The big difference will be with music in games (usually something with the word Midi or Roland in the setup menu) Doom been a classic example.
If you go on youtube and search Creative AWE64 and Dreamblaster X2 you'll find examples of both. have a listen and decide which you prefer.

Lesser differences are are the AWE64 is Sound Blaster 16 compatible where the ESS is Sound Blaster Pro compatible.

I wouldn't worry about using the sound cards IDE if you have spare on your controller, you need to start messing around with special drivers.
Just jumper the CF card as Master, CD-ROM as slave and generic drivers should be fine.

So the dreamblaster does what the soundblaster awe has onboard ?

chinny22 wrote:

I wouldn't worry about using the sound cards IDE if you have spare on your controller, you need to start messing around with special drivers.

You don't need any "special" drivers to use the IDE port on a sound card. It's just an ordinary secondary/tertiary IDE channel.

chinny22 wrote:

Just jumper the CF card as Master, CD-ROM as slave and generic drivers should be fine.

Almost no CF card works in a master/slave configuration. They are made for single drive configurations. Also, you never connect the CD-ROM drive to the same cable as the hard disk the system runs from, as even if it works, it kills speed.

The ESS card with the X2 and the CD-ROM drive on its IDE port is a perfect solution. While the AWE64 has a wavetable as well, you rely on AWE32/64 support in games, as you can't just select GM (the GM emulation must be loaded first and only works half of the time). Also, the AWE64 only has a 1 MB sample ROM. To load a bigger sound bank, you need to add RAM to the card and use Win9x, as under DOS you can't load SF2 files into the AWE. Oh, and the AWE64 will be mono only for games that only support the SB Pro due to a never-fixed bug in the DSP.

derSammler wrote:

You don't need any "special" drivers to use the IDE port on a sound card. It's just an ordinary secondary/tertiary IDE channel. […]
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chinny22 wrote:

I wouldn't worry about using the sound cards IDE if you have spare on your controller, you need to start messing around with special drivers.

You don't need any "special" drivers to use the IDE port on a sound card. It's just an ordinary secondary/tertiary IDE channel.

chinny22 wrote:

Just jumper the CF card as Master, CD-ROM as slave and generic drivers should be fine.

Almost no CF card works in a master/slave configuration. They are made for single drive configurations. Also, you never connect the CD-ROM drive to the same cable as the hard disk the system runs from, as even if it works, it kills speed.

The ESS card with the X2 and the CD-ROM drive on its IDE port is a perfect solution. While the AWE64 has a wavetable as well, you rely on AWE32/64 support in games, as you can't just select GM (the GM emulation must be loaded first and only works half of the time). Also, the AWE64 only has a 1 MB sample ROM. To load a bigger sound bank, you need to add RAM to the card and use Win9x, as under DOS you can't load SF2 files into the AWE. Oh, and the AWE64 will be mono only for games that only support the SB Pro due to a never-fixed bug in the DSP.

Your correct (and I was wrong) about the IDE driver, I was thinking about the Panasonic interface.

However I have to disagree about CF cards not working in Master/Slave. I've only ever purchased adapters that specifically have the jumper to set this but never had any trouble on any of my systems using a mix of Sandisk Kingston, Transcend CF cards and their are definitely other builds also setup like this.

The CD-ROM will only kill speed if been used. How often this will be the case on a 486 gaming PC the OP will know best but I would think majority of games run off the HDD with the CD drive just used for installation and maybe CD audio which I don't think would effect speed either? Never tested though.

SimonV wrote:

So the dreamblaster does what the soundblaster awe has onboard ?

Basically yes although the AWE is more limited then Dreamblaster (or any other) midi device, Personally I would consider it an alternative to a midi device rather then a replacement, pair it with an external device or the "chill and phil adapter" for the dreamblaster and you get both AWE for games with native support and General Midi for everything else but as you already own the Awe I would still try that first before going out and spending more money

The MONO only problem occurs only with like few games. Allmost all games are SB16 aware, even in Stereo 8bit mode.

