VOGONS

Common searches


There is no successor to Warcraft II

Topic actions

Reply 20 of 30, by MrFlibble

User metadata
Rank Oldbie
Rank
Oldbie

So a while ago (precisely, in June 2017) I stumbled upon a game project called Loria at IndieDB which was clearly inspired by Warcraft II. The project was at an early stage and featured very pixelated "retro-ish" style graphics (more pixelised than actual Warcraft II), nonexistent AI and a single demo mission that was pretty limited. Nevertheless it seemed to me that the developers more or less captured the style of the original they were trying to follow. I think you can still grab that demo from the IndieDB page.

Fast forward to, well, today when I stumbled upon a review of the game which in the meantime was released. The retro big pixel art was dropped in favour of something closer to a mix between Warcraft II and Kingdom Under Fire (that is, a more StarCraft-ish look). Here's their official website. I briefly watched a gameplay video and it seems competently done if not outstanding.

DOS Games Archive | Free open source games | RGB Classic Games

Reply 21 of 30, by dr_st

User metadata
Rank l33t
Rank
l33t

Good find. The Warcraft II and Starcraft inspiration is clearly visible, already from the screenshots.

https://cloakedthargoid.wordpress.com/ - Random content on hardware, software, games and toys

Reply 22 of 30, by SirNickity

User metadata
Rank Oldbie
Rank
Oldbie

I have never played WC1, but Dune and WC2 both simultaneously introduced me to RTS. I'm playing through the Battle.Net Edition of WC2 now, actually. I have loved that game for decades.

WC3 took a LAN party or two to get used to, but once I did, I became quite enamored with it. The 3D design is beautiful and polished. I only (relatively) recently played through the campaign after years of LAN multiplayer -- I thought it was loads of fun.

Starcraft had me hooked immediately. Blizzard's decision to let you spawn copies from a single CD might be the most effective sales pitch I've ever seen. It worked on me. One LAN party and I was throwing down cash for my own copy. The campaign is fantastic.

I had a really hard time accepting SC2 because I'm just not willing to support always-online DRM. I'm not a huge gamer, so I'll frequently install several games and not touch them for months or even years. I also travel quite a bit, and IMO, if I feel like a game of SC at 30,000 feet, I don't see why I shouldn't be able to play it. Regardless of whether it's ever "really" a problem, that kind of DRM is not OK with me. But, alas, LAN party... totally caved. Seemed like a lot of fun, but I haven't put many hours into it.

I have been on a mission to get all the old console games I missed, so I have at this point hundreds of games on my backlog. Still can't stop playing WC2, WC3, and SC long enough to venture out. It's also about time I went back and played through DIablo and Diablo II.

Reply 23 of 30, by MrFlibble

User metadata
Rank Oldbie
Rank
Oldbie

So I noticed the other day that Loria is now available at GOG.com including a playable demo which I grabbed and played a bit (now at campaign mission 3; there's also one skirmish map). As of the time of writing this the version is 1.2.0

So far I've got rather mixed feelings about this. The art is generally nice but has a somewhat coarse appearance, lacking the finesse of Warcraft II's sprite work that it tries to imitate. I'd say I prefer the art of Wyrmsun as far as following Warcraft II's footsteps goes. Sound effects are nothing special, and voice acting is fairly neat.

Now onto gameplay. The campaign missions generally do a good job of introducing the playing mechanics, although I must admit that the levelling the hero up would be more highlighted in the first level with some hint messages, perhaps akin to those found in StarCraft. The hero system is similar to that from Warcraft III where your heroes gain experience, level up, and may be resurrected at an altar if you have one. Each hero has four special abilities (some of them passive), with every level up allowing to add one to the active list or upgrade an existing ability. However, unlike WC3, you also need to manually distribute skill points (five per level), which theoretically gives greater control of your hero's buildup.

On top of that, regular units can also gain up to three levels (starting at level 0), which grants them bonuses such as more HP, faster health regeneration rate, a chance to evade attacks, stronger attack etc. As far as I can tell, these are selected at random and without the player's interference. The unit roster if fairly typical for the genre, if not a carbon copy of Warcraft games: you have your footman, archer, cleric, wizard, ballista etc. Same with the base buildings which frankly are not at all different from their WC2 counterparts.

