see what you can find.
*Search for phrases like "old parts" "part lot" "video card lot" etc.
*If your looking for a general type of part search generically by its features or chipset..like "slot 1" "slot A" "3dfx" "Geforce 4" "44BX" whatever.

You would be surprised how many pages of auctions you can go through pretty quickly even when you search generically. I like to scoop up whatever I can get cheap generally.

Reply 3 of 13, by jforrest1980

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Thanks for the help guys.

I think I need help knowing how you determine if a motherboard is a good one, ex. Determining a motherboard is a dell or other board that has custom company features, when the auction doesn't state it.

What kind of stuff do you look for that lets you determine that?

I feel like a lot of sellers knowingly list these heavily manufactured name brand boards and components without disclosing it. Knowing good and well the board will only fit in a dell case, or the dell drivers will be impossible to find.

Reply 4 of 13, by Malvineous

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For eBay searches what I like to do is get a search that shows what I want - for example searching the vintage computer category for "-amiga -atari -apple -c64 -commodore" and so on, to remove everything I know I am not interested in, so that hopefully what's left is what I want (also including those "old computer parts" type listings that you need to see for yourself.) Then I add "&_rss=1" onto the end of the URL to get the search results in the form of an RSS feed, and I subscribe to that in my RSS reader. Since I already check my other RSS feeds daily, this means every day I see whatever has been newly listed in the last day or so, which means I never miss anything. It also allows me to snap up those rare 'buy it now' listings where something is very cheaply priced, even though I may not have been specifically looking for that part.

I also add RSS feeds to my reader for certain keywords and price ranges without specifying a category, so I can pick up things that are listed outside the normal categories - for example the ATX motherboards that can sell quite cheaply because they're listed in the industrial electronics category. Adding the price restriction (e.g. max $40) automatically screens out items I consider overpriced so I don't waste time sorting through them.

As for finding a good motherboard, familiarise yourself with the typical ATX layout. Most of the nonstandard motherboards you want to avoid have the I/O ports in funny places instead of the usual ATX cluster (typically only one row high and spread right across the back of the board), and often they have a riser card to stop the case being so tall, which means they have one big slot instead of multiple PCI, ISA and AGP slots.

Getting Dell stuff isn't as bad as it used to be. You can now buy adapters to allow normal ATX power supplies to plug in to those Dell motherboards that had a non-standard ATX connector, and I've seen converter cables that provide standard AC97 front panel connectors from the custom one on the Dell Sound Blaster Live. The only real issue is making sure you get one that's ATX and not one of their proprietary form factors, unless it comes in the case as well. One good thing about Dell is that all their chipset drivers are still online. I think Intel's are as well, but some other manufacturers are starting to remove the drivers for their older boards.

As others have said, the best bet is to find out the brand. If it's a brand that sold motherboards back in the day (Abit, Asus, Intel, Gigabyte, etc, etc.) then you'll probably be fine. Intel boards can be hard to identify as they typically aren't branded, but if you can find a model number that starts with AA then it's probably Intel. If there are grid references as well (A, B, C, etc. down one edge, and 1, 2, 3 across the other edge) then it's almost certainly Intel.

My personal preference is to go Intel where I can, because they were always the most reliable boards. Abit and Asus had a better reputation for overclocking, but to me overclocking a retro PC is a bit pointless because I could just get newer/faster parts instead. But since retro machines can be tricky to get going - they seem to get less reliable with age - I figure if you start with the most reliable parts to begin with, it will bring you less pain in the long run!

Reply 5 of 13, by 386DX40

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I have built a few Pentium III retro rigs for myself and friends using this specific 'standard ATX' motherboard:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/718020-002-GATEWAY-71 … VcAAOSwTM5YzXfL

This was used in a ton of Gateway systems, is an Intel board with Japanese capacitors, and can run Coppermine Slot 1 CPUs with the P14 BIOS. I run P3 750MHz/100MHz CPUs in all my builds along with a single 256MB PC100/PC133 memory stick and a Voodoo 3 3000 AGP with a SoundBlaster AWE64 ISA sound card. I use either 40GB or 80GB IDE hard drives as well. Power supply is usually an Antec Basiq BP430 430W in some type of fairly cheap new black ATX case.

If running a CPU with an aftermarket fan you probably will have to leave the CPU retention bracket off the motherboard since the capacitors are very close to the slot and can interfere with the fan mounting mechanism on the CPU if the retention bracket is installed. All my builds are not using the retention bracket because of this issue and have had no problems.

