Appian ADI/2 and many other drivers were attached in previous posts.

pshipkov wrote on 2023-04-27, 20:23:

Appian ADI/2 and many other drivers were attached in previous posts.

Thanks again for your help.
I put the TurboIDE Appian drivers you attached to your post here: http://www.vogonsdrivers.com/getfile.php?file … &menustate=55,0
I put IWill SIDEjr VL-Bus Fast IDE V1.4a drivers here: http://www.vogonsdrivers.com/getfile.php?file … &menustate=55,0
I put the Future Domain Power IDE! driver stack here: http://www.vogonsdrivers.com/getfile.php?file … &menustate=55,0

I pulled out the ADI/2 based controller that I have:

• Acculogic
  Chip: ADI/2
  Board: sIDE-4/VL rev C
  Fccid: IIV0041900A00
  https://arvutimuuseum.ee/th99/c/A-B/20956.htm (but mine is Rev C and has more jumpers)

Here's how the build is going:

• Win98se just installed the standard HD controller.
• The TurboIDE driver didn't recognize the card.
• The IWill SIDEjr VL-Bus Fast IDE V1.4a driver recognized the card but doesn't see the 512MB CF attached to it and won't load on boot.
• The diagnostic that comes with the Future Domain drivers sees the card and the hard drive, but the PwrIDE! installer seems fussy about installing under Win98se, so I'll have to get back to that tomorrow. Looks like I need to manually put ATASPI16.SYS and FDATAHD.SYS in the config.sys if I want to use it under DOS.

the flexi driver will work just fine with adi/2 I think its newer than the turbo ide one. this also is the driver I was refering to my last post about it. http://vogonsdrivers.com/getfile.php?fileid=9 … &menustate=35,0

Warlord wrote on 2023-04-28, 02:10:

the flexi driver will work just fine with adi/2 I think its newer than the turbo ide one. this also is the driver I was refering to my last post about it. http://vogonsdrivers.com/getfile.php?fileid=9 … &menustate=35,0

I'll try out that driver as soon as I get back to my testing.

I took a risk and acquired this board:

Turned out that there was a PDC-20630 controller under that sticker, so that counts as a win!

jakethompson1 wrote on 2023-04-26, 02:38:

This is also a good time to mention that in c:\windows\ios.ini you can list drivers that are allowed to hook Int 13h without forcing Windows 95 to use 16-bit disk access.
In fact, there are already drivers for some VLB cards listed in there. That may also be a good way to line up any VLB IDE controllers you haven't already thought of...
This may be of use if the config.sys driver for your chip programs speed settings into the chip (making it faster) and doesn't allow you to not hook Int 13h, and the chip either doesn't have a Windows 95 driver or you don't wish to use it.

Thanks for that tip. I didn't know about that file. Back when I did Win95 work, I generally avoided real mode drivers wherever possible (maybe because I was coming from OS/2) so I never had to mess with that side of things much. But now that I'm looking at real mode storage drivers for dos, it's certainly something to consider.

I'll have to put "In IOS" bit in column the "chip chart" eventually. That name "IOS" is sort of overloaded these days, no?

What about this one. It’s a Mystery to me. I bought it NEW on eBay but I can’t find any drivers or jumper setting or documentation for it.

Its a “Acculogic sIDE-4/VI”

Intel486dx33 wrote on 2023-04-28, 19:34:

What about this one. It’s a Mystery to me. I bought it NEW on eBay but I can’t find any drivers or jumper setting or documentation for it.

Its a “Acculogic sIDE-4/VI”

Oh, it has ISA IDE and VL IDE. So you have one slow and one fast port on it.

douglar wrote on 2023-04-28, 18:14:

jakethompson1 wrote on 2023-04-26, 02:38:

This is also a good time to mention that in c:\windows\ios.ini you can list drivers that are allowed to hook Int 13h without forcing Windows 95 to use 16-bit disk access.
In fact, there are already drivers for some VLB cards listed in there. That may also be a good way to line up any VLB IDE controllers you haven't already thought of...
This may be of use if the config.sys driver for your chip programs speed settings into the chip (making it faster) and doesn't allow you to not hook Int 13h, and the chip either doesn't have a Windows 95 driver or you don't wish to use it.

