VOGONS


VGA Capture Thread

Topic actions

Reply 900 of 1000, by leileilol

User metadata
Rank l33t++
Rank
l33t++

That video quality is excellent (despite the noise which a little temporal smoother can deal with for seeing one clean frame) and serves as a strong filter reference, addressing my concerns on low-res filter behavior; thanks!

(...kind of curious on the same scene/resolutions with the 4x1 filter setting, but only if you're feeling like doing more and if that setting in 3dfx Tools makes any difference)

apsosig.png

Reply 901 of 1000, by darry

User metadata
Rank l33t
Rank
l33t
leileilol wrote on 2020-10-04, 01:19:

That video quality is excellent (despite the noise which a little temporal smoother can deal with for seeing one clean frame) and serves as a strong filter reference, addressing my concerns on low-res filter behavior; thanks!

Happy to help . I do not find that noise is readily apparent with video digitized and line-doubled on my OSSC clone when viewing on my gaming setup. I have found, however, that there is more noise than I initially thought (and ghosting at 1600x1200) on the said OSSC clone when I started capturing and looking closely at the HDMI output .

I wonder if this is normal (at least for my Voodoo 3), or whether I have a shoddy OSSC clone . The only reason I got a clone is potential shipping delays at the height of the first COVID-19 wave .

Reply 902 of 1000, by darry

User metadata
Rank l33t
Rank
l33t
leileilol wrote on 2020-10-04, 01:19:

That video quality is excellent (despite the noise which a little temporal smoother can deal with for seeing one clean frame) and serves as a strong filter reference, addressing my concerns on low-res filter behavior; thanks!

(...kind of curious on the same scene/resolutions with the 4x1 filter setting, but only if you're feeling like doing more and if that setting in 3dfx Tools makes any difference)

I will be running some more tests with the OSSC anyway once I get some more cables next week, so I could give it a shot. Where exactly is that setting ?

Reply 903 of 1000, by swaaye

User metadata
Rank Moderator
Rank
Moderator

Hey guys I have a VisionRGB E1S stutter issue.

I'm using it with OBS and am running the latest Datapath driver. I've noticed with OBS preview of the capture device at DVI 1080p 60fps there is a periodic stutter. It records the stutter too. VCS on the other hand is stutter free. So I tried OBS window capture of VCS and that works very well, until it too develops the occasional bout of stutters caused perhaps by some kind of Windows quirk (maybe brought on by E1S resolution changes causing window size changes).

I did get the card into a PCIe 4x slot so it's not because of that 1x slot I was using before. 😀

Has anyone else run into stuttering with OBS capturing a capture card?

Reply 904 of 1000, by darry

User metadata
Rank l33t
Rank
l33t
swaaye wrote on 2020-10-06, 18:18:
Hey guys I have a VisionRGB E1S stutter issue. […]
Show full quote

Hey guys I have a VisionRGB E1S stutter issue.

I'm using it with OBS and am running the latest Datapath driver. I've noticed with OBS preview of the capture device at DVI 1080p 60fps there is a periodic stutter. It records the stutter too. VCS on the other hand is stutter free. So I tried OBS window capture of VCS and that works very well, until it too develops the occasional bout of stutters caused perhaps by some kind of Windows quirk (maybe brought on by E1S resolution changes causing window size changes).

I did get the card into a PCIe 4x slot so it's not because of that 1x slot I was using before. 😀

Has anyone else run into stuttering with OBS capturing a capture card?

At what approximate time intervals do you get stutter ?

Also, you might try running something like vsynctester.com (it's good at detecting missed frame to the video card framebuffer) for a few minutes to see if you get any stutter at any intervals, possibly with and without the E1S installed, just to see if something else on your PC could be causing this .

Reply 905 of 1000, by swaaye

User metadata
Rank Moderator
Rank
Moderator
darry wrote on 2020-10-06, 18:36:

At what approximate time intervals do you get stutter ?

