Converter was somewhere in this thread: https://www.arcaderenovations.com/arcade-cga- … rter-board.html
I oredered it on ebay from China, delivery would take up to 3 months.
HDMI grabber I'm taking is the cheapest one for less than $10 on aliexpress

darry wrote on 2020-12-21, 18:19:

lukas12p wrote on 2020-12-21, 15:20:

Delivery + taxes to Europe are $80 😒
I will order this from China + HDMI grabber

Let us know it works out .

Do you have a model or manual for that converter and the HDMI grabber you ordered ?

I'm the one that posted that board a page or two ago asking IF they would even work, They are MEANT for arcade machines video output, and wasnt even for sure it would be something compatible with a computer. So i guess we will find out once he replies on it? 🤣

I tested this VGA to HDMI scaler: https://aliexpress.com/item/32971318124.html

What's bad about it?
*Quality is terrible:
-scaling artifacts: white is not pure white but slightly grey; texts and sharp lines can have have bright white outline
-vertical image banding
-switching resolution between 720p and 1080p doesn't seem to have absolutely any impact, image is blurry and low res all the time (even though the output resolution indeed changes)
-info overlay after each resolution change lasting around 10 seconds
I wonder though how much of this is caused by poorly coded firmware vs the actual hardware.

What's good about it?
-Works out of the box
-70 Hz and DOS resolutions seem to actually work
-Pretty low latency, i tested it only through capture card and most of the delay was probably caused by capture card itself
-you can buy it with fixed price

Video capture example https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4bwGUkB2v7w

Do i recommend it? No 😁 but a PCI-e card or used hardware with low availability is still a no-go in my case

adalbert wrote on 2020-12-21, 22:44:

I tested this VGA to HDMI scaler: https://aliexpress.com/item/32971318124.html […]
Show full quote

I tested this VGA to HDMI scaler: https://aliexpress.com/item/32971318124.html

What's bad about it?
*Quality is terrible:
-scaling artifacts: white is not pure white but slightly grey; texts and sharp lines can have have bright white outline
-vertical image banding
-switching resolution between 720p and 1080p doesn't seem to have absolutely any impact, image is blurry and low res all the time (even though the output resolution indeed changes)
-info overlay after each resolution change lasting around 10 seconds
I wonder though how much of this is caused by poorly coded firmware vs the actual hardware.

What's good about it?
-Works out of the box
-70 Hz and DOS resolutions seem to actually work
-Pretty low latency, i tested it only through capture card and most of the delay was probably caused by capture card itself
-you can buy it with fixed price

Video capture example https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4bwGUkB2v7w

Do i recommend it? No 😁 but a PCI-e card or used hardware with low availability is still a no-go in my case

AFAIK, there are new alternatives from Datapath, but they are eye-wateringly expensive .

A setup with an RGB capable USB 3 HDMI capture device (not cheap) plus an OSSC is new, available and not that cheap, but almost certainly cheaper than any Datapath product .

If you can live with 4:2:2 subsampling, an Elgato/Corsair Camlink 4K plus OSSC is another new, available and cheaper option .

imi wrote on 2020-12-16, 13:26:

I created that mainly directly within OBS via a whole array of filters and shaders and custom alpha masks, was quite a bit of wo […]
Show full quote

bumpnthump05 wrote on 2020-12-15, 16:28:

This question is more aimed at IMI, but how did you manage to create a CRT bezel overlay like that with reflective properties around the edge of the CRT bezel? I have only seen that done before through retroarch. Is what you're using to generate the bezel reflections playing your capture through the ffmpeg core and then grabbing the output of retroarch for your OBS?

I created that mainly directly within OBS via a whole array of filters and shaders and custom alpha masks, was quite a bit of work to get it just right ^^
basically I'm creating the reflections manually from mirroring the captured image, so yeah, very similar to the above ^^
for the curvature and scanlines I used the preexisting shaders from StreamFX and slightly modified them to fit my image better, on the chat monitor there's also 3D transform involved.

