VOGONS


First post, by Vaudane

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So my old 386 came up, and I was showing off pictures of it. Waxing lyrical about how the 30+ year old 80 MB hard drive has zero errors, bad sectors or other damage despite not having lived a blessed life. So I start discussing the whopping 2 MB ram of the thing when one of the people I am showing states

"It's a pile of junk"

"It's a computer older than you are that works as well as the day it was built... 😕 😕 "

"yes, doing very little."

There are some that don't understand the preservation of history and admiring it in regards to the timeframe it was built, nor building for nostalgia or other reasons personal to yourself.

Just took me off guard.

Reply 1 of 58, by Warlord

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people have different interests. There are more people that collect antiques for the same reason, there is a show called American Pickers, tons of restoration shows on TV etc. People just collect different things for different reasons, and then other people don't care hold sentimental value to anything and live in a throw away lifestyle.

While theres other people who actually fix things and own tools and are smart about repairs and are handymen or mechanics, then there are other people that would starve to death without a microwave becasue they don't cook and only go out to eat and what not. Just be thankful you are not a total idiot like most people, becasue the average person is dumb. And being average is not average even its basically below average since the bar is so low every other person out there is a total moron at least 50% of the population.

All of that said not everything that is old is really valuable. There are a lot of 386 computers out there, but its like everything else only top tier items hold value, its why graphics cards that are the highest end old ones like TI series or notoriously good ones hold value while other ones are a dime a dozen. Same thing with cars, a car with the racing package like a old mustang will be worth more than the base model.

Reply 2 of 58, by Anonymous Coward

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F*#k normies!

"Will the highways on the internets become more few?" -Gee Dubya
V'Ger XT|Upgraded AT|Ultimate 386|Super VL/EISA 486|SMP VL/EISA Pentium

Reply 6 of 58, by Mister Xiado

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I'm not particularly interested in antique televisions, but I can appreciate people's fondness for the classic sets from the early days of the technology. I admire the craftsmanship that went into their engineering and outward design, so I can see why others would have an affinity for them. I don't like green peppers, but I respect them, and don't think that they have no merit. I recognize that others may enjoy them a great deal. It takes some degree of mental maturity to recognize the feelings of others, and that their minds are whole separate perceptions of reality. Also, I could hardly call myself an archivist, and collect classic computers, video games and firearms if I dismissed others' passions for relics and such.
With that said, it's rather vogue these days to be ignorant. There's no guarantee of success and wealth for those going into STEM fields, so hardcore programmers and electronic engineers are becoming fewer and farther between. The days of the basement programmer hacking out masterpieces to be saved on a re-purposed cassette or floppy, surrounded by stacks of spiral bound manuals, and spiral notebooks, are pretty much gone. People barely know how to cook, sew, perform simple vehicle maintenance such as changing one's oil and filters, grow a vegetable garden, or pretty much any practical skill that used to be taken for granted.
Without getting too dour, it's not impossible to find others who share your passions. I mean, there's this site. And... uh.... hmm. But never mind that! Find your happiness in life, as there's no reward for being miserable. You just get used to feeling miserable, and it becomes your new default mood. You should avoid that at all cost.

I asked all of my coworkers, friends, and relatives to keep an eye out for old computers and other tech for me. Fifteen years, and not a single report from any of them. 😒

b_ldnt2.gif - Where it's always 1995.
Icons, wallpapers, and typical Oldternet nonsense.

Reply 7 of 58, by Anonymous Coward

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The thing that pisses me off is that during the 80s and much of the 90s, you were tagged as a dork and socially outcast if you were into computers. These days you'll find that every jock douchebag is glued to their screen. These people don't deserve the access to modern technology for their past sins. I say anyone belittling vintage computers ought to have their phones and laptops confiscated.

"Will the highways on the internets become more few?" -Gee Dubya
V'Ger XT|Upgraded AT|Ultimate 386|Super VL/EISA 486|SMP VL/EISA Pentium

Reply 8 of 58, by Mister Xiado

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Anonymous Coward wrote:

The thing that pisses me off is that during the 80s and much of the 90s, you were tagged as a dork and socially outcast if you were into computers.

