VOGONS


First post, by fool

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My interest for CS9233 synth began by repairing Terratec SOWT-11 watetable daughter board. I had to replace most of the main ICs to get some audio out of it, so at the same time I had to do reverse engineering. Thanks to Tiido! Eventually I had the whole schematic on my screen and decided to build it. I have some experiments ongoing how to get the best out of that chip. Of course there are also some flaws. For example big capacitors are placed and selected poorly. As I've been waiting for new PCB's I recorded this DOOM 2 END GAME track to which I can compare against later.

No high expectations.

Here's the first real recording with SB CT2940 + CS9233 WT
DOOM2 END GAME https://soundcloud.com/fool6/doom2-endgame?si … =social_sharing

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Last edited by fool on 2023-01-04, 16:24. Edited 1 time in total.

Toshiba T8500 desktop
SAM/CS9233 Wavetable Synthesizer daughterboard
Coming: 40-pin 8MB SIMM kit, CS4232 ISA wavetable sound card

Reply 1 of 11, by matze79

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Nice project!

Keep it going!

https://dosreloaded.de - The German Retro DOS PC Community
https://www.retroianer.de - under constructing since ever

Co2 - for a endless Summer

Reply 2 of 11, by Tiido

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Very nice ~

T-04YBSC, a new YMF71x based sound card & Official VOGONS thread about it
Newly made 4MB 60ns 30pin SIMMs ~
mida sa loed ? nagunii aru ei saa 😜

Reply 3 of 11, by gerwin

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Very cool!
AFAIK CS9233 is a relabeled or license-produced Dream SAM9233. "This device is available as the result of a technology partnership between Crystal Semi-conductor Corporation and DREAM S.A. of France."

I had a 4MB SAM9233 daughter board failing spectacularly a few months ago, when a tantalum capacitor burned out. I still have to repair it, maybe I can learn something here.

--> ISA Soundcard Overview // Doom MBF 2.04 // SetMul

Reply 4 of 11, by fool

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gerwin wrote on 2022-11-24, 00:02:

Very cool!
AFAIK CS9233 is a relabeled or license-produced Dream SAM9233. "This device is available as the result of a technology partnership between Crystal Semi-conductor Corporation and DREAM S.A. of France."

I had a 4MB SAM9233 daughter board failing spectacularly a few months ago, when a tantalum capacitor burned out. I still have to repair it, maybe I can learn something here.

Thats good! Not that it's broken, but because you will have to look it more closely. I have 4MB version coming and may need some help with it. Already fixed couple of minor layout issues today. It's kind of swedish "tårta på tårta" design with optional 1MB or 2x2MB ROMs and effects processor in two different packages. Would be a miracle if it rocks.

Toshiba T8500 desktop
SAM/CS9233 Wavetable Synthesizer daughterboard
Coming: 40-pin 8MB SIMM kit, CS4232 ISA wavetable sound card

Reply 5 of 11, by gerwin

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fool wrote on 2022-11-24, 18:24:

Thats good! Not that it's broken, but because you will have to look it more closely. I have 4MB version coming and may need some help with it. Already fixed couple of minor layout issues today. It's kind of swedish "tårta på tårta" design with optional 1MB or 2x2MB ROMs and effects processor in two different packages. Would be a miracle if it rocks.

Sure, hope I can help. I have two different Terratec 4MB models and one 1MB model. Another such 9233 synth is on a Terratec Maestro 32/96 sound card.

--> ISA Soundcard Overview // Doom MBF 2.04 // SetMul

Reply 6 of 11, by RetroGamer4Ever

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gerwin wrote on 2022-11-24, 00:02:

Very cool!
AFAIK CS9233 is a relabeled or license-produced Dream SAM9233. "This device is available as the result of a technology partnership between Crystal Semi-conductor Corporation and DREAM S.A. of France."

I had a 4MB SAM9233 daughter board failing spectacularly a few months ago, when a tantalum capacitor burned out. I still have to repair it, maybe I can learn something here.

Yes, they are one and the same. Crystal licensed the design, software code, and MIDI instrument sounds from DREAM (Atmel) in the early 90's, including the knock-off Roland GS bank that triggered a lawsuit from Roland at the same time Roland had just licensed their GS sounds to Microsoft and Apple and console gaming studios that wanted to use MIDI in their games, while also beginning to offer their Virtual Sound Canvas software.