I wish I was fluent enough in shaders to create it all as one shader, that would probably be a lot less taxing on hardware too.

I appreciate your reply. I am going to start trying to create my streaming layout for when i am going to stream retro pc games tonight. I was curious about the artwork though, did you create that yourself or did you have someone else do that? I want to create something similar in that type of design, my photoshop skills are moderate at best, but i'm unable to create scenes or photos, i primarily excel in logos. This is my logo for my twitch channel i created.

bumpnthump05 wrote on 2020-12-22, 21:16:

imi wrote on 2020-12-16, 13:26:

I created that mainly directly within OBS via a whole array of filters and shaders and custom alpha masks, was quite a bit of wo […]
Show full quote

bumpnthump05 wrote on 2020-12-15, 16:28:

This question is more aimed at IMI, but how did you manage to create a CRT bezel overlay like that with reflective properties around the edge of the CRT bezel? I have only seen that done before through retroarch. Is what you're using to generate the bezel reflections playing your capture through the ffmpeg core and then grabbing the output of retroarch for your OBS?

I created that mainly directly within OBS via a whole array of filters and shaders and custom alpha masks, was quite a bit of work to get it just right ^^
basically I'm creating the reflections manually from mirroring the captured image, so yeah, very similar to the above ^^
for the curvature and scanlines I used the preexisting shaders from StreamFX and slightly modified them to fit my image better, on the chat monitor there's also 3D transform involved.

I wish I was fluent enough in shaders to create it all as one shader, that would probably be a lot less taxing on hardware too.

I appreciate your reply. I am going to start trying to create my streaming layout for when i am going to stream retro pc games tonight. I was curious about the artwork though, did you create that yourself or did you have someone else do that? I want to create something similar in that type of design, my photoshop skills are moderate at best, but i'm unable to create scenes or photos, i primarily excel in logos. This is my logo for my twitch channel i created.

47097557_1172541462893252_8039570739591905280_o.jpg

Nice logo . It has something of a Scanimate vibe to it .

Well, Im not sure if the used card i ordered on ebay is dead, or im finding the wrong drivers for my PC or something. When i go to install the drivers, The "Drivers" and "Application" boxes are greyed out. Might try my other PCIE slot on my mobo.

Are drivers dedicated for Your Windows version?
If they are old they might not be "signed" and then You need to install they in special windows startup mode

bumpnthump05 wrote on 2020-12-26, 20:29:

Well, Im not sure if the used card i ordered on ebay is dead, or im finding the wrong drivers for my PC or something. When i go to install the drivers, The "Drivers" and "Application" boxes are greyed out. Might try my other PCIE slot on my mobo.

I got it working! It was just in one of my PCIE slots that is disabled due to my SATA and M.2 Drives. Just need to adjust settings and alignment, but from factory this thing is pretty spot on!!! Cant wait to dial it in and stream it on twitch!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UyRJ8pMjpgw

Here is a screenshot

bumpnthump05 wrote on 2020-12-26, 21:52:

Here is a screenshot
screenshot.png

IMHO, If you want maximum sharpness, you should capture at the same resolution as what the video card is outputting, then use integer scaling (equivalent to line multiplication) to get as close as possible to your target resolution and then finally use a quality scaling algorithm to reach your desired final resolution and aspect ratio .

EDIT: I just watched your video . I think I now understand that your aim is not preserving maximum sharpness but going for a software simulated, curved, soft-focus vintage CRT look with bonus scan lines and slightly warm color-leaning color balance . Feel free to ignore my comments about sharpness, I guess I just misunderstood what you are aiming to do .

