VOGONS


First post, by haker120

User metadata
Rank Member
Rank
Member

Hello everyone. I've build PC mainly for DOS games that can be slow down for 386 and 486 games but I have no idea which processor will be better for this configuration, Pi200 or Pi200MMX? I know Pi266MMX will be too fast so I don't consider it at all. This is my actuall setting:
Processor: Pentium 200MMX
Mobo: ASUS TX97 - XE
Graphic 2D: S3 Trio 64 V+ 4MB
Graphic 3D: Voodoo Graphics 4MB
RAM: 128MB RAM
Sound: SoundBlaster AWE64 CT4500

My questions are:
1. Should I replace processor? I have Pi200 and Pi200MMX?
2. I'd like to connect SoundCanvas, mainly for Doom but which one should I buy and how to connect?
3. Should I replace SoundBlaster AWE64 on Gold model/different one or this one is good enough?
4. DOS only or DOS and win98SE?

Reply 1 of 20, by Deksor

User metadata
Rank l33t
Rank
l33t

First of all : reduce your ram quantity to 64MB : your chipset can't cache more than that amount of ram, and there are no games that'll require that amount of ram that will play good on a pentium mmx, and there are literally no DOS games requiering that amount of ram.

I never looked at this, but aren't there pentium mmx cpus where you can change on the fly the frequency or something like that ?

Your sound card seems good enough, though since you want to play older DOS games, you may want to have a real OPL 3 chip, and there are no AWE64 available that provides an opl3 chip. You may be interested in buying a sound blaster pro, or some clone of it (like a ymf719 card) and to put it next to the awe64.

That computer deserves windows imo, with a voodoo 1 you'll be able to play early 3D windows games

Trying to identify old hardware ? Visit The retro web - Project's thread The Retro Web project - a stason.org/TH99 alternative

Reply 2 of 20, by Munx

User metadata
Rank Oldbie
Rank
Oldbie

What sort of games are you building this for? Because only a few DOS games need that sort of hardware, like Blood in 640x480. Some other DOS games will start running into problems with CPUs clocked this high CPU sensitive games list here

Also, Like Deksor mentioned before, firstly reduce you RAM, since you motherboard can't handle it all properly.

To me this looks more like an early Windows rig to play Quake 1/2 on, rather than a DOS PC.

My builds!
The FireStarter 2.0 - The wooden K5
The Underdog - The budget K6
The Voodoo powerhouse - The power-hungry K7
The troll PC - The Socket 423 Pentium 4

Reply 3 of 20, by keropi

User metadata
Rank l33t++
Rank
l33t++

My main DOS pc is a 233mmx since I also want something to handle games like Blood and not crawl.
ICACHE is a great tool to kill (and re-enable later) L1 cache on the fly so the system drops down to 386DX speeds. So unless you want to play really old xt-era games then your 200mmx will be just fine and have the extra juice for the late dos 3d games.

More slowdown is possible with tools like moslo btw

🎵 🎧 PCMIDI MPU , OrpheusII , Action Rewind , Megacard and 🎶GoldLib soundcard website

Reply 4 of 20, by clueless1

User metadata
Rank l33t
Rank
l33t

Agree with the other two. Reduce RAM unless you plan on spending lots of time in Win9x. If you won't be running Win9x at all, then you can safely drop to 32MB. There are a few DOS games that don't like systems with too much RAM. Usually you can control that by throttling used EMS in your EMM386 line.

The Sound Canvas route is pretty expensive if you don't already have one. You may be better off getting a Sound Blaster Pro compatible card and a DreamBlaster X2 daughterboard. YMF-719 and ESS Audiodrive are both great options.

The P200MMX supports test registers, which means you can use Setmul to slow the cpu down from the command line with many more options than a regular Pentium. See the cachebench thread in my signature.

The more I learn, the more I realize how much I don't know.
OPL3 FM vs. Roland MT-32 vs. General MIDI DOS Game Comparison
Let's benchmark our systems with cache disabled
DOS PCI Graphics Card Benchmarks

Reply 5 of 20, by haker120

User metadata
Rank Member
Rank
Member

Thanks guys, actually I thought I have too much RAM, I took of one 64MB off so I have 64MB and well, from what I understood my processor is more than fine and as for music card, Any Sound Blaster 16 will be okay? And all this time I was slowing down my processor by turning off mobo cache and processor's cache in BIOS. xD Thanks for answers! Also, is SC-55 model 2 for 100$ a good deal? No cables included though.

I forgot to add, mainly I play DOOM games, Monkey's Island, Duke Nukem games, basicly IS Software games, from older games Larry that is too fast for me. And in win98 mode I play some newer games like Rayman 2, Shogo and Tomb Raider games.

Reply 6 of 20, by chinny22

User metadata
Rank l33t++
Rank
l33t++

1) The speed issue gets mentioned a lot but in the end it only affects a small % of games.
I would recommend trying the games out for yourself, as even that list Munx gave makes it seem worse then it is.
For example I'm familiar with both the Warcrafts issues but it doesn't really affect gameplay, and really if a game is too fast on a P200, it wont matter if its MMX or not.