Reply 7 of 11, by gerwin

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RetroGamer4Ever wrote on 2022-11-24, 20:22:

Yes, they are one and the same. Crystal licensed the design, software code, and MIDI instrument sounds from DREAM (Atmel) in the early 90's, including the knock-off Roland GS bank that triggered a lawsuit from Roland at the same time Roland had just licensed their GS sounds to Microsoft and Apple and console gaming studios that wanted to use MIDI in their games, while also beginning to offer their Virtual Sound Canvas software.

Yes, I heard about that lawsuit.
I actually like the pre-lawsuit Dream illegal soundbanks a little more then those made after the Dream/Roland-agreement. The former are my personal favorite Hardware Midi boards. Cancun FX being an example of the latter, which has a little too much bass. But all of them are great.

@fool
Below are large images of the hardware I mentioned. I don't have the back-sides on photo now.

EDIT:
Here are more such images by vogons member CHiLL72: https://www.waveblaster.nl
Here are more such images by vogons member Salient: https://www.wavetable.nl/daughterboards
The Netherlands and Belgium are the place to be now, for Dream-based midi sound 😉...
Also this place, by vogons member kira, now only an incomplete backup: https://web.archive.org/web/20110710232559/ht … ble.web.fc2.com

MEH18SN_t.jpg
MEH18SQ_t.jpg
MEH18SS_t.jpg
MEH18SU_t.jpg
MEH18V6_t.jpg

--> ISA Soundcard Overview // Doom MBF 2.04 // SetMul

Reply 8 of 11, by fool

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Build couple of pieces with rev2 PWB. This has options for CS8905 effect processor in two packages and 2+2MB or 1MB ROM configurations.
This revision has also "better" opamp, newer DAC and "audio grade" DC-block capacitors. Uploaded couple if DOOM 2 tracks, but haven't analysed those yet. Probably difference is close to zero. Biggest difference is that CS8905 version volume level is only half of. CS9233 mixes main synth and effect channels together multiplied by 0.5. Because there's no effects in DOOM 2 tracks the output level will be half. I amplified recordings some level but still much quieter than previous recordings.
DOOM 2 ENTRYWAY: https://on.soundcloud.com/FxMgD
DOOM 2 ENDGAME: https://on.soundcloud.com/eYqbG

I heard that 4MB ROM needs different firmware, nevertheless I had to try how it sounds. (board in the second picture) Produced "music" was strange like modern art. Some DOOM 2 tracks were still recognizable. Still that wasn't fun enough to actually record it what was my original intention. Logically next step is to find proper firmware.

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Toshiba T8500 desktop
SAM/CS9233 Wavetable Synthesizer daughterboard
Coming: 40-pin 8MB SIMM kit, CS4232 ISA wavetable sound card

Reply 9 of 11, by fool

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Build this "latest latest & final" rev C. I really hope it will be the final revision.
This time I used SAM8905-1 because it looks badass and I need to verify it's functionality.
According to Dream datasheet it should be the second revision issue, 64MHz. Same as Crystal CS8905A, but in different package. So it's just oversized chip doing much nothing, but looks cool.
There should be also third revision of that chip, but I've never seen one.

Everything is hand soldered in about 2 hours - headache follows.

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Last edited by fool on 2023-01-15, 06:27. Edited 1 time in total.

Toshiba T8500 desktop
SAM/CS9233 Wavetable Synthesizer daughterboard
Coming: 40-pin 8MB SIMM kit, CS4232 ISA wavetable sound card

Reply 10 of 11, by Ozzuneoj

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fool wrote on 2023-01-14, 12:19:
Build this "latest latest & final" rev C. I really hope it will be the final revision. This time I used SAM8905-1 because it loo […]
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Build this "latest latest & final" rev C. I really hope it will be the final revision.
This time I used SAM8905-1 because it looks badass and I need to verify it's functionality.
According to Dream datasheet it should be the second revision issue, 64MHz. Same as Crystal CS8905A, but if different package. So it's just oversized chip doing much nothing, but looks cool.
There should be also third revision of that chip, but I've never seen one.

Everything is hand soldered in about 2 hours - headache follows.

Wow... I'm completely impressed.

It'd take me a LOT longer than 2 hours to solder all of that... and it would not have turned out that well.

Nice job!

Now for some blitting from the back buffer.

Reply 11 of 11, by Tiido

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Looks good ~

T-04YBSC, a new YMF71x based sound card & Official VOGONS thread about it
Newly made 4MB 60ns 30pin SIMMs ~
mida sa loed ? nagunii aru ei saa 😜