I am leaning towards buying a dreamblaster if I read all this. It's not that expensive and I support a company that actually makes nice toys for us in 2019. But more importantly I can also avoid changing cards and set it all up again, that ESS is SO easy to configure for a newbie like me.

I also have an MT-32 that I bought some years ago before everyone seems to want one... with what do I need to compare that ? The dreamblaster ? Do I still need a dreamblaster if I connect that or is this just another option to choose from as in "some games like the dreamblaster and others like the MT32 " ?

Yeah yeah I know lots of questions ... this is the last one, honestly 😀

Nah questions are good, we all have to start at some point.
So the quick and dirty history of dos game music.

- First you had PS speaker, which is... your internal PC speaker
- Then you had Adlib, this is done by a Yamaha OPL chip or clone of said chip that is on your sound card.
- Next came MT32, Most commonly used in early Sierra's games, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_MT-32-c … _computer_games
- Next came General Midi, this was an attempt to standardize Midi. eg Instrument 15 on a MT32 is an Accordion where as on any GM device it's Tubular Bells. This is why playing GM games on a MT32 sound wrong and visa versa.

Around the same time as GM became popular few hardware manufactures got in on the act. Most common is Creative with AWE and Gravis with the Ultrasound range of cards (GUS) which give a very different sound to GM.
Keep in mind this is a very generalized overview, Dos music is a rabbit hole of a topic which has caused many discussions here if your really interested.

Well I did google a bit about DOS and sound ... and therefore I just made this topic about two soundcards I actually have ( Well I have more but the ESS seems to be compatible with more or less everything and the only one with an IDE connector on it ). Just one question ... "General Midi" is that like the dreamblaster or are we talking about a Sound Canvas in that case ? Or are both compatible ?

SimonV wrote:

Well I did google a bit about DOS and sound ... and therefore I just made this topic about two soundcards I actually have ( Well I have more but the ESS seems to be compatible with more or less everything and the only one with an IDE connector on it ). Just one question ... "General Midi" is that like the dreamblaster or are we talking about a Sound Canvas in that case ? Or are both compatible ?

General MIDI is a standard that describes which instrument is at which position so music for one device will play similarly on another - not the same as the sounds of the instruments themselves can and will differ, and different devices can (or can't) do various effects.

Roland's Sound Canvas SC-55v2 was the first General MIDI device, the Dreamblaster is a modern GM device. They fulfill the same role. Both are pretty highly regarded, but it's a matter of taste which is better. Also, as the Dreamblaster gets mounted on a sound card, the quality (SNR) of the output is dependent on that card, where the SC-55v2 is a standalone module with good quality output.

I own several GM devices, from some really crappy soundcards with equally crappy onboard 'wavetable' up to a sublime Yamaha MU50 XG module, and enjoy listening to the differences between them. As already stated, DOS sound cards are a big rabbit hole you can go down, the same applies to MIDI devices 😉

Oh, and as for your original question: why not both? Two sound cards in one machine is usually pretty easy to configure, just put one (the ESS1868F) at A220 I5 D1 P330 and the other (the AWE64) at A240 I7 D3 H5 P300. That way you get both SBPro2 and SB16 support, and you can use game settings to decide which one to use.

dionb wrote:

Oh, and as for your original question: why not both? Two sound cards in one machine is usually pretty easy to configure, just put one (the ESS1868F) at A220 I5 D1 P330 and the other (the AWE64) at A240 I7 D3 H5 P300. That way you get both SBPro2 and SB16 support, and you can use game settings to decide which one to use.

Well my machine is a hybrid between a Commodore Amiga A3000T and pc-on-a-card called the Commodore A2386 bridgeboard ( with a make-it486 module ) itself / pc on a card. So two soundcards would force me to remove the I/O card and use the Amiga's ports and HD controller ( and that sucks because the hd access is VERY slow then and the mousedriver to use the Amiga's mouseport is crap. Obviously removing the VGA card is even worse because there's no vga emulation, only CGA / MDA .