Thanks for that tip. I didn't know about that file. Back when I did Win95 work, I generally avoided real mode drivers wherever possible (maybe because I was coming from OS/2) so I never had to mess with that side of things much. But now that I'm looking at real mode storage drivers for dos, it's certainly something to consider.

I'll have to put "In IOS" bit in column the "chip chart" eventually. That name "IOS" is sort of overloaded these days, no?

In your experimentation have you found any of these cards where there is no Win95 driver, or where it has a compatibility issue or you otherwise don't want to use it?

Intel486dx33 wrote on 2023-04-28, 19:34:

What about this one. It’s a Mystery to me. I bought it NEW on eBay but I can’t find any drivers or jumper setting or documentation for it.

Its a “Acculogic sIDE-4/VI”

I’m testing with that exact card. I’ve had the best luck with the IDE driver in this bundle: http://vogonsdrivers.com/getfile.php?fileid=9 … menustate=59,55

I’ve been getting 8KBs to 8.5KBs thoughput

douglar wrote on 2023-04-29, 03:05:

Intel486dx33 wrote on 2023-04-28, 19:34:

What about this one. It’s a Mystery to me. I bought it NEW on eBay but I can’t find any drivers or jumper setting or documentation for it.

Its a “Acculogic sIDE-4/VI”

I’m testing with that exact card. I’ve had the best luck with the IDE driver in this bundle: http://vogonsdrivers.com/getfile.php?fileid=9 … menustate=59,55

I’ve been getting 8KBs to 8.5KBs thoughput

Can you post a photo of your jumper settings ?

douglar wrote on 2023-04-29, 03:05:

I’m testing with that exact card. I’ve had the best luck with the IDE driver in this bundle: http://vogonsdrivers.com/getfile.php?fileid=9 … menustate=59,55

I’ve been getting 8KBs to 8.5KBs thoughput

I hope this is meant to read "8MB/s to 8.5MB/s" throughput. 8 KB/s sounds more like what an original IBM PC (1981, model 5150) can get as net application performance from a floppy drive.

Intel486dx33 wrote on 2023-04-29, 08:34:

Can you post a photo of your jumper settings ?

Acculogic sIDE-4/VL (pretty sure that's an "L" with a via through the letter, not an "I")
https://fccid.io/IIV0041900A00
Jumpers are close to this: https://arvutimuuseum.ee/th99/c/A-B/20956.htm
But the card is Rev C and has that additional bank of jumpers down the left side that look similar to the manual speed selector jumpers seen on other boards from this period.
Is there a wayback website for Acculogic PC parts? Acculogic.com seems to be for something else.

Looks like the traces are there for an enterprising modder to add a rom at U4 and address jumpers at JP23. Probably also need to add a SN74LS138N decoder at U15 and a GD74LS244 line driver at U9, yes?
Looks like you could add a game port at J8 if you added chips at U12, U13, & U5. Don't know what those parts would be. Probably need to add a bunch of resisters and capacitors in the corner too.

mkarcher wrote on 2023-04-29, 10:55:

I hope this is meant to read "8MB/s to 8.5MB/s" throughput. 8 KB/s sounds more like what an original IBM PC (1981, model 5150) can get as net application performance from a floppy drive.

Yikes. That's always embarrassing. You are correct. I was getting 8000 KB/s on a 512MB CF and my brain auto corrected the second KB.