Now how does this all play? After getting through the first missions I had a strong feeling that unit pathfinding is very clunky even by the standards of those authentic 90s era RTSs that Loria pays homage to. Controlling any sizeable group quickly becomes a mess as individual units have trouble getting around one another as well as external obstacles, and sometimes even wander off into a completely different direction. They generally tend to build a kind of formation upon arriving at the destination: melee units in front, archers and clerics at the back; but there is no formation at all when moving, so you can quite easily expose the vulnerable archers and casters to enemy front lines while swordsmen and the hero stagger behind. For this reason I found swordsmen practically useless as they get pelted by enemy archers before they can reach their targets and deal damage.

What's more I've encountered bugs like units suddenly "jumping" to a different place in the middle of combat; this often occurs when the starting hero uses his mace swing special ability. A couple of times my units got stuck in decorations in the starting dungeon, only to "teleport" out of them seconds later.

The hero himself feels rather imbalanced. I thought that he'd make a good tank if I distributed the level-up points properly, but his HP quickly get drained by enemy archer fire, this is no better than regular swordsmen. This is in rather stark contrast to WC3's heroes that are generally more durable if memory serves. On the whole so far I'm finding archers and ballistae the best units of choice, kind of like in WC1.

To add to pathfinding issues, I found it rather difficult to select individual units out of a selected group. There's a little thing with the interface: the units' HP bars that are shown above them by default (can be hidden in the options) change colour in the typical fashion (green -> yellow -> red) depending on how much health is left; however the health bars shown under the unit portraits on the bottom bar interface are always green, making it a bit hard to match the unit on the screen with its portrait, especially in the midst of combat. I mention this because it's apparently easier to click on the portrait to select an individual unit from the group (e.g. to move a unit taking heavy damage out of danger) than to click on the unit itself: several times I failed to select by clicking a unit that was moving; the selection remained on the entire group. This somewhat hampers even the simplest micro tasks.

It appears that other players have also noted the pathfinding issues. I hope these get fixed or at least improved because the game is not bad in itself, even if not exceedingly original. But so far I cannot say that this is an improvement over the Warcraft titles, rather an aspiring imitation.

DOS Games Archive | Free open source games | RGB Classic Games

Reply 25 of 30, by Cyberdyne

User metadata
Rank Oldbie
Rank
Oldbie

Some kind of Polish Warcraft 1 clone, but seems to have modern controls, bad thing that is only in Polish. Else i would play it gladly, because it is DOS game.

I am aroused about any X86 motherboard that has full functional ISA slot. I think i have problem. Not really into that original (Turbo) XT,286,386 and CGA/EGA stuff. So just a DOS nut.
PS. If I upload RAR, it is a 16-bit DOS RAR Version 2.50.

Reply 27 of 30, by kolderman

User metadata
Rank l33t
Rank
l33t

I also played the hell out of wc2 in the 90s, ipx and all. But I tried to go back and play it but could not. I just don't yearm for that gamestyle anymore.

However a strategy game I can go back and play is warlords2...and it's many sequals including battlecry. Without the resource management its like a very lite wargaming title sitting between those serious games and rts like warcraft. If I had to be stuck on a desert island with any strategy series it would be this.

Reply 29 of 30, by MrFlibble

User metadata
Rank Oldbie
Rank
Oldbie
Cyberdyne wrote:

Some kind of Polish Warcraft 1 clone, but seems to have modern controls, bad thing that is only in Polish. Else i would play it gladly, because it is DOS game.

You can grab a couple of shareware versions here (the game was re-released on CD with some changes/improvements and that version got its own shareware too).

Also you might want to check out Horde: The Northern Wind (not to be confused with Crystal Dynamics' The Horde).

DOS Games Archive | Free open source games | RGB Classic Games

Reply 30 of 30, by MrFlibble

User metadata
Rank Oldbie
Rank
Oldbie

There's also the Hungarian "indie" shareware Warcraft clone/inspired game called The Dark Legions (not related to the turn-based dark fantasy game published by SSI), which is quite playable as far as I can tell (judging by the shareware version). BTW you can get the full version off Steam. The 3D graphics are kinda crude but rather workable, especially if you max zoom out, and have a certain style to them. As far as I can tell this was made by a single person, Marcell Baranyai who later went on to create a Warcraft III-ish game called BC Kings.

DOS Games Archive | Free open source games | RGB Classic Games