2) Any you can find for a good price. There was a post somewhere here with the difference and any games that benefited from one or another but was only 1 or 2 games, the vast majority including doom sounded the same no matter which one you had, Not sure on currant prices, Power cables are on ebay so just factor that cost in, Midi cables are cheep, its normal for them not to be included

You would attach it to the gameport of your soundcard. AWE64 is one of the better Creative cards for this (no hanging note bug)

3) AWE64 is good allrounder, basically its a SB16 with better music support. Some games sound really good, others sound better with Midi, and in the end it's all down to personal taste, and of course if you do get a Midi module you have the choice of both.
Phil did a recent video, its not the exact same card but close enough https://youtu.be/2Cr0XFNls9k

4) Win9x makes system management easy, the inbuilt Dos7 is fine for gamming and supports fat32 so not limited to 2GB partitions, you can also squeeze a bit more memory then you can with 6.22
http://www.mdgx.com/mem7.htm

Reply 7 of 20, by haker120

User metadata
Rank Member
Rank
Member

Thanks for all advices but now I have this in 3D games. Can I fix it somehow?

Attachments

  • 20171231_152644.jpg
    Filename
    20171231_152644.jpg
    File size
    1.55 MiB
    Views
    689 views
    File license
    Fair use/fair dealing exception
  • 20171231_144121.jpg
    Filename
    20171231_144121.jpg
    File size
    2.04 MiB
    Views
    689 views
    File license
    Fair use/fair dealing exception

Reply 8 of 20, by Deksor

User metadata
Rank l33t
Rank
l33t

That doesn't look good, your voodoo card might be defective unfortunately ...

Trying to identify old hardware ? Visit The retro web - Project's thread The Retro Web project - a stason.org/TH99 alternative

Reply 10 of 20, by chinny22

User metadata
Rank l33t++
Rank
l33t++

if you plug the screen direct into the voodoo?
You may get lucky and just be the pass-through cable

Reply 11 of 20, by Munx

User metadata
Rank Oldbie
Rank
Oldbie

Nah that's not the cable, it's the card.

Are you familiar with v1tweek? Use it to downclock your Voodoo to something like 45 Mhz and see if that helps.

My builds!
The FireStarter 2.0 - The wooden K5
The Underdog - The budget K6
The Voodoo powerhouse - The power-hungry K7
The troll PC - The Socket 423 Pentium 4

Reply 13 of 20, by Munx

User metadata
Rank Oldbie
Rank
Oldbie

Yes. This means the problem is either with the drivers or other piece of hardware.

My builds!
The FireStarter 2.0 - The wooden K5
The Underdog - The budget K6
The Voodoo powerhouse - The power-hungry K7
The troll PC - The Socket 423 Pentium 4

Reply 15 of 20, by Munx

User metadata
Rank Oldbie
Rank
Oldbie

98se supposedly fixed tons of bugs that 98 had, so I'd go for it.

My builds!
The FireStarter 2.0 - The wooden K5
The Underdog - The budget K6
The Voodoo powerhouse - The power-hungry K7
The troll PC - The Socket 423 Pentium 4

Reply 16 of 20, by haker120

User metadata
Rank Member
Rank
Member

Thanks, now I'm installing win98SE but my mobo doesn't want to run bootable disc, just spits failure but I've run installer from floppy. I regret I didn't ask earlier for help. xD
Now what Voodoo drivers should I install? The rest drivers don't cause problems.

Reply 17 of 20, by Munx

User metadata
Rank Oldbie
Rank
Oldbie

Go with 3.00.01 (second to latest drivers). The latest ones (3.01.00) allegedly have slightly reduced performance.

My builds!
The FireStarter 2.0 - The wooden K5
The Underdog - The budget K6
The Voodoo powerhouse - The power-hungry K7
The troll PC - The Socket 423 Pentium 4

Reply 19 of 20, by gdjacobs

User metadata
Rank l33t++
Rank
l33t++
clueless1 wrote:

Agree with the other two. Reduce RAM unless you plan on spending lots of time in Win9x. If you won't be running Win9x at all, then you can safely drop to 32MB. There are a few DOS games that don't like systems with too much RAM. Usually you can control that by throttling used EMS in your EMM386 line.

The Sound Canvas route is pretty expensive if you don't already have one. You may be better off getting a Sound Blaster Pro compatible card and a DreamBlaster X2 daughterboard. YMF-719 and ESS Audiodrive are both great options.

The P200MMX supports test registers, which means you can use Setmul to slow the cpu down from the command line with many more options than a regular Pentium. See the cachebench thread in my signature.

Plus you can wire up toggles for FSB and/or multi for even more flexibility. Depending on your choice of low clock, you can have smooth options throughout the envelope down to mid 386 levels.

All hail the Great Capacitor Brand Finder