I don't blame them; the cost of upgrading PCs and retrain personnel for a small business is not a pretty sight for the owners or their bean-counters 😵 .

Personally, I will never try out Windows 8 or 8.1 - Microsoft's GUI change is simply too much for me. I don't have (or want to have) a cellphone, pad, or any other portable device; why on Earth would I want an oversized version of their GUI as my Desktop 🙄 ? At the very least MS should have offered an option: stay with the old, proven Start Menu or move on to the new Metro Interface (with caveats for each, of course 😐 ). And no, third-party UI solutions are not my cup of tea either.

And before anyone accuses me of being a luddite: please, I have the freedom to choose what I want best for myself - just like everyone else. And when the time comes for me to move on, I will decide where and when 😏 .

It is exactly the same, besides start, takes 5 minutes to get used to.

It's not just the 'start' button.

Well there is Windows 9 coming out next year, still has the horrid metro on top but has the normal win7 desktop but that could just be a rumor. Personally there is no need for anything newer than 7.

I just recently purchased for $5 the "Start8" Windows 8 theme/upgrade for my parents computer and it's changed everything. I had a play around with it and it now feels just like windows 7 again with the benefits of windows 8. I disabled all the corners or whatever they're called so that it doesn't bring up the menus when you move the cursor into one of the corners. You can even disable the main start tile interface altogether. Plus the main thing is that the start button + program menu is back! There is honestly no difference between 7 and 8 from what I can see once start8 is installed and setup.

Considering making the switch now that I've experienced windows 8 using start8. Check it out!

Ps: that's not to say that there may be compatibility issues with older software/games though. Not sure as I haven't used windows 8 enough to know.

There is also Classic Shell, which is free, even open source. http://sourceforge.net/projects/classicshell/

Malik wrote:

It's not just the 'start' button.

What else is there that stops you from using it exactly the same as you used windows 7?

I can give you an example. MIDI support is more broken than ever. In Windows 7 I had a great setup with BASSMIDI, MUNT and my trusty Roland SC-7. I've had to give this all up unfortunately, as it only works when it feels like it. Thankfully, I haven't played a ton of DOS games with MIDI support since last summer (when I installed Win8)...

XMPlay can load sound fonts for playback. Have you tried http://coolsoft.altervista.org/en/virtualmidisynth ?

Stojke wrote:

XMPlay can load sound fonts for playback. Have you tried http://coolsoft.altervista.org/en/virtualmidisynth ?

Haven't given it a shot. If it does things like pretty much every other program, which means looking up the Windows registry and changing some values then it's going to have the exact same problems as BASSMIDI and the rest.
The point is, I've tried Windows 8, I've been using Start8 since day one and I'll be reverting to Windows 7 when I format. As it is right now, it's causing me more problems than it is solving. Windows 9 just needs to introduce a few tweaks here and there, be desktop only (or at least have a very clear distinction between the two) and call it a day. I'd be happy with that.

What are you trying to achieve? I will try it with Virtual Midi Synth.

[E]
Just tried it on windows 8.1 . It used to work extremely well on windows 7, but on windows 8.1 it takes for ever to load the sound font into memory, especially if its over 1GB. It keeps doing that EVERY time i load a different song into the player. Now thats lame.

I just want to load a soundfont to use for DOSBox. A generally use either the 4MB or 8MB GM soundfont. But anyway, that's besides the point.

Stojke wrote:

It is exactly the same, besides start, takes 5 minutes to get used to.

I hear this alot (though less than I used to), but it's just not true. I wish it was. The Start Menu (lack of it that is)
is just the tip of the iceberg. Think of it as a giant flashing WARNING sign informing you DANGER AHEAD (or in this case "crap ahead").

The list of regressions, removed features, and random irritants are too long for one post, but here's a few big ones:

1) No Aero Glass. No ability to re-enable it without third-party paidware. Why? Allegedly because it's better for tablets. In reality, to help fuglify the OS to make it "gel" better with the Metro interface. (DWM remains on & Tom's Hardware analysis showed Windows 7 with Aero Enabled uses much less video memory at idle than 8 without).

2) The UI has been fuglified and bastardized. And no, I don't mean the ribbon. Everything has been flattened. This goes beyond 1) above - the OS is just plain ugly. Subjective maybe, but it's a very common sentiment. Again, this was to make it "gel" better with Metro. Additionally, information elements in Windows Explorer have been stripped out with no ability to re-enable them. ClearType has been bastardized (it now uses greyscale antialising - supposedly to make it better for tablets). Maybe it helps tablets, but it's fugly on LCDs.

3) No ability to disable DWM, even though again you don't get Aero. Have a program that wasn't updated post Vista? Too bad. It's gonna crash. No more "Disable desktop composition" option.

3) No more gadgets. Dumped around Consumer Preview. Why? Apps! Of course! LIVE TILES!

4) Search has been bastardized. Improved some in Windows 8.1 - maybe by 9 they'll get back to Vista-era
utility.

5) You can't completely get rid of Metro and just "live in the desktop". it's not "no comprises" like Sinofsky lied through his teeth at //build. It's all compromises all the time. Metro continually pops up. Random UI dialogs have been metro-ized. Network connections have been moved completely to metro. Want to manage WiFi settings? Too bad. Oh that's right, you can use netsh at the command prompt. What a step forward!

Here's a much longer list of f'ups. The following will give you a rundown:

http://xpwasmyidea.blogspot.com/2011/09/featu … -windows-8.html

Then there's the way Microsoft (Read: Sinofsky) crapped all over developers with WinRT & the trashing of Silverlight/WPF...

nforce4max wrote:

Personally there is no need for anything newer than 7.