Also, you might try running something like vsynctester.com (it's good at detecting missed frame to the video card framebuffer) for a few minutes to see if you get any stutter at any intervals, possibly with and without the E1S installed, just to see if something else on your PC could be causing this .

VSynctester run thru Edge looks good on my capture PC.

I rebooted and went right to VCS and found it stuttering badly. But if I switch it to OpenGL rendering instead of Software, it is smooth again.

I enabled the hidden OpenGL output for OBS but that doesn't help.

The Datapath Vision program and VirtualDub with ancient VFW WDM capture mode are smooth.

Reply 906 of 1000, by swaaye

User metadata
Rank Moderator
Rank
Moderator

I reinstalled drivers for all hardware and reseated all cards. VCS is normal again and OBS window capture too. But I don't think OBS can directly capture 1080p60 fluidly through whatever driver interface it uses for the card.

I also tried pulling cards other than GPU and VisionRGB, resetting BIOS, and using VGA instead of DVI. Reduced desktop resolution (was 4K) and set Windows scaling to 100%. That OBS capture card input just stutters at 1080p60 with the VisionRGB no matter what I do.

Last edited by swaaye on 2020-10-06, 22:45. Edited 1 time in total.

Reply 907 of 1000, by Kordanor

User metadata
Rank Newbie
Rank
Newbie

Should be np with OBS, depends on your machine and the settings used. If you use an NVIDIA Card, I highly recommend their codec. It takes more space on your disc, but is very CPU efficient:
https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/geforce/guides/b … dcasting-guide/

Reply 908 of 1000, by swaaye

User metadata
Rank Moderator
Rank
Moderator
Kordanor wrote on 2020-10-06, 22:09:

Should be np with OBS, depends on your machine and the settings used. If you use an NVIDIA Card, I highly recommend their codec. It takes more space on your disc, but is very CPU efficient:
https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/geforce/guides/b … dcasting-guide/

I'm just referring to the preview. No streaming or recording happening. It has something to do with the driver used for the "Video Capture Device" source with this card I think, or however OBS is interfacing with that. Window capture from one of the other capture software options like VCS works well as long as they are behaving.

CPU usage of 8600K is almost nil. Video card is 1080 Ti.

Reply 909 of 1000, by vvbee

User metadata
Rank Oldbie
Rank
Oldbie
swaaye wrote on 2020-10-06, 19:06:

I rebooted and went right to VCS and found it stuttering badly. But if I switch it to OpenGL rendering instead of Software, it is smooth again.

When you get stuttering in VCS, does its window title bar begin with "{!} VCS" or just "VCS"? If it's with "{!}", it's a system performance issue. If not, it's more likely a capture-side issue. You could shoot a quick video of the stuttering onto Youtube.

Reply 910 of 1000, by swaaye

User metadata
Rank Moderator
Rank
Moderator
vvbee wrote on 2020-10-07, 01:34:

When you get stuttering in VCS, does its window title bar begin with "{!} VCS" or just "VCS"? If it's with "{!}", it's a system performance issue. If not, it's more likely a capture-side issue. You could shoot a quick video of the stuttering onto Youtube.

Hey vvbee,

VCS is actually working perfectly now. I don't know what the cause was of its stuttering behavior. I'm seeing good results with OBS window capture of VCS.

Reply 911 of 1000, by vvbee

User metadata
Rank Oldbie
Rank
Oldbie

The only time I've seen capture-side stutter like that is when you have duplicates of the capture stream open, i.e. you have both VCS and the Datapath software capturing at the same time. This can also happen if your capture software doesn't properly release the stream on exit.

Reply 913 of 1000, by swaaye

User metadata
Rank Moderator
Rank
Moderator
vvbee wrote on 2020-10-07, 11:51:

The only time I've seen capture-side stutter like that is when you have duplicates of the capture stream open, i.e. you have both VCS and the Datapath software capturing at the same time. This can also happen if your capture software doesn't properly release the stream on exit.