EDIT2 : IMHO, to add that look of yours, I would consider adding a bit of CRT blooming and maybe a slight mis-convergence effect . Also IMHO, there is something slightly off in the curvature effect (maybe it's slight overdone, I can't really say) . The TTX CRT monitor we had at home was actually quite good and sharp at VGA resolutions, but I had friends who used worse monitors with coarser dot pitch and worse picture quality that resemble the effect I think you're going for . Thank you for the trip down memory lane !

darry wrote on 2020-12-27, 05:13:

bumpnthump05 wrote on 2020-12-26, 21:52:

Here is a screenshot
screenshot.png

IMHO, If you want maximum sharpness, you should capture at the same resolution as what the video card is outputting, then use integer scaling (equivalent to line multiplication) to get as close as possible to your target resolution and then finally use a quality scaling algorithm to reach your desired final resolution and aspect ratio .

a) As an example, here is the same image as yours captured from a Voodoo 3's VGA output (320x200 line-doubled by video card to 640x400), line-doubled a second time by an OSSC to 1280x800 (could have been done in software instead, after capture, with identical results) and captured by a Datapath E1S in RGB32 with lossless codec :

b) The same image as a, but scaled to 1280x960 (Lanczos) in order to get the proper 4:3 aspect ratio (original pixels are non square) :

EDIT : See edit in my previous post . I think I misunderstood bumpnthump05's objective .

I like a bit of blur better, it more closely resembles the real budget CRT that I have (and I had with my 486). They never were sharp, also not in Windows if you went above 60 Hz to prevent headaches. Only when I got a good weekend job I could afford a proper CRT and after that I went with LCD and entered the sharp pixel era.

digistorm wrote on 2020-12-27, 15:12:

I like a bit of blur better, it more closely resembles the real budget CRT that I have (and I had with my 486). They never were sharp, also not in Windows if you went above 60 Hz to prevent headaches. Only when I got a good weekend job I could afford a proper CRT and after that I went with LCD and entered the sharp pixel era.

Disgusting, why would you want to emulate or relive poverty?

darry wrote on 2020-12-27, 05:13:

IMHO, If you want maximum sharpness, you should capture at the same resolution as what the video card is outputting, then use in […]
Show full quote

bumpnthump05 wrote on 2020-12-26, 21:52:

Here is a screenshot
screenshot.png

IMHO, If you want maximum sharpness, you should capture at the same resolution as what the video card is outputting, then use integer scaling (equivalent to line multiplication) to get as close as possible to your target resolution and then finally use a quality scaling algorithm to reach your desired final resolution and aspect ratio .

EDIT: I just watched your video . I think I now understand that your aim is not preserving maximum sharpness but going for a software simulated, curved, soft-focus vintage CRT look with bonus scan lines and slightly warm color-leaning color balance . Feel free to ignore my comments about sharpness, I guess I just misunderstood what you are aiming to do .

EDIT2 : IMHO, to add that look of yours, I would consider adding a bit of CRT blooming and maybe a slight mis-convergence effect . Also IMHO, there is something slightly off in the curvature effect (maybe it's slight overdone, I can't really say) . The TTX CRT monitor we had at home was actually quite good and sharp at VGA resolutions, but I had friends who used worse monitors with coarser dot pitch and worse picture quality that resemble the effect I think you're going for . Thank you for the trip down memory lane !

Yes, I would like maximum sharpness, but in all honesty it wont do me any good due to Twitch's compression and loss due to bitrate. Plus i am going for that nostalgic feel for the users watching. I do have a "NTSC Bleeding" effect filter i can put on my capture via my OBS shaders but i honestly dont like it very much. I think it over does it.
But although i do want quality for screen shots, anybody can see most pixel perfect stuff on YouTube without the effects. I'm not going to be capturing for YouTube but streaming on Twitch, That wouldn't stop me to try and make it better though, but I'm having issues with Vision even opening up. I click both Vision Window & Vision Configure and the processes run in my Task Manager, But nothing pops up to adjust. I've tried other drivers as well. I do know my capture i posted is 800x600 in windows and even my windows capture looks blurry. The only video settings i can adjust are the ones that pop up the dialog box when I click video properties in OBS. I have learned that they DO NOT SAVE. So before i can try and make this any better, I have to figure out how to save my settings, or make it better somehow. Although it would suffice for twitch streaming, the alignment is even slightly off.

maxtherabbit wrote on 2020-12-27, 16:08:

digistorm wrote on 2020-12-27, 15:12:

I like a bit of blur better, it more closely resembles the real budget CRT that I have (and I had with my 486). They never were sharp, also not in Windows if you went above 60 Hz to prevent headaches. Only when I got a good weekend job I could afford a proper CRT and after that I went with LCD and entered the sharp pixel era.