/\ this /\

I always hate it when corporate executives shove unwanted features/interface/trends down the consumer's throat. Those at Redmont may claim "but Metro UI is better", but they seem to conveniently forget that new interface requires re-learning the damn thing, and re-learning translates into time and money.

There are other issues, too: a Window-8-capable PC requires beefier hardware – to handle touch – than a machine for Windows 7. And with the latest OS, staff need retraining, adding to the costs.

Even MS Office's ribbon interface is a pain in the ass. The fact that people can make money by making this obviously shows that the new interface is unwanted by the users.

Rationally, a business should make what the consumer what in order to sell. Unfortunately, businesses are still ran by people, and people are not always rational. It seems when a business becomes sufficiently large that they can afford to offend their consumer, they will mostly do it. Imagine this:

Corporate executive: "we are going to implement this new and shiny interface to our product, just because."
Rational staff: "but Sir, it's a pain to use. The consumers will hate it."
Corporate executive: "so what? We virtually monopolize the market. The consumers would have no choice but adopt it. If they hate it then they're old people who are afraid of change, but it doesn't matter. We will force them to love our new shiny interface. "
Rational staff: "Sir, have you tried the new interface yourself? Even I found it very tiring."
Corporate executive: "me? Heh. I'm here to make decisions, I have secretary and staff to handle office works. So if the consumers find the new interface difficult, then it is THEIR problem, not mine. BWA-HA-HA-HA!"
some weeks later, the products flop.
Corporate executive: "so, the sales drops, and the BOD forces me to resign. But hey, this is still a multi-billion dollar company despite the flop. And most importantly, I got this generous pension - a golden parachute! Now I'm going to spend my days in Maui while Joe The Consumer suffers from carpal tunnel syndrome because of the new interface. BWA-HA-HA-HA!"

Stojke wrote:

Malik wrote:

It's not just the 'start' button.

What else is there that stops you from using it exactly the same as you used windows 7?

Windows 7.

Having a think about it, as much as I absolutely hate the metro interface and am quite happy to use windows 7 forever, inevitably people (including myself) will need to adapt to future technologies to be able to survive. It's similar to the mobile phone market. The majority of phones are now smart phones. Yes you can still go down to your local phone shop and buy an older style keypad phone but these are all slowly getting phased out with touchscreen technology.

Putting it into perspective, could you imagine if technology had not evolved at all and we were still turning a dial on our phones to make a phone call, having to pump the accelerator in our cars to add fuel to the carburettor to start the engine or having to push buttons on our TV set because there was no remote as well as many other time consuming things? All things that we were quite happy doing at the time and didn't think otherwise but would we go back to any of them now?

I'm glad technology is constantly evolving and companies are always looking at change. Without trial and error and thinking outside the box, where would we be? I don't like change as much as the next person but in the end we adjust and one day we'll look back and think, what was I complaining about! Lastly, our children are growing up in this new age so won't know anything different. It's us older folk (I'm only 30yo) that need to get with the times and embrace the future for what it will be.

borgie83 wrote:

Having a think about it, as much as I absolutely hate the metro interface and am quite happy to use windows 7 forever, inevitably people (including myself) will need to adapt to future technologies to be able to survive. It's similar to the mobile phone market. The majority of phones are now smart phones. Yes you can still go down to your local phone shop and buy an older style keypad phone but these are all slowly getting phased out with touchscreen technology.

Microsoft was hoping people would "adapt", but the thing is - consumers have rejected Windows 8. Even those unlike us who are non-techies. The people who were supposed to benefit from a "simplified" UI with live tiles & the like. People just don't want it. That's why Ballmer's out, Sinofsky's out, - basically the entire Windows 8 team save Larson-Green & Jensen Harris are gone from Microsoft. Windows 8 has been an epic disaster for Microsoft - probably the worse the company has ever experienced. They'd love to have the Vista days back.

I do agree with you that Microsoft needed to get going with tablets - to adapt to that new reality - multitouch (vs the stylus/point-based UI that they had embraced), but there were far better ways to go about it. Both for us (the end users) and for Microsoft. It's hard to believe now - but Microsoft had a 40%+ plurality marketshare lead in mobile with Windows Mobile prior to the iPhone. Today, after Metro, Windows Phone, the reset (and second reset from WP7 to 😎 - they are at - maybe 4% - and only here in the US is it actually that. Worldwide I think it's closer to 2%.

In tablets, Microsoft never had a large share. They've been dabbling in it since the early 90s since it was BillG's pet project, but it was a niche market no one cared about. So they had little to lose...except that Windows 8 and the way they've treated developers - basically saying "FU" - jeopardizes the mothership of [Win32] "Windows".

I do agree that Microsoft made a big costly mistake with Windows 8. The way it's designed is just a mess unfortunately. An example is, why would you have 2 completely different internet explorers that operate differently from one another. 1 in metro form and 1 in desktop form. 1 optimized version would've sufficed. Instead I found myself having to switch to desktop and use that version as it's easier to use and what I'm used to.

I won't go through all the disadvantages of using windows 8 but there are a few. There's also a few positives! I don't disagree though with them making the decision to use an app like interface as I can see this as a step forward into the future. Maybe I've watched too many sci fi movies in my time but I have to admit, it always looks pretty cool when they're waving their arms around selecting everything eg: Tony Stark and Jarvis haha

Picture perfect voice recognition combined with a true 3D holographic windows desktop and true to life virtual reality.

Just hope it's in my life time 😀