PowerVR Fun Thread

Discussion about old graphics cards, monitors and video related things.

Re: PowerVR Fun Thread

Postby The Serpent Rider » 2018-11-08 @ 14:02

Scali wrote:Its timing was just a bit unfortunate, as well as the choice for the media they used. The later Xbox and PS2 basically did everything better.

Not everything. PS2 had some issues with color depth and mipmapping which Dreamcast didn't had. And both PS2 and Xbox lacked hardware "It's just works!" shadow volumes.
But tech gap between Dreamcast (1998) and Xbox (2001) is still quite huge, enough to be considered different console generations. Very compact design of the Dreamcast didn't do it any favors either.
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Re: PowerVR Fun Thread

Postby leileilol » 2018-11-09 @ 13:14

The other consoles can do buffer effects. Those are 500% more important than limited shadow modifier volumes. DC can only buffer in a previous frame.

also there's mip and color depth issues with the Dreamcast as well, and I feel the early games with large contrasty busy textures tried to mask that....
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Re: PowerVR Fun Thread

Postby Garrett W » 2018-11-09 @ 16:14

If we want to get picky, I'm not sure I even like the look of low res bilinear filtered textures, and in that sense, games on the PS2 have aged a lot better for me or if you want to bring this on the PC,
Quake's Software renderer >>>>> GLQuake for me :).
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Re: PowerVR Fun Thread

Postby The Serpent Rider » 2018-11-09 @ 19:09

I'm not sure I even like the look of low res bilinear filtered textures, and in that sense, games on the PS2

They are filtered though.
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Re: PowerVR Fun Thread

Postby Garrett W » 2018-11-10 @ 14:24

Yeah, brainfart! Meant to say that PS2 games usually lack mipmapping which makes distant textures look much sharper than a lot of the games on the Dreamcast for example (Shenmue excluded of course).
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Re: PowerVR Fun Thread

Postby Scali » 2018-11-10 @ 14:36

Mipmapping can be done quite efficiently with a TBDR, on-the-fly generation of mipmaps is just another stroke of genius by the PVR designers.
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Re: PowerVR Fun Thread

Postby leileilol » 2018-11-11 @ 00:29

^ which has its disadvantages, like you can't explicitly upload mipmaps for quality tweaking or debugging (well at least I can't in OpenGL)

also by the way earlier I posted about the PC3DEngine demos out before it got buried by newpage DC fanwank
by the way, DOSBox is not for running Windows 9x
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Re: PowerVR Fun Thread

Postby sheath » 2019-2-06 @ 05:06

I managed to get Expendable running without inverted colors with my m3D PCX-2. I'm not sure if I read it here, but the force 16-bit textures setting does the trick, then the game runs amazingly slow whenever an inverted color non-transparent transparency is on screen. I'm thinking there should be other settings that could address this, maybe just turn off transparencies entirely? Has anybody had any success?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=phnTl7qNyas
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Re: PowerVR Fun Thread

Postby Garrett W » 2019-2-07 @ 00:06

Hey nice one!
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Re: PowerVR Fun Thread

Postby sheath » 2019-2-09 @ 00:37

Thanks! I really hope I can make some games that seemed like they wouldn't work to be playable at least.

Expendable at 1024x768x16 on m3D.
https://youtu.be/uUEgg0fWqyc
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Re: PowerVR Fun Thread

Postby leileilol » 2019-2-11 @ 00:37

I was looking at old Dreamcast press screenshots and noticed it blurs vertically for interlaced mode as a form of flicker reduction (sometimes mistakenly hyped as anti-aliasing by certain fans) BUT!!! I've noticed it applies it before the dither so we get a weird, dithered, flicker-reducted 16bpp image that might end up flickering a little on a TV because of the dither.


so i made a post-process shader of that in like 20 minutes
Attachments
pvr2shader.png
by the way, DOSBox is not for running Windows 9x
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Re: PowerVR Fun Thread

Postby GordonFreeman » 2019-2-11 @ 11:18

I think this may have been discussed before, but PureVex, ReVolte, and Moon Racer are PowerSGL-only, right?
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Re: PowerVR Fun Thread

Postby Myloch » 2019-2-11 @ 14:46

GordonFreeman wrote:I think this may have been discussed before, but PureVex, ReVolte, and Moon Racer are PowerSGL-only, right?

Yep, and before you ask, the chance for you to find the first one (legally or illegally) is basically zero.
"Gamer & collector for passion, I firmly believe in the preservation and the diffusion of old/rare software, against all personal egoisms"
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Re: PowerVR Fun Thread

Postby sheath » 2019-2-11 @ 15:44

leileilol wrote:I was looking at old Dreamcast press screenshots and noticed it blurs vertically for interlaced mode as a form of flicker reduction (sometimes mistakenly hyped as anti-aliasing by certain fans) BUT!!! I've noticed it applies it before the dither so we get a weird, dithered, flicker-reducted 16bpp image that might end up flickering a little on a TV because of the dither.


so i made a post-process shader of that in like 20 minutes


I've finally been able to see the dithering over VGA on my 50" plasma screen in some Dreamcast games. Full Screen dithering on PS1 and PS2 was visible over S-Video on my SDTVs, I never would have guessed it was in Shenmue too. I figured, just based on the edges, that very few if any Dreamcast games actually used anti-aliasing though. I've read from various sources that the Neon 250 and PVR2-DC renders internally at 32-bit color and then down samples, can that be confirmed here? It doesn't really matter if the image processing is adding dithering, but the more accurate information the better.
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Re: PowerVR Fun Thread

Postby leileilol » 2019-2-11 @ 19:24

ALL PowerVR cards process internally in 24-bit color no matter what, even the PCX2

The texture filter works at 18bpp though
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Re: PowerVR Fun Thread

Postby Scali » 2019-2-11 @ 20:03

leileilol wrote:ALL PowerVR cards process internally in 24-bit color no matter what, even the PCX2


Yup, 16-bit rendering is mainly for immediate mode renderers, who get bottlenecked by the lack of bandwidth in 24/32-bit mode.
Since PowerVR performs all rendering and shading inside the tile cache anyway, there is no such bottleneck, so there is little reason to even bother implementing any kind of 16-bit rendering pipeline at all. The tile can just be downconverted from 24-bit to 16-bit on-the-fly when blting it back to the framebuffer memory.
TBDR is just so beautifully elegant.
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Re: PowerVR Fun Thread

Postby GordonFreeman » 2019-2-12 @ 02:03

Myloch wrote:Yep, and before you ask, the chance for you to find the first one (legally or illegally) is basically zero.


Yeah, I know. I did find the demo, though.

I’m actually kind of surprised by how well those 3 games run on the m3D. ReVolte, for example, runs at a near-constant 60fps. I almost thought that the games were actually using my Voodoo 3, but that’s not possible since they use SGL.
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Re: PowerVR Fun Thread

Postby lolo799 » 2019-2-24 @ 20:17

Pictures from a small booklet for Enigma:
i-img480x640-1542865941eq4xn415726.jpg
i-img480x640-1542865941nrp3nw15726.jpg
i-img480x640-1542865941gugavy15726.jpg
i-img480x640-1542865941f5rzqq15726.jpg
i-img480x640-1542865941m6kcjt15726.jpg


A copy of it was sold last december for the "high" price of 500 yens... https://page.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/l444427560
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Re: PowerVR Fun Thread

Postby leileilol » 2019-4-01 @ 17:34

Heavily refactored and combined my powervr post shaders together.

Dreamcast interlaced output
pvrshader2-tv.png

PCX2 output :P
pvrshader2-pcx2.png
by the way, DOSBox is not for running Windows 9x
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