If you're just starting out I would suggest just getting a multimeter, tweezers and a magnification device of some kind. This will cover a majority of diagnosis and repair scenarios.

Brands and specific equipment will depend on budget as costs can range significantly. Did you have a budget in mind?

Shponglefan wrote on 2022-04-23, 15:32:

If you're just starting out I would suggest just getting a multimeter, tweezers and a magnification device of some kind.

Brands and specific equipment will depend on budget as costs can range significantly. Did you have a budget in mind?

Of course I do have a budget in mind. As of a Multimeter, I'm looking for some good quality device for a price of $25-$75. Yes, I know Fluke 87V MAX is great but a price of $400 is too much for me.

As for now I've seen a positive feedback for Aneng 8009 , Klein Tools MM700, AstroAI WH5000A, Tekpower Mastech MS8268 Multimeters, but I have no idea which to choose. Maybe it is worth to take a time and to buy a used Fluke? I don't know.

Some cheap thing will go a long way over nothing. The expensive pro stuff like Fluke are worth it when you make money with whatever you're doing, for just hobby stuff and especially for someone who is just starting they are a bit overkill. Aneng will be ok to start with, it does more than you will need and will offer very good bang for the buck ~

Tiido wrote on 2022-04-23, 16:13:

.... Aneng will be ok to start with, it does more than you will need and will offer very good bang for the buck ~

And what about LCR meter with or without ESR? Is there any need for this device? Some users strongly recommend to add it to a Multimeter.

LCR. If you really need inductance in proper meter Uni-T UT70A does it on the ~cheap ($80)
But it makes a lot more sense to buy standard solid meter (or two average ones) and combine that with $10-20 Chinese clone of https://www.mikrocontroller.net/articles/AVR_ … ransistortester by Markus Frejek, just plonk 'transistor esr meter tester' into ebay and you will get tons of results

Dont forget to get a proper soldering iron. Not the ancient design crap with replaceable tips but a proper cartridge design. Either one of Chinese controllers for T12, or https://pine64.com/product/pinecil-smart-mini … soldering-iron/ with https://pine64.com/product/pinecil-soldering-tip-set-fine/. TS100 with https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:4935962 is also an option. JBC C245 controllers are even better, but cartridges are proportionally (to quality) more expensive.

rasz_pl wrote on 2022-04-23, 16:42:

LCR. If you really need inductance in proper meter Uni-T UT70A does it on the ~cheap ($80)
But it makes a lot more sense to buy standard solid meter (or two average ones) and combine that with $10-20 Chinese clone of https://www.mikrocontroller.net/articles/AVR_ … ransistortester by Markus Frejek, just plonk 'transistor esr meter tester' into ebay and you will get tons of results

LCR of course, not LSR. Actually I have no idea if I really need it (with or without ESR). What I want is to be able to test the hardware and to compare to what is written in Technical Reference Manual.

Regarding "transistor esr meter tester", it seems like it is more suitable for testing of standalone parts than for testing those parts that are soldered on a board. And I'm not intending to solder or unsolder anything. Only to test and to unplug/plug a faulty unit/board.

I'd done some research recently on whether it's worth getting an LCR or not.

The general advice seemed to be it was only really worth it if one is involved in circuit design and prototyping. For general diagnose/repair, it doesn't seem overly necessary.

I guess it really comes down to personal goals here. Is the goal just to find faults and enact repairs? Or is the goal to accurately measure individual components?

for lcr, you want something like the DER EE De-5000.

Thing with lcr/esr etc, you really want to test out of system not in system...

ThinkpadIL wrote on 2022-04-23, 16:58:

Regarding "transistor esr meter tester", it seems like it is more suitable for testing of standalone parts than for testing those parts that are soldered on a board. And I'm not intending to solder or unsolder anything. Only to test and to unplug/plug a faulty unit/board.

I'd just stick with a basic multimeter then. Note that you will be limited in what you can test, but at the same time a lot of faults can be found just testing for things like shorts, continuity, and voltage levels.

Multimeter :
AstroAI DM6000AR is a decent one that I have purchased based on Re: PSU Voltage Concerns
https://www.amazon.com/-/fr/gp/product/B071JL6LLL

LCR Meter (the above multimeter has the ability to measure capacitance, AFAICR, but I have never tried it as requires connecting an adapter to probes, so feels a bit kludgy ):
One of the cheap ATmega328 based LCR meters on Ebay or Amazon should get you started. They are easy to use and, in my experience good enough ( I don't have a reference meter to compare to, but measuring new brand-name caps yielded results that were within specs on ESR and capacitance, whereas known bad bulged and leaky ones were not). That is based on my experience with 2 sub-20$ units (temporarily misplaced the first one so got a second one) .

Full disclosure: I am an amateur and not a trained or even self-learned technician (I completed some beginner level courses on electronic circuits at Uni at some point). I (think that I) know just enough to get by without hurting myself or others .

Words of advice :
Stay away from opening up anything with a CRT until you learn what a live chassis is and until you know how to safely discharge a CRT. Also stay away from anything that is normally directly mains powered (PSU) until you learn to safely discharge large capacitors .