Disgusting, why would you want to emulate or relive poverty?

IMHO, the kind of normal softness seen on quality 15KHz CRT NTSC monitors used with older computers and video games, could be desirable .

AFAICR, even 1980s vintage quality VGA monitors were sharp in standard VGA modes. That is likely why my preference is for sharp VGA graphics without smoothing. Additionally, liked my CRTs with as little curvature as possible. I am not a fan of the fishbowl look .

That said, I understand people who try to simulate a cheap monitor aesthetic . If it's nostalgic for them, then great . Personally, I am never going to do that for VGA games, but I do not mind occasionally seeing a cheap VGA CRT monitor effect being simulated in a movie or online video as long as it is done realistically and tastefully. IMHO, it is easy to overdo it and/or to fall into a sort of "uncanny valley" where it just looks off .

Just my 2 cents .

maxtherabbit wrote on 2020-12-27, 16:08:

digistorm wrote on 2020-12-27, 15:12:

I like a bit of blur better, it more closely resembles the real budget CRT that I have (and I had with my 486). They never were sharp, also not in Windows if you went above 60 Hz to prevent headaches. Only when I got a good weekend job I could afford a proper CRT and after that I went with LCD and entered the sharp pixel era.

Disgusting, why would you want to emulate or relive poverty?

I guess you could have the same argument about Soundblaster cards and why you would want to use one if Roland provided the better sound back then. But I guess for most of us the sound the soundblaster makes is most nostalgic.

bumpnthump05 wrote on 2020-12-27, 17:11:

Yes, I would like maximum sharpness, but in all honesty it wont do me any good due to Twitch's compression and loss due to bitra […]
Show full quote

darry wrote on 2020-12-27, 05:13:

IMHO, If you want maximum sharpness, you should capture at the same resolution as what the video card is outputting, then use in […]
Show full quote

bumpnthump05 wrote on 2020-12-26, 21:52:

Here is a screenshot
screenshot.png

IMHO, If you want maximum sharpness, you should capture at the same resolution as what the video card is outputting, then use integer scaling (equivalent to line multiplication) to get as close as possible to your target resolution and then finally use a quality scaling algorithm to reach your desired final resolution and aspect ratio .

EDIT: I just watched your video . I think I now understand that your aim is not preserving maximum sharpness but going for a software simulated, curved, soft-focus vintage CRT look with bonus scan lines and slightly warm color-leaning color balance . Feel free to ignore my comments about sharpness, I guess I just misunderstood what you are aiming to do .

EDIT2 : IMHO, to add that look of yours, I would consider adding a bit of CRT blooming and maybe a slight mis-convergence effect . Also IMHO, there is something slightly off in the curvature effect (maybe it's slight overdone, I can't really say) . The TTX CRT monitor we had at home was actually quite good and sharp at VGA resolutions, but I had friends who used worse monitors with coarser dot pitch and worse picture quality that resemble the effect I think you're going for . Thank you for the trip down memory lane !

Yes, I would like maximum sharpness, but in all honesty it wont do me any good due to Twitch's compression and loss due to bitrate. Plus i am going for that nostalgic feel for the users watching. I do have a "NTSC Bleeding" effect filter i can put on my capture via my OBS shaders but i honestly dont like it very much. I think it over does it.
But although i do want quality for screen shots, anybody can see most pixel perfect stuff on YouTube without the effects. I'm not going to be capturing for YouTube but streaming on Twitch, That wouldn't stop me to try and make it better though, but I'm having issues with Vision even opening up. I click both Vision Window & Vision Configure and the processes run in my Task Manager, But nothing pops up to adjust. I've tried other drivers as well. I do know my capture i posted is 800x600 in windows and even my windows capture looks blurry. The only video settings i can adjust are the ones that pop up the dialog box when I click video properties in OBS. I have learned that they DO NOT SAVE. So before i can try and make this any better, I have to figure out how to save my settings, or make it better somehow. Although it would suffice for twitch streaming, the alignment is even slightly off.