I deleted what I was typing about that initially, but basically, there has been an engineered campaign of anti-intellectualism in the west since shortly after World War II. You saw it in movies and TV shows, which just reinforced the "nerds vs jocks/cool kids" BS that you would then deal with in school. Like computers? Geek. Like video games? Nintendo freak. Like "chy-neese cartoons"? Loser. Just plain intelligent and don't have trouble picking up new concepts? Stuck up nerd. Some have said this is why people who ran tech companies would treat their subordinates like crap. The shoe was on the other foot, and it was now time to get some field goal kicks in for all of those pantsings and swirlies. Now it's "cool" to play video games and spend all day staring at a screen, but people want that retro-nerd-cred, so they make up stories about being harassed for playing games, like they were ever beaten in the back of the head with the spine of a textbook for talking about Super Mario Brothers between classes. ¬_¬

b_ldnt2.gif - Where it's always 1995.
Icons, wallpapers, and typical Oldternet nonsense.

Reply 9 of 58, by TheMobRules

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Anonymous Coward wrote:

The thing that pisses me off is that during the 80s and much of the 90s, you were tagged as a dork and socially outcast if you were into computers. These days you'll find that every jock douchebag is glued to their screen. These people don't deserve the access to modern technology for their past sins. I say anyone belittling vintage computers ought to have their phones and laptops confiscated.

This is so true, and I feel that ironically those people went on to become more dependent on their phones/tablets than those of us with a certain understanding of how they work. And it's not just the laymen, working in the software engineering field I noticed that there is a growing amount of people in this line of work that have no real interest in tinkering with computers or knowing about their history, as strange as it may sound. For them, the PC/laptop is just a mysterious black box.

It's curious that the more advanced technology gets, the less technically interested people become. I mostly blame the industry as current electronic devices go to great lengths to discourage tinkerers (just compare Apple in Wozniak's era to what it is now), luckily there are many communities that arose to address this, but it's difficult to get the massive exposure.

Reply 10 of 58, by VileR

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That's really not surprising. Computing has simply become friendly and accessible by degrees, so that the barrier to entry is now low enough for everyone. One does not need technical proficiency to get in on the action, and this has the usual outcome of all such equalizing forces. As a buddy of mine has put it, one thing about being into computing in the pre-internet/smartphone age was that "you met very few idiots".

Of course, the other side of the coin is what happens when newly-empowered geeks/nerds/outcasts gain the opportunity and the means to reshape the world of others in their own mental image. I daresay we would've been better off if Zuck, Dorsey, and others like them had not known the atomic wedgie in their youths. 😉

[ WEB ] - [ BLOG ] - [ TUBE ] - [ CODE ]

Reply 12 of 58, by derSammler

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There are some that don't understand the preservation of history

Well, let's be fair and accept that the average 386 PC (and not just that) was build from standard parts and has no place in history. The only 386 really relevant for preservation is the original Compaq Deskpro 386 from 1986, as that was the first 386 ever released and is in line with the IBM 5150, 5160, and 5170. Clones don't really matter, even if WE have a nostalgic feeling for them.

Last edited by derSammler on 2019-08-26, 10:28. Edited 1 time in total.

Reply 13 of 58, by SpectriaForce

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I think that for most people old pc's are simply e-waste.

If you share your passions, opinions or possessions online, then you can get all sorts of reactions about it. Unfortunately there are even folks out there (including on this forum) who feel the need to express their frustrations (usually caused by their own troubles in life) and who will try to make you look ridiculous.

Apart from this, I think that not everything old computer related should be 'preserved for future generations'. In my country now several computer museums and private collectors are active, that preserve all kinds of old computer related stuff, so I don't see the need for any more. Realistically most people are not interested at all in old computers. *off topic alert* Even most people who work in IT nowadays have very little if any interest in old computers / technology / software. 'Most' people in IT work for the big pay checks, not because they are passionate about what they do.

Last edited by SpectriaForce on 2019-08-26, 10:29. Edited 2 times in total.

for ready to use retro game pc's click here

Reply 14 of 58, by imi

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different interests are perfectly fine... but if someone is passionately talking about their hobby and interests being old PCs telling them "It's a pile of junk" is just insensetive and rude and a sign of bad character.

Reply 15 of 58, by derSammler

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Depends. We don't know the people. They were apparently not interested in old computers at all, so why talk to them about this topic in the first place? If you do anyway, you must accept their reaction, being it positive or negative.

Reply 16 of 58, by Scali

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VileRancour wrote:

That's really not surprising. Computing has simply become friendly and accessible by degrees, so that the barrier to entry is now low enough for everyone. One does not need technical proficiency to get in on the action, and this has the usual outcome of all such equalizing forces. As a buddy of mine has put it, one thing about being into computing in the pre-internet/smartphone age was that "you met very few idiots".