Shponglefan wrote on 2022-04-23, 17:41:

I'd done some research recently on whether it's worth getting an LCR or not.

The general advice seemed to be it was only really worth it if one is involved in circuit design and prototyping. For general diagnose/repair, it doesn't seem overly necessary.

I guess it really comes down to personal goals here. Is the goal just to find faults and enact repairs? Or is the goal to accurately measure individual components?

IMHO, having an LCR meter can useful if you want to validate if :

a) the capacitors that you want to install are actually good before you solder them in

and, to a lesser degree,

b) that the capacitors that you have removed are actually bad even if they show not outward sign of failure (like bloating and/or leakage).

darry wrote on 2022-04-23, 17:59:

IMHO, having an LCR meter can useful if you want to validate if : […]
Show full quote

IMHO, having an LCR meter can useful if you want to validate if :

a) the capacitors that you want to install are actually good before you solder them in

and, to a lesser degree,

b) that the capacitors that you have removed are actually bad even if they show not outward sign of failure (like bloating and/or leakage).

If the intent is just measuring I'd just get a dedicated ECR meter for that purpose (which I did).

Plus, OP mentioned they aren't planning on doing any desoldering or soldering. So an LCR meter seems moot if they're not actually removing or replacing components.

ThinkpadIL wrote on 2022-04-23, 16:58:

Regarding "transistor esr meter tester", it seems like it is more suitable for testing of standalone parts than for testing those parts that are soldered on a board. And I'm not intending to solder or unsolder anything. Only to test and to unplug/plug a faulty unit/board.

so all you need is $5-10 DT-830 clone as all you seem to want to do is measure supply voltage and buss for shorts.

Shponglefan wrote on 2022-04-23, 18:00:

Plus, OP mentioned they aren't planning on doing any desoldering or soldering. So an LCR meter seems moot if they're not actually removing or replacing components.

Sorry, I missed that . Good point. In OP's case wouldn't be of any use then .

From the written above it seems like all I need is a cheap Multimeter and a Magnifier Desk Lamp.

By the way, thanks for a good advice regarding staying away from inner parts of CRTs and PSUs.

Now, if regarding Magnifier Lamp it is simple, what about Multimeters? There are so many models available. What are the most commonly used models by the retro-computers hobbyists community? Or if to make it simpler, what model do you personally use for testing computer parts?

https://hackaday.com/2020/09/24/in-praise-of- … for-what-it-is/

50 year old design, good enough for what you are planning to do. No need for more expensive meters, as paying extra buys more precision, accuracy, repeatability and protection. First three arent that important when plan is sanity checking low voltage supply voltages. You can manage fine with 1-3% accuracy instead of 0.03% of >$150 meters. Protections are only important when working on high voltage/amperage stuff, and even then 830 is fine for most things plugged into wall socket (CAT I/CAT II). TLDR dont measure car battery short circuit current or voltage of CRT flyback and you will be fine.

Agree you do not need an expensive DVM for most PC stuff. My cheap one from 20 years ago still works well for 99% of everything I ever need. There are ways to test Electrolytic capacitors without expensive gear if you need that...

Hi! If free time is no problem, I really recommend spending some time with electronics construction kits. Or just their manuals.
They usually explain the use of ohm meters/volt meters or nowadays multimeters in their manuals and how things like transistors, caps do work.

Also useful are books about building radios.
The radio tinkerer hobby started it all, depending on how we see it.
Back in the early 20th century, kids to oldtimers started building crystal radios etc.
The things learned do not only consist of DC electronics but also high frequency.

That's one stumbling stone even Intel engineers failed at.
At one point, the myth says, they had electrical issues with their PCB design, but for a while didn't realize what's wrong.
It turned out they drew traces on PCB in a way that wasn't appropriate in the application (90°, caused reflection?).
If they had had any education in radio technology, the issue never had happened in first place perhaps.

Edit: Here's an example of such a historical/traditional kit.
It not has to be this one in particular, though.
Kits like this were made up until the 1990s.
After that, things dumped down - the modular "kits" with plastic modules are no match.
It's like learning to write. A typewriter doesn't help, you need handwriting to really aquire skills.

Oh and by the way - I think electron tubes provide a more natural idea/concept of how
electronics work than transistors (bipolar types).
It's a bit like BASIC vs C/Pascal.
If you learned BASIC (transistors) first, it's hard to get used to "proper" programming styles. 😉

rasz_pl wrote on 2022-04-23, 22:42:

https://hackaday.com/2020/09/24/in-praise-of- … for-what-it-is/

50 year old design, good enough for what you are planning to do. No need for more expensive meters, as paying extra buys more precision, accuracy, repeatability and protection. First three arent that important when plan is sanity checking low voltage supply voltages. You can manage fine with 1-3% accuracy instead of 0.03% of >$150 meters. Protections are only important when working on high voltage/amperage stuff, and even then 830 is fine for most things plugged into wall socket (CAT I/CAT II). TLDR dont measure car battery short circuit current or voltage of CRT flyback and you will be fine.

Interesting design, but I'd rather choose a more widespread model with some decent quality, accuracy and protection.