It's a cool setup enabling me to play the short list of pc games I played at friend's home from +/- 1990 but I had an Amiga at home never playing pc games. I think I bought my first pc in 1996 or so ? Pentium 166MMX with a Voodoo Banshee. So it's not THAT important that I can cover every single DOSgame. But of course I like the tinkering with the hardware these days and get the best out of what I have.

chinny22 wrote:

However I have to disagree about CF cards not working in Master/Slave. I've only ever purchased adapters that specifically have the jumper to set this but never had any trouble on any of my systems using a mix of Sandisk Kingston, Transcend CF cards and their are definitely other builds also setup like this.

The CD-ROM will only kill speed if been used. How often this will be the case on a 486 gaming PC the OP will know best but I would think majority of games run off the HDD with the CD drive just used for installation and maybe CD audio which I don't think would effect speed either? Never tested though.

Nope. The CD-ROM can kill speed just by existing on the same cable.
If you have CD-ROM, that supports for example only up to PIO mode 4, then you can never get your CF card working in any higher PIO mode or any DMA mode.

It's a good practice to keep optical drives separate from hard drives.

SimonV wrote:

[..]

Well my machine is a hybrid between a Commodore Amiga A3000T and pc-on-a-card called the Commodore A2386 bridgeboard ( with a make-it486 module ) itself / pc on a card. So two soundcards would force me to remove the I/O card and use the Amiga's ports and HD controller ( and that sucks because the hd access is VERY slow then and the mousedriver to use the Amiga's mouseport is crap. Obviously removing the VGA card is even worse because there's no vga emulation, only CGA / MDA .

It's a cool setup enabling me to play the short list of pc games I played at friend's home from +/- 1990 but I had an Amiga at home never playing pc games. I think I bought my first pc in 1996 or so ? Pentium 166MMX with a Voodoo Banshee. So it's not THAT important that I can cover every single DOSgame. But of course I like the tinkering with the hardware these days and get the best out of what I have.

Ah, that does change matters 😉

Given the focus on early games, SBPro2 and decent OPL (ESFM>CTCM) would be top of list and I'd go for the ESS.

If you were looking for a new card for that scenario I'd recommend something like the AudioExcel AV310 with CM8330. It has both SBPro2 and SB16 support, relatively bug-free MIDI (good for the Dreamblaster) and even though the CM8330 doesn't contain an official OPL3 either, it's just as close as ESS' implementation. Oh, and SPDIF as a bonus too 😜

But tbh that ESS1868 is more than good enough.

Any compatibility or driver issues with the CMI8330 chipset?

gdjacobs wrote:

Any compatibility or driver issues with the CMI8330 chipset?

The drivers are easy to use from memory but sadly the AudioExcel doesn't like Mortal Kombat, which is a terrible krime in my book 😵

gdjacobs wrote:

Any compatibility or driver issues with the CMI8330 chipset?

It's discussed at length here:
Sound Blaster 16 Clones

No TSRs needed, just PnP init prog. Compatibility seems good in general, but with exceptions (haven't found any myself, but then Mortal Kombat isn't really my thing 😉

badmojo wrote:

gdjacobs wrote:

Any compatibility or driver issues with the CMI8330 chipset?

The drivers are easy to use from memory but sadly the AudioExcel doesn't like Mortal Kombat, which is a terrible krime in my book 😵

One might call that flaw a... Fatality?

gdjacobs wrote:

One might call that flaw a... Fatality?

🤣

FINISH IT

dionb wrote:

It's discussed at length here: Sound Blaster 16 Clones […]
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gdjacobs wrote:

Any compatibility or driver issues with the CMI8330 chipset?

It's discussed at length here:
Sound Blaster 16 Clones

No TSRs needed, just PnP init prog. Compatibility seems good in general, but with exceptions (haven't found any myself, but then Mortal Kombat isn't really my thing 😉

And its init program work on non PNP system as well. One example is my 286 - CMI8330 works perfectly fine here (while ALS100 initialization program hangs).