This reminds me of the term "Eternal September" (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eternal_September)
In short, internet access used to be a privilege, generally only accessible to people at universities, DoD and a select few other organizations. The early internet had its own rules and values.
Every year at September, there was a new influx of students, who got their first taste of the internet. These people were not up to date with the rules and values, and were somewhat ignorant in general, so they conducted themselves in ways that were not socially acceptable in those circles, so to speak.
So there was a noticeable 'spike' in usenet and such every September, which died down in the coming months, when the minority of newbies would become more educated and adjusted themselves to the rest of the internet.

When internet access became universally available, through companies such as AOL, the influx of newbies just never ended. That is known as Eternal September.

http://scalibq.wordpress.com/just-keeping-it- … ro-programming/

Reply 17 of 58, by amadeus777999

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Niche interests pertain to niche people.

It would be the same if you were to discuss how to optimally beat somebody in an arm wrestling match. More people could probably relate to it than to old & gaudy computers but in the end the commoner is quickly turned of by details and things that require patience and attention to details. Mainstream culture has been even more downregulated than before so the "normie"'s attention span is now shorter than ever - thanks to sitcoms, worse education, mental streamlining, living through others, ghetto culture, etc.

Compare, for example, a person like Richard Feynman and his mental composure to that of the average "co worker". First is keen on getting in on things and is able to handle elaborate thought patterns while second is often internally hostile to questioning things and goes with what "feels good".

Special interests also carry a vibe of elitism so this is another turn off to many others. On the other hand nobody is indebted to like what one loves.

For those interested, Christopher S. Hyatt, has some interesting, and sobering, thoughts on "society"...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oWYDXCz39cE

Reply 18 of 58, by DaveJustDave

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There was a similar phenomenon during Christmas every year, when n00bs would get their first modem and start pestering all the local BBS's asking for "elite access"

Scali wrote:
This reminds me of the term "Eternal September" (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eternal_September) In short, internet access used […]
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VileRancour wrote:

That's really not surprising. Computing has simply become friendly and accessible by degrees, so that the barrier to entry is now low enough for everyone. One does not need technical proficiency to get in on the action, and this has the usual outcome of all such equalizing forces. As a buddy of mine has put it, one thing about being into computing in the pre-internet/smartphone age was that "you met very few idiots".

This reminds me of the term "Eternal September" (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eternal_September)
In short, internet access used to be a privilege, generally only accessible to people at universities, DoD and a select few other organizations. The early internet had its own rules and values.
Every year at September, there was a new influx of students, who got their first taste of the internet. These people were not up to date with the rules and values, and were somewhat ignorant in general, so they conducted themselves in ways that were not socially acceptable in those circles, so to speak.
So there was a noticeable 'spike' in usenet and such every September, which died down in the coming months, when the minority of newbies would become more educated and adjusted themselves to the rest of the internet.

When internet access became universally available, through companies such as AOL, the influx of newbies just never ended. That is known as Eternal September.

I have no clue what I'm doing! If you want to watch me fumble through all my retro projects, you can watch here: https://www.youtube.com/user/MrDavejustdave

Reply 19 of 58, by keenmaster486

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I have discovered that I can justify my vintage computer hobby to most people if I talk about how it helps to build my programming skills that I'm developing on such slow and limited hardware. That's besides the historical preservation aspect.

But this is largely a culture and trend-driven thing!

Think about this: I have been into old computers, vintage cameras, old radios and TVs, etc. for a long time; since I was a kid growing up in the 2000s (yeah, I'm not an OG user of these machines). When I was growing up none of these things were trendy and I was the odd one out. Nowadays, vintage things are all the rage! People comment and compliment me on my vintage cameras and analog photography hobby, while admiring the old radios and telephones I restore, not to mention my turntable setup.

But the fad hasn't extended yet to vintage computers. So it's still viewed as strange. I think most people, when they think about "old computers", envision something like a big bubbly ugly eMachines Celeron machine from about 2003, with a 10 GB 4200 RPM HDD and 256 MB of RAM struggling to run Windows XP and IE6 with 23 browser toolbars and Norton Antivirus, and they rightly recoil, thinking about the "bad old days" or something like that. So it's pretty hard to break that perception.

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