Yes, I'm using a cruddy performing mobo for testing right now. I could have sworn the WB cache was working on this guy once upon a time.
https://theretroweb.com/motherboards/s/fic-486-vip
I'll switch to a better board later on, but I soldered a PS/2 mouse onto this one and it works with my KVM switch so it's pretty convenient and it's been rock solid stable with the updated rom and new battery.

jakethompson1 wrote on 2023-04-29, 00:01:

In your experimentation have you found any of these cards where there is no Win95 driver, or where it has a compatibility issue or you otherwise don't want to use it?

The default "standard IDE controller" protected mode driver that comes with windows 95/98 is pretty compatible and works with just about any controller that is willing to look like ATA-0 hardware, which is just about everything.

I remember that there are some situations where that driver can't load and win9x uses its compatibility driver, which translates the storage commands back into real mode int 13 calls. You don't want to do that. If you find yourself in that situation, you probably didn't want to run Win9x. It was unpleasant. Usually fell into one of 4 categories:

1. Most common: Boot sector virus. Solution: Remove the virus (Do it without losing all your data is extra credit)
2. Wacky DOS storage driver in your config sys. Solution: Comment out that old driver and stick it out with Win95
3. Incompatible BIOS on your controller: Find Win95 drivers from your vendor. If you can't, this was really just the universe's way of telling you it was time to upgrade your system.
4. Incompatible drive overlay software. Solution: upgrade your motherboard or try Win95 drivers for your drive overlay software if you just want to kick this problem down the road for a while.

That last one is the thing that might be a problem for me in this testing. My best performing storage devices are larger than 8GB and some of the boards I'd like to test predate any type of LBA. I'm going to have to use something to get those to work in these old systems and it’s extra tricky because some of those pre-lba BIOS lock tight if they even look at large storage devices .

So. First I've got to figure out which combinations of devices, Option Roms and DOS drivers work together and identify which ones work best using a small sized storage device to keep things simple.

Once I get a list of worthwhile drivers for each card, then I’ll worry about how to make them work with large storage without killing performance or win9x compatibility

ADI/2 controllers usually hit 10Mb/s in synthetic tests when inserted in fast motherboards with good BIOS microcodes.
Are you using the M919 board ?

douglar wrote on 2023-04-29, 17:16:

The default "standard IDE controller" protected mode driver that comes with windows 95/98 is pretty compatible and works with ju […]
Show full quote

jakethompson1 wrote on 2023-04-29, 00:01:

In your experimentation have you found any of these cards where there is no Win95 driver, or where it has a compatibility issue or you otherwise don't want to use it?

The default "standard IDE controller" protected mode driver that comes with windows 95/98 is pretty compatible and works with just about any controller that is willing to look like ATA-0 hardware, which is just about everything.

I remember that there are some situations where that driver can't load and win9x uses its compatibility driver, which translates the storage commands back into real mode int 13 calls. You don't want to do that. If you find yourself in that situation, you probably didn't want to run Win9x. It was unpleasant. Usually fell into one of 4 categories:

1. Most common: Boot sector virus. Solution: Remove the virus (Do it without losing all your data is extra credit)
2. Wacky DOS storage driver in your config sys. Solution: Comment out that old driver and stick it out with Win95
3. Incompatible BIOS on your controller: Find Win95 drivers from your vendor. If you can't, this was really just the universe's way of telling you it was time to upgrade your system.
4. Incompatible drive overlay software. Solution: upgrade your motherboard or try Win95 drivers for your drive overlay software if you just want to kick this problem down the road for a while.

I mentioned that, because ios.ini (as I mentioned in a previous post) can be customized to let Win95 bypass compatibility mode even when Int 13h has been hooked by a config.sys driver, providing an escape hatch from situation #2 so long as there is not some weird translation scheme or other situation where you actually need the DOS driver.

