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GeForce3 woes

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First post, by quicknick

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TL-DR version: is it possible to replace the memory on a GeForce3 with 2Mx16x4 chips instead of the original 1Mx16x4 ones? Not trying to upgrade to 128MB (although I wouldn't mind 😀 ), but because I don't have others available. If not possible, what other cards are more compatible donors?

Long and windy version:
Got this Medion/MSI MS-8838 card a few days ago from the flea market:

medion ti200.jpg
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The initial state of the card wasn't nice, with many SMD parts missing and most of the big caps being a mess (bent, with legs pulled, four Sanyo WX were looking good but measured way out-of-spec so I threw them out).
The number of missing parts, and the fact that among them were some that could't be guessed (a double diode, a very small inductor) meant that I had to pay a few bucks to access a somewhat shady site that actually had the schematic. Armed with this I proceeded to fit everything that was missing (and replace what was obviously broken). Expectations were high, but here's the cold shower of the first test:

medion 1.jpg
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Not quite right, huh? A few minutes of searching and I thought I had found the culprit: a tiny 15ohm(x4) resistor network on the back of the PCB, behind one of the memory chips, was cracked. This meant some of the data pins were not connected to the bus. Problem solved...not:

medion 2.jpg
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Blue stripes gone, still having to fight against the red and pink ones... A very long troubleshooting sesion followed. Under serious magnification I checked every component, found another cracked part (a 100nF capacitor, replacing it made no difference). Also a few more resistors were lightly scratched, some having their markings rubbed off. All were in-spec though, but I replaced them nevertheless.
To no avail. After a while I noticed that the artifacts were changing by applying pressure on the memory chips, especially two out of the three that are partially covered by the heatsink (#1 and #3, counting from the bottom). The following pic is after reflowing the two chips that seemed to be 'pressure-sensitive' (more on that, later), and it's sort of a peak of what I was able to achieve:

medion 3.jpg
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Encouraged by this I reflowed the other two chips (#2 and #4), but things got worse. Haven't taken a pic, but basically now the pink vertical stripes are replaced by black, so more text is unreadable, and the corruption in graphics modes is worse.

Double and triple-checked, there aren't any solder bridges on the reflowed chips, and left no stone unturned regarding other broken passives - there aren't any.
Seemingly, the memory chips are still sensitive to applied pressure, but further testing revealed that the change in artifact intensity/pattern is caused by whatever electric interference I'm producing when touching the pads/resistor networks and other stuff on the back. Applying the same pressure through an insulator doesn't give the same effect.

At this point I'm quite sure it's a matter of defective memory, but the list of potential donor card is thin (no wonder, since I'm so hellbent on fixing my junk 😁 )
The equipped chips are EliteMT M13L64164A (1M x 16Bit x 4 Banks), and the closest I have are the ones from a dead Radeon 9600LE, Samsung K4D261638E (2M x 16Bit x 4 Banks). Could I make use of them without requiring extensive rework or it's better to forget about it? Other dead cards that I have are from the FX series (5200, 5500 and a 5600 I think), would their RAM chips be more suited?

As a bonus, here's how the home screen of Phil's DOS benchmark pack looks like:

medion dosbench.jpg
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Reply 2 of 10, by ODwilly

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Would it be possible to figure out what Geforce 3 cards used that memory configuration and flash the bios to one of those cards? And probably replace all the memory with the donor memory.

Main pc: Asus ROG 17. R9 5900HX, RTX 3070m, 16gb ddr4 3200, 1tb NVME.
Retro PC: Soyo P4S Dragon, 3gb ddr 266, 120gb Maxtor, Geforce Fx 5950 Ultra, SB Live! 5.1

Reply 3 of 10, by melbar

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I have also a Geforce 3 Ti200 - Medion MS-8838.
This has 128MB DDR ram.

Here a screenshot.

There are hynix HY5DV641622AT-4
4Mx16 DDR SDRAM's (internal 4 bank operations - single pulsed /RAS)

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Last edited by melbar on 2021-05-08, 09:00. Edited 1 time in total.

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Reply 4 of 10, by quicknick

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Thank you for the suggestions.

@melbar - can you please upload some photos of the back of the board so I can check if there are differences in (un)populated SMDs between the 64M and 128M versions?

Reply 5 of 10, by melbar

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Sorry, a mistake by my side. Have not used this PC for several week's.
It has also 64 MByte video ram only.

I will post a photo of the back layout next.

#1 K6-2/500, #2 Athlon1200, #3 Celeron1000A, #4 A64-3700, #5 P4HT-3200, #6 P4-2800, #7 Am486DX2-66

Reply 6 of 10, by melbar

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Back of medion (ms-8838)

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#1 K6-2/500, #2 Athlon1200, #3 Celeron1000A, #4 A64-3700, #5 P4HT-3200, #6 P4-2800, #7 Am486DX2-66

Reply 7 of 10, by quicknick

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melbar wrote on 2021-05-08, 09:05:

Sorry, a mistake by my side. Have not used this PC for several week's.
It has also 64 MByte video ram only.

No worries 😀
Thank you for the pics, I already spotted something different: all the resistor networks and half of the discrete resistors are 0 ohm on your board instead of 15 ohm. I think it's related to different brand of RAM chips.

Reply 10 of 10, by quicknick

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@candle_86, @2Mourty - thanks, but I'll pass. Already have a hell of a fight on my hands with the above-mentioned GF3, another one from Abit and a FX5900XT, and so far the artifacts are winning 😁

Seeing there are differences in passive components between different memory brands, I'll attempt swapping the chips if/when I'll have the exact replacements.