Capture2.JPG

Try VCS, it should have better configurability. Although maybe not so good for OBS since it outputs in OpenGL.

bumpnthump05 wrote on 2020-12-27, 17:11:

Yes, I would like maximum sharpness, but in all honesty it wont do me any good due to Twitch's compression and loss due to bitrate. Plus i am going for that nostalgic feel for the users watching. I do have a "NTSC Bleeding" effect filter i can put on my capture via my OBS shaders but i honestly dont like it very much. I think it over does it.
But although i do want quality for screen shots, anybody can see most pixel perfect stuff on YouTube without the effects. I'm not going to be capturing for YouTube but streaming on Twitch, That wouldn't stop me to try and make it better though, but I'm having issues with Vision even opening up. I click both Vision Window & Vision Configure and the processes run in my Task Manager, But nothing pops up to adjust. I've tried other drivers as well. I do know my capture i posted is 800x600 in windows and even my windows capture looks blurry. The only video settings i can adjust are the ones that pop up the dialog box when I click video properties in OBS. I have learned that they DO NOT SAVE. So before i can try and make this any better, I have to figure out how to save my settings, or make it better somehow. Although it would suffice for twitch streaming, the alignment is even slightly off.

Capture2.JPG

Try VCS, it should have better configurability. Although maybe not so good for OBS since it outputs in OpenGL.

vvbee wrote on 2020-12-27, 18:59:

bumpnthump05 wrote on 2020-12-27, 17:11:

Yes, I would like maximum sharpness, but in all honesty it wont do me any good due to Twitch's compression and loss due to bitrate. Plus i am going for that nostalgic feel for the users watching. I do have a "NTSC Bleeding" effect filter i can put on my capture via my OBS shaders but i honestly dont like it very much. I think it over does it.
But although i do want quality for screen shots, anybody can see most pixel perfect stuff on YouTube without the effects. I'm not going to be capturing for YouTube but streaming on Twitch, That wouldn't stop me to try and make it better though, but I'm having issues with Vision even opening up. I click both Vision Window & Vision Configure and the processes run in my Task Manager, But nothing pops up to adjust. I've tried other drivers as well. I do know my capture i posted is 800x600 in windows and even my windows capture looks blurry. The only video settings i can adjust are the ones that pop up the dialog box when I click video properties in OBS. I have learned that they DO NOT SAVE. So before i can try and make this any better, I have to figure out how to save my settings, or make it better somehow. Although it would suffice for twitch streaming, the alignment is even slightly off.

Capture2.JPG

Try VCS, it should have better configurability. Although maybe not so good for OBS since it outputs in OpenGL.

I find that using an OSSC as a digitizer and then using a DVI or HDMI capture card like an E1S is quite convenient .

Advantages (for me) are

a) Analogue adjustments are very easy to do using OSSC's on screen display. Doing these on the OSSC is, IMHO, more convenient than doing the equivalent on the E1S capture PC .

b) Using OSSC to feed an HDMI splitter allows the use of a modern monitor with the best possible quality and low latency while capturing at the same time using a capture PC .

Bonus point: using an HDMI/DVI switch before the HDMI/ DVI splitter allows easily switching to using a natively HDMI/DVI equipped card for both play and capture .

Obviously, an OSSC costs additional money, but since I was already using one, it made sense for me to use it's digitized output to feed the E1S digitally .

P.S. I have not gotten to audio capture yet, but the plan is to feed a USB S/PDIF capture card on the capture PC with the output of the VS-880EX that I use as a digital mixer .

Hopefully, I will actually get to use this setup for something other than a proof of concept .