It is definitely related to cpu load. I have almost given up on realtime capture with x264 regardless of settings and use only NVENC. It seems like the Datapath driver is sensitive to any more than minimal cpu load. I have a 6 core 8600K. Also, OBS is only completely fluid with Window capture when capturing at 1080p60. I guess this means the Datapath driver isn't working well with OBS. Older drivers didn't help. VCS and Vision are fluid.

Sometimes a reboot is needed to return to fluidity. Capture driver interface quirks perhaps...

I put my PC to sleep instead of shutdown so perhaps that doesn't agree with capture card drivers.

Reply 914 of 1000, by darry

User metadata
Rank l33t
Rank
l33t
leileilol wrote on 2020-10-09, 03:06:
darry wrote on 2020-10-04, 01:59:

Where exactly is that setting ?

Should be under 3D Filter Quality. Normal forces 4x1, High forces 2x2.

Thank you, I will have a look at that in the next few days and try to capture some footage .

Reply 915 of 1000, by darry

User metadata
Rank l33t
Rank
l33t
swaaye wrote on 2020-10-10, 20:54:
It is definitely related to cpu load. I have almost given up on realtime capture with x264 regardless of settings and use only N […]
Show full quote
vvbee wrote on 2020-10-07, 11:51:

The only time I've seen capture-side stutter like that is when you have duplicates of the capture stream open, i.e. you have both VCS and the Datapath software capturing at the same time. This can also happen if your capture software doesn't properly release the stream on exit.

It is definitely related to cpu load. I have almost given up on realtime capture with x264 regardless of settings and use only NVENC. It seems like the Datapath driver is sensitive to any more than minimal cpu load. I have a 6 core 8600K. Also, OBS is only completely fluid with Window capture when capturing at 1080p60. I guess this means the Datapath driver isn't working well with OBS. Older drivers didn't help. VCS and Vision are fluid.

Sometimes a reboot is needed to return to fluidity. Capture driver interface quirks perhaps...

I put my PC to sleep instead of shutdown so perhaps that doesn't agree with capture card drivers.

I have an i9 9900K CPU, and I have no issues with capturing using x264 using an E1S at 1600x1200 in RGB (for some reason RGB24 does not work for me over DVI from an OSSC, so I capture in RGB32 and truncate the empty alpha channel to RGB24). I capture using x264 lossless settings, use low compression (Ultrafast, I have not tried the slower modes), zero latency mode and RGB mode (E1S settings and x264 codec settings) to avoid any image degradation . My capture application is Virtualdub2 and the only change that I have done is to increase disk buffer size slightly (this may not even be necessary). I use two old Samsung HD204UI 5400rpm 2TB drives in RAID0 (Windows 10 software RAID) as a dedicated capture drive .

I did not bother taking note of exact CPU load, but I am pretty sure it was below 20% .

Reply 916 of 1000, by swaaye

User metadata
Rank Moderator
Rank
Moderator
darry wrote on 2020-10-11, 03:58:

I have an i9 9900K CPU, and I have no issues with capturing using x264 using an E1S at 1600x1200 in RGB (for some reason RGB24 does not work for me over DVI from an OSSC, so I capture in RGB32 and truncate the empty alpha channel to RGB24). I capture using x264 lossless settings, use low compression (Ultrafast, I have not tried the slower modes), zero latency mode and RGB mode (E1S settings and x264 codec settings) to avoid any image degradation . My capture application is Virtualdub2 and the only change that I have done is to increase disk buffer size slightly (this may not even be necessary). I use two old Samsung HD204UI 5400rpm 2TB drives in RAID0 (Windows 10 software RAID) as a dedicated capture drive .

I did not bother taking note of exact CPU load, but I am pretty sure it was below 20% .

Have you tried OBS? I have been using it for recording and also trying some of that newfangled streaming stuff 🤣. But I think it could be a bit touchy or just not great with the Datapath card.

I was using Virtualdub back in 2012/2013 with the Avermedia Game Broadcaster HD. I remember tweaking x264vfw. VDub is certainly solid software. So many software choices these days.

