VOGONS


Reply 41 of 106, by Sphere478

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Any more developments with the adapters?

Making pci exprrss cards work on old agp motherboards is an interesting concept. I know a lot of different adapter configurations have been discussed.

Do you have any thoughts as to why my radeon x600 isn’t working with an adapter in the same motherboard that a x1300 pci with the same bridge chip located on the card it’s self is working in?

Sphere's PCB projects.
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Sphere’s socket 5/7 cpu collection.
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SUCCESSFUL K6-2+ to K6-3+ Full Cache Enable Mod
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Tyan S1564S to S1564D single to dual processor conversion (also s1563 and s1562)

Reply 42 of 106, by Tetrium

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sdz wrote on 2020-09-23, 17:51:
Something like this? […]
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Something like this?

20200624_184104.resized-1024x365.png
20200624_1841042.resized-1024x365.png

Even made a bracket for the V5 😀
20200624_183901-1024x665.jpg
20200624_183924-1024x634.jpg

I designed it a couple of months ago, AGP 1.0 1x (3.3V only), 4 layer board with uninterrupted ground plane under PCI signals, properly terminated unused AGP signals, 12V PCIe power input, 3.3V/5V switching power supplies which can deliver more power than the AGP specs require, separately filtered AGP VIO, high speed level shifters, it can work in any 3.3V/5V PCI slots, 33/66MHz jumper (if the mobo supports PCI 66MHz ofc), 2 fan headers with support for 5V/12V 3pin/4pin fans and adjustable PWM.

Just wanted to say, this looks very impressive! And you mentioned you had only 1? Because it doesn't even look like a prototype but more like a finished and polished product!
I also like the separate bracket for the Voodoo 5, nice touch to detail there =)

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Reply 43 of 106, by sdz

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@Tetrium
Thanks!
I only made 1 because I only have 1 AGP V5 5500, and I'm not a fan of AGP systems.

@Sphere478
No new developments, the PCIe x4 to PCI@up to 133MHz, PCIe x4 to AGP(no sideband, we can call it PCI via AGP connector)@ up to 133MHz, and PCI to AGP adapters are all working fine, at least from my testing.
I'll upload all the files in in a month or two (I need to check if I did any mods on the actual boards, and update the files accordingly).

@Blaster
Thanks!

Reply 44 of 106, by Hazematman

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Hello @sdz! Did you ever share the files for your AGP to PCI adapter? I saw that you said you are not interested in shipping anymore, I would love to go and try to build my own, if your willing to share the design files.

Reply 45 of 106, by Sphere478

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sdz wrote on 2021-03-18, 22:21:
@Tetrium Thanks! I only made 1 because I only have 1 AGP V5 5500, and I'm not a fan of AGP systems. […]
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@Tetrium
Thanks!
I only made 1 because I only have 1 AGP V5 5500, and I'm not a fan of AGP systems.

@Sphere478
No new developments, the PCIe x4 to PCI@up to 133MHz, PCIe x4 to AGP(no sideband, we can call it PCI via AGP connector)@ up to 133MHz, and PCI to AGP adapters are all working fine, at least from my testing.
I'll upload all the files in in a month or two (I need to check if I did any mods on the actual boards, and update the files accordingly).

@Blaster
Thanks!

Will I be able to send these files to a manufacturer and get them back fully assembled or will I have to order all the parts?

Btw, I have a x1300 pci that works good on my iwill k6 all pci board, it uses a bridge chip on the card (pci-pcie) but I can’t get drivers to work in win 9x so I thought I’d buy a x600 and put it on a pci to pcie card. Since it uses the same bridge chip I was kinda expecting it to work. But it doesn’t. I’m thinking it needs a custom bios? What do you think? Any chance you’d be willing to help me figure it out? I was really hoping to get something faster than a radeon 7500 on this build.

Sphere's PCB projects.
-
Sphere’s socket 5/7 cpu collection.
-
SUCCESSFUL K6-2+ to K6-3+ Full Cache Enable Mod
-
Tyan S1564S to S1564D single to dual processor conversion (also s1563 and s1562)

Reply 46 of 106, by Tetrium

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sdz wrote on 2021-03-18, 22:21:

@Tetrium
Thanks!
I only made 1 because I only have 1 AGP V5 5500, and I'm not a fan of AGP systems.