The Standard IDE protected mode driver does not attempt to do Multi Sector PIO transfers. I've done some experimenting with patching it to add them, and it helps particularly if the HDD is not "period correct" and is much faster than drives of the era. This also may give spinning HDDs an edge over CompactFlash, as CompactFlash tends to not offer more than one sector per interrupt. I haven't tested adequately for potential data loss to be willing to share it publicly/widely. As rasz_pl was mentioning earlier, this is possibly the most impactful enhancement on these old controllers when bus mastering is out of the question and so you are stuck with PIO transfers.

pshipkov wrote on 2023-04-29, 22:57:

ADI/2 controllers usually hit 10Mb/s in synthetic tests when inserted in fast motherboards with good BIOS microcodes.
Are you using the M919 board ?

I was using a slow mobo for testing w/ write through cache https://theretroweb.com/motherboards/s/fic-486-vip
I'm also using a slow CF in that test.

When you say: "BIOS Microcode", you are talking about driver quality, yes?

I've got a lot of your drivers loaded here and then some: http://www.vogonsdrivers.com/index.php?catid=78

Still have not seen drivers for these guys:

1. Chips/Goldstar 82C711 & 82C712 -- Update: found them here: https://archive.org/details/GOLDSTAR
2. Opti 82C611A & 82C46X -- Update: found it on ftp://69.43.38.172/mirrors/ftp.cvut.cz/ide/pide/setupvic.exe
3. Tans
4. UMC UM82C863F & UM82C871F
5. VIC HAOI-0221 - might be the same thing as Opti
6. VIDE VIDE-1 - Probably a rebrand of something else

douglar wrote on 2023-04-27, 11:45:

Anyone know what chip is used in the DTC controllers? Looks like they just put a sticker on someone else's chip. […]
Show full quote

Anyone know what chip is used in the DTC controllers? Looks like they just put a sticker on someone else's chip.

I looked through the driver files and didn't see any obvious clues.

I don't see any controllers in my collection that have the two pins soldered together like that.

DTC2278E.jpg

DTC2278E zoom.jpg

Seems that there are 3 different DTC controllers based on the readme in the device driver file:

• DTC 801 supports PIO-2
• DTC 803 supports PIO-4
• DTC 805 supports PIO-2

I need a driver for the Controller - DTC-2278D, VLB ( 2 channels ).
that offer support for hard drives larger than 420mbs.

Intel486dx33 wrote on 2023-04-30, 03:59:

I need a driver for the Controller - DTC-2278D, VLB ( 2 channels ).
that offer support for hard drives larger than 420mbs.

Under that sticker should be a DTC 803 chip that supports PIO-4

This looks like the last driver made for the board:
http://vogonsdrivers.com/getfile.php?fileid=1 … &menustate=55,0

It’s from 1998 and they had larger drives then, but the bios that boots your computer likely has some say in the matter first. If you Bios is older that Sept 1994, you likely need a bios extension like Xtide Universal Bios or you need drive overlay software installed on the boot sector of your storage device

I got the last batch of drivers uploaded.

1. Chips/Goldstar 82C711 & 82C712
   http://www.vogonsdrivers.com/getfile.php?file … &menustate=55,0
2. Opti 82C611A & 82C46X
   http://www.vogonsdrivers.com/getfile.php?file … 052&menustate=0
3. Tans - No drivers found yet
4. UM82C871F - Might work with the other UMC drivers?
5. VIC HAOI-0221 - Might be the same as Opti because of the similarity in the driver name
6. VIDE VIDE-1 - No drivers found yet

If anyone has a VLB IDE controller with a Goldstar, Opti, Vic, Vide, or Via chip, please take a minute to try out the drivers if you get a chance. There's a certain amount of guess work that went into this.

I also found this driver: http://www.vogonsdrivers.com/getfile.php?file … 049&menustate=0
Legit looks like something VLB related. Can't quite figure out what it is. IOS.ini says that VLIDE.sys = "Promise Technologies PM driver (ESDI_506) exists" but the binary in the driver file doesn't look like something from Promise.

I'm going to be away from home for a week, so I'll pick up my testing when I get back. Kind of hard to pack all the retro gear and take it on a plane.