VOGONS


First post, by MrKsoft

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I was putting together an Athlon XP build and have run into some issues using a Radeon 9700...

The system is as follows, not much in there yet:

Asus A7V8X-X (VIA KT400 chipset) - latest bios 1014.002 installed
Athlon XP Thoroughbred-B 2600+
2x1GB DDR-333
Radeon 9700 (standard version, 128MB)
Promise SATAII150-TX4 card

I can't even boot Windows with the ATI drivers installed, I get a "The device driver got stuck in an infinite loop" BSOD (error code 0x000000ea). Tried a few driver versions with no luck. It works fine with standard framebuffer stuff. I know the card works fine because it runs without issue in my Pentium 4 system with an 845 chipset. I've also tried swapping the chipset drivers out for the official VIA ones instead of the Windows defaults, no change.

I did some Googling and it looks like there were a lot of issues with the KT400 (and most other AGP 8X chipsets) and the R300 cards initially, but I thought they had eventually been resolved. It seemed to stem from an immature AGP 8X implementation but was eased by later BIOS updates and could be helped by setting the AGP mode to 4x. Unfortunately, the A7V8X-X doesn't let me change the AGP speed at all-- it's visible but can't be selected even though the manual says I should be able to. (Actually the manual shows several AGP tweaking options that aren't present!) I wonder if it only activates if I change some other setting?

Anyway, I was wondering if anybody had experience with these cards and KT400, or even this board in particular. Any magic tweaks? I know Athlon XP chipsets can be finicky sometimes... but I really don't want to have to move down to my next most powerful AGP card because it's a Geforce 5200 Ultra. 🙁 I guess I could buy a later card like an X800 or a 6800, but the prices are not particularly great. I'd like to be able to use the 9700 if possible-- it does have some nostalgic value to me as well as it is a card I used back in 2003.

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Reply 1 of 8, by Imperious

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Interesting Problem. I have a much older Abit KT7-raid with KT133 chipset and that had no problems with a
9800XT. I think I even had a HD3650 running on it at one point.

I hope Your power supply has a powerful +5v rail, as the Athlon XP chips and earlier all run off the 5v rail as
opposed to 12v rail on P4's Athlon 64 and later. More than 30A would be needed.
You didn't mention what OS You have installed either, although I assume Windows XP?

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Reply 2 of 8, by MrKsoft

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Yeah, this issue seems to be specifically a KT400 issue, alongside contemporary chipsets supporting AGP 8X (SiS 648, P4X400). I do have a KT7-RAID and an Asus A7V266 (KT266) but both need recapped badly -- actually the A7V266 might not work at all, I just rescued it from a PC that was in someone's garage for years I think it's rusted out a bit too. I am aware of the amperage needs for an AXP, the PSU in the system has 34A on +5V. I have another I could try but it is right at 30A.

One option I am looking at right now is grabbing my other 9700 out of my Power Mac G5. It is a flashed PC card and might be a slightly later revision. I'll have to see if the other card can take the Mac ROM flash though... so it's a bit complicated and that's why I haven't gone through with it yet. Going to hold off but keep it in the back of my head.

And sorry, yeah, this is WinXP. I was up way too late last night troubleshooting so my post is a bit of a ramble and I forgot. 😀

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Reply 3 of 8, by appiah4

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Known VIA/ATI AGP issue, I had a similar problem on a KT600 board. Just Force it to run at AGP 4x via BIOS and SmartGART and you will lose nothing.

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Reply 4 of 8, by MrKsoft

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That's the problem though, the BIOS does not seem to allow me to change the AGP speed*. It is greyed out and just stays at "AGP 8X". Can I tweak SmartGART settings without the driver loaded? I can get into Safe Mode for registry changes or whatnot

*Despite the manual saying I can.

AGP Capability [8X Mode]
This motherboard supports the AGP 8X interface that enables enhanced graphics performance with high bandwidth speeds up to 2.12GB/s. AGP8X-X is backward-compatible. When set to [1X Mode], the AGP interface only provides a peak datathroughput of 266MB/s even if you are using an AGP 8X card.
Configuration options: [Auto] [1X Mode] [2X Mode] [4X Mode] [8X Mode]

The following options are described too but don't exist. I wonder why? Was the manual based on an internal version with more options?

AGP Drive Strength [Auto]
Configuration options: [Auto] [Manual]

AGP Drive N Control [E]
Configuration options: [0][1][2][3][4][5][6][7][8][9][A][B][C][D][E][F]

AGP Drive P Control [F]
Configuration options: [0][1][2][3][4][5][6][7][8][9][A][B][C][D][E][F]

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Reply 5 of 8, by matze79

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The 9700 was incompatible with some Mainboards, its fixed in 96xx and 98xx Series

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Reply 6 of 8, by appiah4

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Reboot into Safe Mode, run ATI Control Panel, under SmartGART set AGP speed to 4x, reboot.

Retronautics: A digital gallery of my retro computers, hardware and projects.

Reply 7 of 8, by MrKsoft

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Well, I got somewhere but I'm not exactly sure how.

I realized that I might be able to adjust the AGP Capability in the BIOS if I wasn't actively using an AGP card, so I swapped in a PCI card and was able to actually change it from Auto to 4X. Unfortunately, putting the 9700 back in still made it say 8X. However this swap had the weird side effect of Windows suddenly being able to boot up normally. Although 3D acceleration caused the system to lock up and all tools reported that the 9700 was running at 8X. Well either way, I tried to change the SmartGART setting only to find that the 10.2 "Legacy" drivers don't seem to have that (and also I couldn't get into CCC at all in Safe Mode before because it saw the driver wasn't loaded...). So I removed them and jumped back to the next driver I had laying around, which was the final Omega drivers from 2007 (Catalyst 7.12 based). That version does have the SmartGART control panel tab and I was able to set it to 4X. Now everything seems to be working okay. I could probably also use PowerStrip or something to force 4X if I need a newer driver, I suppose.

I dunno how long term stability will be, but I'll try it for a bit. I'll eventually remove the overall issue and get a 9800 instead, maybe whenever I grab a Barton 3200+ 😀

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Reply 8 of 8, by swaaye

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Try out Catalyst 7.11 too. Catalyst 7.12 and beyond have changes to OpenGL and Direct3D that aren't really in the best interests of your old games. KOTOR 1/2 won't render some things (yet again) for example because they drop some old OpenGL extensions. From what I gather they overhauled the OpenGL ICD and 7.12 was its debut. D3D8 problems arise too like bump mapping in Republic Commando being broken.