I've been having thoughts lately of adding a list of all member projects of this kind to the Vogonswiki and if I do, yours is definitely one of those that I'm gonna be wanting to add:P

Whats missing in your collections?
My retro rigs (old topic)
Interesting Vogons threads (links to Vogonswiki)
Report spammers here!

Reply 47 of 106, by Sphere478

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Tetrium wrote on 2021-03-20, 14:16:
sdz wrote on 2021-03-18, 22:21:

@Tetrium
Thanks!
I only made 1 because I only have 1 AGP V5 5500, and I'm not a fan of AGP systems.

I've been having thoughts lately of adding a list of all member projects of this kind to the Vogonswiki and if I do, yours is definitely one of those that I'm gonna be wanting to add:P

Like a list of cool adapters and other hardware projects like orpheus and goldfinger etc?

Sphere's PCB projects.
-
Sphere’s socket 5/7 cpu collection.
-
SUCCESSFUL K6-2+ to K6-3+ Full Cache Enable Mod
-
Tyan S1564S to S1564D single to dual processor conversion (also s1563 and s1562)

Reply 48 of 106, by Tetrium

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Sphere478 wrote on 2021-03-20, 15:42:
Tetrium wrote on 2021-03-20, 14:16:
sdz wrote on 2021-03-18, 22:21:

@Tetrium
Thanks!
I only made 1 because I only have 1 AGP V5 5500, and I'm not a fan of AGP systems.

I've been having thoughts lately of adding a list of all member projects of this kind to the Vogonswiki and if I do, yours is definitely one of those that I'm gonna be wanting to add:P

Like a list of cool adapters and other hardware projects like orpheus and goldfinger etc?

Yes. Seems like a logical thing to do, but I'm aware that it can be a bit slippery and this is why I haven't actually started out on it yet (I do follow all the threads though so I can find them again more easily).

Whats missing in your collections?
My retro rigs (old topic)
Interesting Vogons threads (links to Vogonswiki)
Report spammers here!

Reply 49 of 106, by sdz

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@Hazematman I'll release everything soon.

@ Sphere478 You could send the files to a manufacturer and get the boards fully assembled, but for small qty, it will be extremely expensive. It is way cheaper to order the boards and the parts and assemble them yourself.
Regarding the x600, maybe try another PCI to PCIe adapter (with a different bridge IC).

Reply 51 of 106, by Turbine

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sdz wrote on 2021-03-24, 12:14:

@Hazematman I'll release everything soon.

@ Sphere478 You could send the files to a manufacturer and get the boards fully assembled, but for small qty, it will be extremely expensive. It is way cheaper to order the boards and the parts and assemble them yourself.
Regarding the x600, maybe try another PCI to PCIe adapter (with a different bridge IC).

I don't suppose you have a guestimate price of getting a handful made? I think there's enough of us on here who wouldn't mind buying a few.

I'm looking for something around $75usd. But the only one available is a dodgy looking one from Russia.

Reply 52 of 106, by dr.zapp

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I am very interested in this adapter- I joined just so I could comment! The best capture cards for digitizing analog video are AGP, so you have to keep an old AGP system around for this, but since the HDD are really slow on old systems, the capturing part can be a pain. Being able to run an AGP card on a modern system with SSD would be awesome!

Reply 54 of 106, by cyclone3d

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dr.zapp wrote on 2021-06-24, 17:35:

I am very interested in this adapter- I joined just so I could comment! The best capture cards for digitizing analog video are AGP, so you have to keep an old AGP system around for this, but since the HDD are really slow on old systems, the capturing part can be a pain. Being able to run an AGP card on a modern system with SSD would be awesome!

PCI SATA 1 - 150 controller coupled with an SSD is your best bet IF you want to use the old computer to do the capturing.

You can even use an IDE to SATA adapter instead of the PCI SATA adapter.

I use my newer system to do video and audio capture. You just need a good video capture card that supports the outputs of the older systems.

BTW, what exact capture cards are AGP? Are you sure they are the best for capturing analog video? And by Analog do you mean VGA or something else like S-Video or Composite?

Yamaha YMF modified setupds and drivers
Yamaha XG resource repository - updated November 27, 2018
Yamaha YMF7x4 Guide
AW744L II - YMF744 - AOpen Cobra Sound Card - Install SB-Link Header

Reply 55 of 106, by darry

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cyclone3d wrote on 2021-06-24, 19:56:
PCI SATA 1 - 150 controller coupled with an SSD is your best bet IF you want to use the old computer to do the capturing. […]
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dr.zapp wrote on 2021-06-24, 17:35:

I am very interested in this adapter- I joined just so I could comment! The best capture cards for digitizing analog video are AGP, so you have to keep an old AGP system around for this, but since the HDD are really slow on old systems, the capturing part can be a pain. Being able to run an AGP card on a modern system with SSD would be awesome!