Reply 917 of 1000, by darry

User metadata
Rank l33t
Rank
l33t
swaaye wrote on 2020-10-11, 07:51:
darry wrote on 2020-10-11, 03:58:

I have an i9 9900K CPU, and I have no issues with capturing using x264 using an E1S at 1600x1200 in RGB (for some reason RGB24 does not work for me over DVI from an OSSC, so I capture in RGB32 and truncate the empty alpha channel to RGB24). I capture using x264 lossless settings, use low compression (Ultrafast, I have not tried the slower modes), zero latency mode and RGB mode (E1S settings and x264 codec settings) to avoid any image degradation . My capture application is Virtualdub2 and the only change that I have done is to increase disk buffer size slightly (this may not even be necessary). I use two old Samsung HD204UI 5400rpm 2TB drives in RAID0 (Windows 10 software RAID) as a dedicated capture drive .

I did not bother taking note of exact CPU load, but I am pretty sure it was below 20% .

Have you tried OBS? I have been using it for recording and also trying some of that newfangled streaming stuff 🤣. But I think it could be a bit touchy or just not great with the Datapath card.

I was using Virtualdub back in 2012/2013 with the Avermedia Game Broadcaster HD. I remember tweaking x264vfw. VDub is certainly solid software. So many software choices these days.

I do not intend to livestream using the E1S, so I did not bother trying OBS with it . I might give it a shot, just to test it (will report back if I do).

IMHO, if livestreaming is the use case, the E1S quality and RGB capability are overkill anyway. Though, it would be nice if it could work for people with that use case, as the card is inexpensive, well made and has extensive input resolution/refresh rate support.

I just thought about something, are you trying to capture 60Hz content at 60fps or are you using the E1S to downconvert the framerate ?

Also, just to be clear, I am using a Virtualdub2, an updated fork of Virtualdub. Virtualdub itself has not seen an update since 2013 . I also used to use the original Virtualdub back in the day . Kudos to Avery Lee for starting that from scratch .

Reply 918 of 1000, by swaaye

User metadata
Rank Moderator
Rank
Moderator
darry wrote on 2020-10-11, 13:25:
I do not intend to livestream using the E1S, so I did not bother trying OBS with it . I might give it a shot, just to test it (w […]
Show full quote

I do not intend to livestream using the E1S, so I did not bother trying OBS with it . I might give it a shot, just to test it (will report back if I do).

IMHO, if livestreaming is the use case, the E1S quality and RGB capability are overkill anyway. Though, it would be nice if it could work for people with that use case, as the card is inexpensive, well made and has extensive input resolution/refresh rate support.

I just thought about something, are you trying to capture 60Hz content at 60fps or are you using the E1S to downconvert the framerate ?

Also, just to be clear, I am using a Virtualdub2, an updated fork of Virtualdub. Virtualdub itself has not seen an update since 2013 . I also used to use the original Virtualdub back in the day . Kudos to Avery Lee for starting that from scratch .

I have not tried any framerate changes. So far I've recorded from 800x600 up to 1080p 60fps. I did get both Virtualdub2 and the original. I didn't know about Virtualdub2 until I read one of your posts.

I've been doing a mix of gameplay and hardware videos. For the gameplay, going livestream seemed like an interesting experiment. I felt like checking out gameplay on some old NVidia Tegra tablets and the XBox 360 version of Alien Isolation for example. But for the hardware vids I need to do a lot of editing.

Reply 919 of 1000, by Dosboxxer

User metadata
Rank Newbie
Rank
Newbie

Not sure if this helps, but I want to capture pixel perfect captures and I've been reading up on Integer-ratio scaling.

This article seems to help shed a lot of light on the subject.

https://tanalin.com/en/articles/integer-scaling/

My RetroRig: IBM 300gl, Pentium II 400, 192mb Ram, S3 Trio64 2mb, SB16 Value
Win98 SE 4.10.22222 A