Latest BIOS: https://panam.gateway.com/support/drivers/get … 4&uid=520526072

Something to consider.

Reply 7 of 13, by brostenen

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I search for something with 440bx or Slot1 or K6-II or Socket370 in a phraze. Refine the search with other words.
Mostly that way around. It might not be the best way, as I allways find stuff that are bloody expensive.

Don't eat stuff off a 15 year old never cleaned cpu cooler.
Those cakes make you sick....

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Reply 8 of 13, by nforce4max

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To be honest there is almost too many boards but like everyone said just avoid the Dell Hell and you will be ok, the other oem boards are pretty safe except that most are low end but stable plus most are dirt cheap even the SS7 boards if people ever wised up to look. For socket A, 423, and 478 the pickings are still good but the high end boards are naturally getting to be expensive as more people yolo them wanting a "high end" 9x experience.

Socket 370 = dirt cheap and plenty of oem fodder that works in normal atx (Avoid Dell)
SS7 = still a few out there cheap but you have to learn how to spot them and many don't have an agp slot but still accept K6 2+ and K6 3+
Slot 1 = more and more people are buying so demand is up but some slip through for chicken feed on bid
Slot A (AMD) = hard to come by but still a few
Slot 2 Xeon = Rare and only for a small few out there wanting a cool flavor
Socket A = still cheap but good coolers are uncommon
Socket 423 = An interesting and slower flavor of pentium 4 so not for everyone and is the last of the agp 3.3v compatibles if you know what to look for (Hint its the VIA and SIS boards)
Socket 478 = may as well get out the snow shovel as they are still that common in some parts of the world (some use the same 3.3v agp chipsets as some of the 423 boards but rare)
Socket 775 = Limit 9x support but it has been done and there are drivers out there
Socket 754 and 939 = last of the AMD that has full support for 9x

On a far away planet reading your posts in the year 10,191.

Reply 9 of 13, by jforrest1980

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386DX40 wrote:

If running a CPU with an aftermarket fan you probably will have to leave the CPU retention bracket off the motherboard since the capacitors are very close to the slot and can interfere with the fan mounting mechanism on the CPU if the retention bracket is installed. All my builds are not using the retention bracket because of this issue and have had no problems.

Thanks everyone! Your input has been INCREDIBLY helpful, and informative.

I'm going to go with the INTEL SE440BX-2 MOTHERBOARD linked in the first response.

Here is the processor I am looking at.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/142314669443?_trksid= … K%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

Would it be OK for this board, or is there a better option? I am finding it difficult to determine exactly if the processors I am looking at on eBay will work, due to lack of information. I am pretty certain this is a Pentium III 1000 Coppermine SL5QV with a 100Mhz Bus to comply with what the front of the motherboard box says.

Also, how would I locate a fan/heatsink for this processor? Is there a common reliable one that works for a slot 1?

Thanks again for all the help.

Reply 10 of 13, by candle_86

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That CPU is Socket 370 and your board is Slot 1, so you would need a slocket, easier to just grab a 370 board

I'd go this route
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Asus-Tuv4x-motherboar … dsAAOSwjDZYglhA

Comes with a Chip which has an ISF so chances are its a 1ghz+ tutalin based and the board is very nice, and thats a steal for it

Reply 11 of 13, by valnar

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Well, the ultimate WIn98 machine with a tie to the past (ISA slot) would be a 440BX chipset from Intel, specifically the ASUS P2B series of motherboards.

Buy yourself a Powerleap PL-IP3/T adapter and you can get up to a PIII Tualatin 1.4Ghz CPU, more than enough for any Win98 game ever invented.

Reply 12 of 13, by jforrest1980

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candle_86 wrote:
That CPU is Socket 370 and your board is Slot 1, so you would need a slocket, easier to just grab a 370 board […]
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That CPU is Socket 370 and your board is Slot 1, so you would need a slocket, easier to just grab a 370 board

I'd go this route
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Asus-Tuv4x-motherboar … dsAAOSwjDZYglhA

Comes with a Chip which has an ISF so chances are its a 1ghz+ tutalin based and the board is very nice, and thats a steal for it

OK. I was confused. On the pentium iii wiki page that processor is listed as slot 1 and 370. I wasnt aware they are different. Thanks for that. Checking out that link now.

Reply 13 of 13, by feipoa

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Buy the Dell with the case. The Dell Precision Workstation 410 was an awesome dual PIII based on the Intel 440BX chipset.

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