PCI SATA 1 - 150 controller coupled with an SSD is your best bet IF you want to use the old computer to do the capturing.

You can even use an IDE to SATA adapter instead of the PCI SATA adapter.

I use my newer system to do video and audio capture. You just need a good video capture card that supports the outputs of the older systems.

BTW, what exact capture cards are AGP? Are you sure they are the best for capturing analog video? And by Analog do you mean VGA or something else like S-Video or Composite?

Modernish used pro-grade capture cards, like the Kona LHE (with KLBox) are PCI Express, work under Windows 10 x64, can capture SD video and 1080i HD video ( inputs include composite, separate luma and chroma (adaptable to s-video with a simple DIY passive adapter), component, SDI, etc) and are very practically free (less than 200$) compared to when they were new .

If referring to analogue VGA (RGBHV) capture, a used sub 100$ PCI Express Datapath E1s is pretty much among the best options ever made . Also compatible with Wondows 10 x64 .

Reply 56 of 106, by libv

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sdz: I do not want to annoy you but it has been several months. Is there any update on the adapter designs?

Not sure what software you are using for your work, eagle or kicad?

If you mark the designs as OSHW and throw them onto github, not only can people build their own, but any design updates can be fed back in and we end up with the best possible design at some point in future. And perhaps some other crazy things might be added.

I am myself musing about destroying an asmedia pci adapter, mapping out the circuitry, and taking a 4x bifurcated PCIE16 connection and feeding 4 asmedia PCI bridge chips a 1x PCIE each, which would then provide 4 pci devices with a full 66MHz bus each. Bifurcation is chipset and bios supported (i suspect that this is purely a BIOS thing) splitting of multilane pcie connections, for instance 1 PCIE 16x into 4 PCIE 4x . Bifurcation would remove the need for yet another bridge chip in the chain, and would avoid the associated latency, and would significantly improve cabling.

I am sure that the same insanity could be done with an AGP adapter. Quad (semi-)AGP anyone?

Reply 57 of 106, by kura_kura_suka_teh

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I would also like to ask for an update - either on availability of assembled boards or the design files.

This might not only be useful for old video cards, but also for old industrial equipment. I have an old (and expensive) oscilloscope that uses AGP port to connect the display and the control panel. The "video card" they're using is pretty much one-of-a-kind unobtanium board made specifically for this system. Having this kind of adapter would open the possibility to upgrade the mainboard in the oscilloscope and keep all the custom bits in their place.

Reply 58 of 106, by cyclone3d

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kura_kura_suka_teh wrote on 2021-09-13, 12:41:

I would also like to ask for an update - either on availability of assembled boards or the design files.

This might not only be useful for old video cards, but also for old industrial equipment. I have an old (and expensive) oscilloscope that uses AGP port to connect the display and the control panel. The "video card" they're using is pretty much one-of-a-kind unobtanium board made specifically for this system. Having this kind of adapter would open the possibility to upgrade the mainboard in the oscilloscope and keep all the custom bits in their place.

It would only work IF the AGP card supports the PCI interface.

There are LGA775 boards out there that have AGP.
LGA 775 Motherboards with AGP Slots

What CPU does that old system currently have?

Yamaha YMF modified setupds and drivers
Yamaha XG resource repository - updated November 27, 2018
Yamaha YMF7x4 Guide
AW744L II - YMF744 - AOpen Cobra Sound Card - Install SB-Link Header

Reply 59 of 106, by kura_kura_suka_teh

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cyclone3d wrote on 2021-09-13, 13:11:

There are LGA775 boards out there that have AGP.

Thank you, that is really useful, I'll take a look. Somehow I wasn't able to find this before.

cyclone3d wrote on 2021-09-13, 13:11:

What CPU does that old system currently have?

I can't power the unit up right now but it's some sort of Intel Celeron @ 1.7 GHz, Socket 478.

EDIT: I checked the chip on the AGP card — DS90C2501 — and unfortunately it seems it's AGP/DVO only. Thank you for the hint on the compatibility of those.